Is Ultimate Marvel worth a read for a guy like me who has very basic knowledge of Marvel? I'm aware of Ultimatum and Ultimates 3 being awful (but come on 616 didn't always publish the best stuff) but I hear everything else was decent, especially Spider-Man. I know The Ultimate Verse is ending, and Ultimate End is going on. Does it feel like an ending so far? I like the idea of being able to read Ultimate Universe and it having an actual ending, doubt they are bringing any one else with Miles to 616.
>>77732146
Ultimate Spider-Man was the only good thing really. Even it has some bad low points though. Just read that and maybe the first Ultimates it was decent at best.
>>77732146
You know, the picture in the OP is very ironic
Especially with the title "ultimate comic books"
>>77732199
Yeah I read first Ultimates forever ago, I remember thinking it was alright...but that's it? Fantastic Four and X-Men aren't good? I understand there are a lot of changes people weren't fond of but like I said very basic knowledge of Marvel. So Everything else isn't even good as just comics?
>>77732146
Read Millar's Ultimates and maybe Aaron's Captain America. The rest is not worth it for a casual.
>>77732226
>Fantastic Four
UFF is good up until the mid 30's or #53
depending on your preference
Any more opinions?
>>77732146
Ultimate Doomsday is garbage, but the rest of this list is pretty decent and Ultimates 1 and 2 are especially great.
>>77732410
Also, skip Ultimate Fantastic Four Requiem, like Doomsday it is just there for Evil Reed wank
>>77732401
This is helping me so far
>>77732146
No.
>>77732477
>Salem's Seven
>Readable
Looks good but that sticks out like a sore thumb
>>77732477
I liked Brian K Vaughns run on Ultimate X-men.
>>77732477
>>77732491
Thanks I'll just pull the trigger and try Ultimate Verse out. I think I'll probably like it, just going to read it as intended...a really DIFFERENT Marvel.
>>77732477
>mfw I made this reading order
That said, I remember the thread when the guy made these images, and his opinions are pretty shit
>>77732410
>no BKV UXM
Shit rec list is shitty
>>77732850
I think it's great. It's how I got into comics several years ago with only a passing knowledge of Marvel.
Ultimate gets shit on a lot retroactively, but it used to be the biggest thing around. Also, the Ultimatum hate is way overblown, and there are some great stories that come after it, despite the fact that you'll hear people say "everything went to shit at Ultimatum."
So here's my general opinion:
>Ultimate Spider-man
GOAT level stuff. In the first 133 issues, there are only a few duds (in the 70s-90s), but everything else is AT LEAST good, if not great. The 25 issues after Ultimatum are fantastic.
The Miles Morales stuff is a little less than stellar. First 12 issues are great, then a boring event, then a great arc about Roxxon. Everything after that was pretty shit, because Bendis forgot how to write.
>Ultimates
1 and 2 are GOAT. 3 is pretty damn weak (though I've come to appreciate some parts of it in retrospect). New Ultimates is a drag. Hickman takes over after that for 9 GOAT issues, then Humphries lets all the air out of the tires for a year. Fialkov saved things with his final arc and somehow stuck the landing.
All-New Ultimates is really just a Spider-man team-up, and it is just okay.
>Ultimate X-Men
First 65 issues are great. Millar's run is one of his more solid, least edgy books. Bendis did two arcs, one which was okay and one which was fantastic. Then Vaughan took over for my favorite X-run of all time. Kirkman's run is incredibly hit or miss. The Absolute Power arc (94-97) is shit, but the Ultimatum arc is surprisingly good.
After that, it was basically on hiatus except for a 5-issue Loeb mini that was mediocre. Nick Spencer's run was good but effectively unfinished, Brian Wood's run is outstanding.
>Continued below.
>>77733360
Continued:
>Ultimate Fantastic Four
First 20 issues are perfection. Millar's 12-issue run is pretty good, despite the Land art. Carey's run ranges from awesome (Silver Surfer, God War) to absolute shit (Ghosts, Salem's Seven). The final arc, an Ultimatum tie-in by Joe Pokaski, was whatever.
Fialkov's UFF finale at the end of the UU was great but SHIT art killed it.
>Minis
Galactus Trilogy: GOAT
And honestly, most of the minis are pretty good. Even things like the Doomsday trilogy, which suffers from a lot of Bendis's bad habits, are pretty decent.
If you want to know anything else, I clearly know far to much about this subject, as I just wrote all that off the top of my head.
And yes, I use the word GOAT a lot. Because I genuinely think a lot of these books are GOAT.
