http://www.avclub.com/article/exclusive-dc-preview-genevieve-valentine-ends-her--228130
>>77349627
Bye to the best Catwoman run we'll ever get
>>77349632
I should mention that this is the last issue that Valentine will be writing. After this arc, Frank Tieri is taking over.
>>77349643
>>77349648
>>77349643
It was good while it lasted but he couldn't stay on forever.
>>77349658
>>77349627
Why the hell do people like Catwoman? That makes no sense whatsoever.
>>77349640
That's a bit like saying goodbye to the best punch to the face you'll ever get.
>>77349643
I am not looking forward to the creative shift on this one at all.
>>77349667
And that's it until Wednesday.
>>77349671
Why do you show up in every Catwoman thread saying the same shit every time?
>>77349701
It's the same faggot who hates on Grayson just because he's a spy, just the worst. Ignore him. It's probably the same guy who is o sensed with Lobdell, he has terrible taste and is obsessed with the ideas of characters and what they're 'supposed to be' in his autistic brain
I hope Valentine uses some of her Catwoman plots and characters in B&R Eternal. I'd love to see Eiko become more relevant in other Batbooks.
>>77349701
Because I want a serious answer to the question, but all the Catwoman-fags are surprisingly defensive little bitches who refuse to/are unable to elaborate on why they like this character so much.
So if you wouldn't mind....
>>77349682
I hope she kills everyone and Spoiler watches or runs off.
Superheros losing their nerve is my fetish
>>77349640
I'd say Brubaker's run might still be better, but it's close.
>>77349648
My problem with this climax is that it's setting up for a kind of Godfather Baptism scene, but we all know the heads won't die because it's comics and you can't fuck up the status quo that much.
>>77349743
Not the guy that answered you, but what's even your question? Why do people like Catwoman? Is that it, really?
She's a good, multi-layered character that's been around for about 75 years and Valentine's written good comics recently. That really difficult to understand?
>>77349980
>because it's comics and you can't fuck up the status quo that much.
Let's recount the shit DC writers pulled so far. I believe we still have a dead Penguin somewhere.
>>77349980
Story>continuity :^)
>>77350046
Snyder said that Penguin apparently didn't die and was just severely injured, but Capullo made the scene more violent than he intended. That's why he was still kicking around in Catwoman comics after that.
>>77349993
>Catwoman
>a good, multi-layered character
See, this right here is the problem. That's a total contradiction, which leads one to believe the Catwoman fanbase is either ironic in nature, or you're all in denial.
She's a crazy cat lady who steals things because she's a kleptomaniac. DEEP.
>>77350123
>She's a crazy cat lady who steals things because she's a kleptomaniac.
So you've just not been reading Valentine's entire run? Hell, even Brubaker's run in the early 2000s tackled more aspects of her character and motivation.
>>77350136
>So you've just not been reading Valentine's entire run?
Why would I do that? I don't really enjoy hurting myself.
>Hell, even Brubaker's run in the early 2000s tackled more aspects of her character and motivation.
What character? What motivations? These are things you are refusing to explain.
>>77350167
Explaining things to a blockhead is a waste of that anon's time though. If you bothered to read the books you would understand you're wrong.
>>77350167
http://www.comicvine.com/catwoman/4005-1698/
here, enjoy
>>77350167
Wow. So either this is really bad shitposting or you just don't get anything at all. Either way, there's no helping you, man.
>HURR CATWOMAN FAGS BLAH BLAH BLAH
>>77350197
See? Every goddamned time, supposed Catwoman fans outright refuse to explain why she's supposedly so great. You people are a terrible fanbase, and I'm glad you're all butthurt over the recent change in creative teams. You deserve such misery.
>AV Club
Literally worse than tumblr
>>77349640
>>77349671
>>77349701
Because every school has a short bus. And this run is shit and you are dumb if you say otherwise.
>>77350167
>Why would I do that? I don't really enjoy hurting myself.
Well for one you can't really argue with a good stance if you haven't read the work you're criticizing.
>What character? What motivations?
Just off the top of my head, in Brubaker's run Selina feels immense guilt over the money and affluence she's come into compared to the people that she left behind in the slums of Gotham. Her primary arc revolve around connecting with her "family" (mainly people like Holly) and becoming a guardian for the people who get overlooked and forgotten by people like batman or Gordon who are concerned with "bigger" problems.
In Valentine's run, the theme of family is brought up again, but this time from the angle of being put in charge of the people she hated. Because of her idealism for the little guy, so struggles with the conflict of doing right by her blood and doing what she thinks is right for Gotham and what might be true to herself.
But by all means, base your entire opinion of the character on the comics that came out 40 years ago.
>>77349726
No, people who are night wing fans hate Grayson too. This moron hates Catwoman as a character. I can loathe Grayson and Catwoman's current directions and their anti-superhero faggy fan base and still love what they were.
>>77350269
>>77350167
>engaging with that shitposter
Don't.
this is why reddit is better
Valentine's run is done huh? That's a shame. Well-written Catwoman is one of my favorite things to read. At least I can finally catch up now, I've been holding off reading since issue 41 in order to read the rest at once.
It's too bad they're replacing Valentine with a hack like Tieri. I wonder why they didn't have her do more, do they want to put her on something else? Does she not want to do more? Were the numbers too bad?
Oh well, at least I'll still have Grayson, Academy, JL3k1 and Son of Batman to look forward to every month.
>>77349627
YES!
>>77349980
The heads aren't important enough characters and most Batman stories are about crazies and super powered villains, not crime stuff(and most readers prefer that way)
>>77350319
Her storyline is just done. She's going to be doing Batman & Robin Eternal 7 & 8. Hopefully she has ideas for other things and gets placed on a new book for another run.
>>77350269
>Just off the top of my head, in Brubaker's run Selina feels immense guilt over the money and affluence she's come into compared to the people that she left behind in the slums of Gotham. Her primary arc revolve around connecting with her "family" (mainly people like Holly) and becoming a guardian for the people who get overlooked and forgotten by people like batman or Gordon who are concerned with "bigger" problems.
That sounds like a bad Spike Lee movie but with white people.
>In Valentine's run, the theme of family is brought up again, but this time from the angle of being put in charge of the people she hated. Because of her idealism for the little guy, so struggles with the conflict of doing right by her blood and doing what she thinks is right for Gotham and what might be true to herself.
That's a total ripoff of the time Daredevil became leader of The Hand.
>>77349726
Dick Grayson is a garbage character who only serves to prove how comics are a relic of a medium that should've been retired before all you nerds forever tainted it.
>>77350411
Ok, tell us a character that you do like.
>>77350297
YOU CAN'T STOP MEI CAN'T STOP ME
>>77350297
>not having an unquenchable desire to respond to shitposters
Why even come to 4chan?
>>77350435
Why?
>>77350552
So that we can see a contrast between what you consider to be a good character and what is a shit character.
>>77350541
fucking spectacular
>>77350597
What I consider a good character has no bearing on this discussion. The issue is that you claim that Catwoman is a good character, but have so far failed to make any kind of concrete argument.
>>77350703
>anon provides specific themes, with specific examples to go with them
>failed to make any kind of concrete argument
Do you even understand what argumentation is?
Also, what you consider a good character has everything to do with the discussion, since you're arguing that Catwoman is not a good character - which indicates that there's (hopefully) some measure or standard you're putting her up to that she falls short of. Though that assumes you're not just vomiting random nonsense onto a keyboard.
>>77350703
It's possible to make character sound bad if your response to any description of their traits or arcs is "that's dumb," which is essentially what you've done. However if I'm wrong and there's a character that you think can't be so easily dismissed then I'd love to hear it.
>>77350703
So confirmed sorry shitposter then.
>>77350737
Those specific themes and examples mean nothing since you failed to provide any reasons why they should be considered entertaining. So she wants to get in touch with the less fortunate. Why should a hypothetical reader care? What about Selina Kyle is there that endears her to the audience enough they should be invested in her struggles?
>>77350756
>However if I'm wrong and there's a character that you think can't be so easily dismissed then I'd love to hear it.
The truth is there isn't. If I provide an example, you'll just contradict me out of principle. So just tell me why you like Catwoman already.
>>77350852
>If I provide an example, you'll just contradict me out of principle.
So basically what you're doing here despite the fact that people have engaged you in a civil manner and provided you exactly what your asking for. Like I said above, there really is no helping you, man.
>>77350935
>4chan
>civil
As loathe as I am to trot out tired ass memes... Where do you think you are? Any appearance of civility is a trap.
>>77350852
>since you failed to provide any reasons why they should be considered entertaining.
See now you're moving the goalposts. Before you wanted proof that she was anything more than just a klepto who stole things and lusted after batdick. We did that, and now I think you're asking for objective proof that something is subjectively good? You've literally made it impossible to argue.
>>77350852
That sounds like backpeddling.
>>77351012
>"Why do you like this character?"
>impossible to argue
Fuckity shitting hell, nigga. Just tell me why you like Catwoman. Goddamn.
>>77351067
You're really hanging on by a string now, you know that?
>>77351067
If you arent going to read it, fuck off.
>>77351120
No, you are. You seriously can't just tell someone why you like something? I can't tell if that's pathetic or indicative of some form of mental disorder.
>>77351123
>literally unable to explain why you like a character
>"Hurr durr, go read it, fag!"
Uh huh. Keep digging that whole, pal.
I just want to talk about comics but I guess that's too much to ask.
>>77351191
Oh, get a box of tissues and cry more, you little bitch. I try to talk about comics all the time on this shitheap of a board and all I get is whiny nerds bitching about how girls and non-whites dare to exist. It's 4chan, deal with it.
>>77351067
I like Catwoman becasue she has a fun and feisty personality that usually works well off of other Bat-related characters. I have not read the current run however.