>>77732410
>Ultimate X4
>Including all of UFF but not BKV X-Men
>Stopping UXM at 25 and not at least including all of Millar's run
>Ultimate Doomsday
>Not at least including Ultimate Avengers 1
>No Hickman Ultimates
The last point I'll forgive because this image was probably made before then. But holy shit, there are some bad oversights.
Also:
>Grouping Ultimates Annual #1 with first Ultimates and not Ultimates 2
Way to trigger my autism
>>77733444
>Including all of UFF
It actually leaves out the last two arcs
Which were complete shit
>>77733360
>appreciate some parts of it in retrospect
How is that possible? That book was complete garbage.
>>77733159
I'm the guy who make the image. I wanted to put much more purple and pink, but you guys kept telling me to raise everything to blue.
I don't even like most of UXM and UFF!
But yes, I like Millar.
>>77733506
Yes, but it includes all of Carey's run and none of Vaughan's. Objectively shit.
>>77733606
It was, but I like some of what Loeb was trying to achieve. And less so with that book itself but with the status quo in general.
I've found when you look at Ultimates 3 as an "era" it improves (albeit not to a huge extent). Take it like this:
>Ultimates Saga (4page story)
>Ultimate Cap Annual (best thing Loeb wrote for UU)
>Ultimate Human
>Ultimates 3
It's still a shit book, but I get that he was trying to distance himself from Millar, and the other books help raise it up a bit.
>>77734682
I mean, I get it - opinions and all that. But Salem's Seven is just so shit.
>>77735293
It does even more if you include New Ultimates and Ultimate X in as well. Loeb clearly had a story he wanted to tell and was cut off. Not that it would have been good, but his stories did get progressively better. Shit turned to crap.
>>77735499
Very true. The biggest problem with Loeb's run, beyond the low quality, was the delay between books. Ultimates 3 took a long time to come out, and New Ultimates took fucking forever. New Ultimates and Ultimate X were originally supposed to alternate months starting at the beginning of 2010 and it took until like May/June 2011 for all 10 issues to finally come out.
Ultimate X was originally described as "the first arc" but it ended up as just an origin story for nothing.
New Ultimates was meant to follow up the Thor stuff that he started in Ultimates 3. It finally revealed Valkyrie's powers, for instance. But it was a total of 3+ years before the whole story got told. And at that point, it was tough to still care about Valkyrie's story.
Ending with Thor's son in Valhalla was great though.
>>77732146
Just read the entire ultimate spider-man run and ignore everything else.
>>77736042
more or less
>>77735727
This. Ultimate X was practically never followed
>>77735727
>>77737248
Disbanded in Ultimate Hawkeye. What's worse is it was stated that Ultimate X was never a team by Loeb and then Hickman made them a team.
>>77738359
I don't know why that's a bad thing. They weren't a team, then they became one. That's kind of how plot progression goes.
>>77738673
Eh. Ultimate X kind of made it seem more like an idea that would grow and not be a part of SHIELD and then they were closely involved with SHIELD being sent out on missions. I would have much rather seen the other.
>>77733444
>Not at least including Ultimate Avengers 1
>No Hickman Ultimates
Both shit.
What was up with that Ultimate Tony Stark blue skin shit and brain tissue everywhere crap? They just forgot about it later and Tony just morphed into RDJ instead.
>>77738855
Okay, opinions are opinions. But if you like Millar's Ultimates, I don't see how you can possible call Hickman's shit.
>>77738931
They didn't forget it, they retconned it, because it already didn't fit with the preestablished character. Those Orson Scott Card minis didn't come out until years after Ultimates.
>morphed into RDJ
Are you high? RDJ was modeled after Ultimate Tony. Millar/Ellis Tony was 2001-2007, Iron Man didn't come out until 2008.
>>77732528
It was nice, not great, but readable.
I think that UXM could have been good if Ultimatum had a shorter kill list.
>>77732146
Ultimates is good
Ultimate Spider-Man is good
Ultimate Fantastic Four is good
the rest is ass
>>77740779
Ultimatum had nothing to do with Vaughan's X-Men.
There were NINETY SEVEN issues of Ultimate X-Men that came out before Ultimatum. If you don't like it? Fine. But don't act like Ultimatum is the reason for anything. Millar's run is complete -- unaffected by Ultimatum. Bendis's run is complete -- unaffected by Ultimatum. Even Kirkman's run is complete -- unaffected by Ultimatum. You can read each of those as their own run without ever knowing the characters were later killed off.
I really feel like half the people who mention "Ultimatum" in a complaint never actually read anything in the UU. They just know that it killed a bunch of characters and it was written by Loeb (who was the cool creator to hate from 2009-2012, until Bendis took his spot). Stop talking out of your ass.
>>77740800
>confirmed for never reading any of Ultimate X-Men
>confirmed for never reading Ultimate Galactus Trilogy