>>77351250
See, was that so hard? Fun-loving and feisty, makes sense.
>I have not read the current run however.
So maybe it's only the Valentine-fags who are insular cunts?
>>77351172
Ok, since I made the last post that disproved your claim that Catwoman only steals stuff and has no other traits, I guess I'll also respond to this new, entirely different claim that no one can explain their opinion as to why they like her (when written well. I think most would agree that usually she's in a shit comic.)
The reason I personally like Catwoman as a character, specifically in the context of the Bat-universe, is that she acts as a twisted mirror on Batman's motivations and character. This can be said for a lot of his rogue's, but with Catwoman (post Brubaker) she has the same (or similar) moral convictions, but instead of her catalyst being a murderer when she was 8, it's her own actions. You can read about this more in depth in Brubaker's run (you won't, I know) but essentially she recalled growing up an orphan and realized that by keeping everything for herself she was harming those in the exact same situation that she was in. Over the course of the run she becomes a modern Robin Hood and protector of the downtrodden, which is entertaining in and of itself, but especially so when we see how it conflicts with the billionaire using an arsenal to almost keep the status quo.
I enjoy Valentine's run because she's completely out of her element. The "rules" of being a Robin Hood aren't the same as when you're fixing things from the inside. Not only does this new situation give us more of an insight into what would make someone who likes to go her own way would do given an opportunity they're not prepared for, but it also lets us get a look into the crime families of Gotham, which I think is always fun.
Is that concrete enough?
>>77351244
Pot calling the kettle black. Seek help.
>>77351296
She's still feisty in the Valentine run
I like that about her
>>77350269
>>77351250
>>77351442
>>77351456
There, you got your answers. Now can you stop shitting up every Catwoman thread?
>>77351442
>I like her because she's like Batman, but different!
So you only like her in terms of how she reminds you of your husbando. Not actually for anything unique to her. Great. More evidence for the "Valentine-fags specifically are shit, not Catwoman fans in general" theory.
Also, I never claimed that she had no other traits. I made a broad generalization that she steals due to kleptomania and spinsterism.
who is this asian
where is selina
>>77351560
So why do you care if you arent going to read it anyway you assmad faggot
>>77351630
I was curious. Not allowed to be curious?
>>77351560
I told you why I liked her in the context of the larger Bat-universe, yes (I don't see why that's not something that you would want in a character, but w/e), but if you kept reading I went on to explain why I like her in the context of her own stories as well.
>>77351749
Well if you are curious just read the fucking book and fuck off you buttblasted nightwingfag
>>77351749
There's a difference between curious and constantly showing up in every thread telling everyone that the character is shit.
>>77351776
>nightwingfag
Ew. Dick Grayson is a garbage character who belongs in the fucking trash.
>>77351791
Well if you had just answered my question the first time there wouldn't have been any need for all this arguing. You don't gotta be so rude.
>>77351749
You stopped being curious like two dozen threads ago
>>77351846
>Confirmed for not reading comics
>>77351874
>Confirmed for not reading comics you have no interest in
Fitfy.
>>77351771
>(I don't see why that's not something that you would want in a character, but w/e)
A good character should be able to stand on their own.
>>77351935
>A good character should be able to stand on their own.
And she does. Again, read the whole post instead of just a couple lines. The fact that she fits in well into her setting is simply one of the aspects that I like about her. She is a Gotham character after all, it would be like describing why you like a Robin while completely ignoring their history and relationship with Bruce. They could very well be a great character but that is an important part of them. Hell, Valentine's run is probably the best series she's gotten in 10 years and Bruce has shown up, what, once?
>>77351997
A good character should never be defined by how they exist in relation to other characters. That's bad writing.
>>77352157
>character interactions are never a part of characterization
Are you retarded? Also stop ignoring the rest of what I say, she's defined plenty by her solo aspects which I've listed multiple times.
>>77352221
That's not what I said at all, dipshit.
>Also stop ignoring the rest of what I say, she's defined plenty by her solo aspects which I've listed multiple times.
No you haven't. What are these solo aspects? The only one you've mentioned is that she somehow gives a shit about gutter trash. Woopdee shit, is that it?
>>77351935
>dont like what i dont like
>>77352266
>The only one you've mentioned is that she somehow gives a shit about gutter trash
I guess her internal conflict about moral obligations to where she came from just doesn't count because you don't like it? Alright. There's also the aspects in Brubaker's run about how she sees herself (or at least wants to see herself) as a good guy but can't because of her long history of crime and manipulation, and then in Valentine's run there's the angle of her being a fish out of water in a world she has always fought against, but refuses to leave because she thinks that it could be her chance to change things. Her bull-headedness and idealism is put up against people who have been in the game for years and how she learns to adapt is really compelling.
Look at the bright side, when Catwoman becomes garbage again next month there will be no reason to argue with the shitposter.
I really wish this series got more love than it did.
