One of my friends said that Goku can not only beat Superman, but he's faster then the Flash.
I don't even..
>>64073588
Goku can teleport... So yes, he is faster.
Both of you are fucking retarded
you more so for believing a image and not actually reading comics, also for making such fucking stupid threads
>>64073771
Flash can move fast enough to go back in time.
>>64073771
I'm pretty sure he's beaten people who have teleported before. He's faster then time.
>>64073828
Too lazy to find the pages, but Wally did indeed outrun someone who used a technique similar to Goku's teleport. Which is supposed to be, y'know, instantaneous.
>>64073886
eh, instant transmission is a misnomer. he described it as transforming into light and moving at lightspeed
then again he used it to cross interstellar distances (and even go to a place in the afterlife) so maybe it IS instantaneous. If it's lightspeed he's way slower than flash, but flash going beyond lightspeed is bullshit of the highest caliber
>>64075609
At least going beyond the speed of light got sort-of an explanation with the Multiversity map.
>>64073588
Everyone just lets the flash think he's doing something. Actually he just as a super tolerance to inertia. Superman uses the flash's body like a marionette, but nobody can ever see it because he's too fast.
>>64073588
But Goku has been murdered by attacks that Superman would brush off easily.
Also the Gokus energy attacks are powered by Ki and are said in the show and Manga to be natural energy and not Magic.
>>64075609
toriyama being the word of god said instantaneous movement is instant, it takes no time, he is simply there as though he was there the entire time
its droopy tier hax
Its space warping
for the benfit of the viewer he turns into streaks and whizzes away but the first time he busted it out on cell there was none of that, he was at one moment standing in front of cell and was then to the side of him as though he was always there
>>64075648
care to elaborate?
>>64075705
My autism is going to show by here we go
Doomsday beat superman into what we can safely call a living death via a coma.
Goku could destroy the planet if he handled one of his attacks wrong, and that was him at the start of Z. Goku has this fight six ways from Sunday.
>>64075874
>Doomsday beat superman into what we can safely call a living death
Hello Ken Shamrock
Also Sun Dipped Superman
>>64075874
That's like saying rock beat scissors, so rock must beat paper.
>>64075922
I'm missing the ken shamrock reference. Wasn't he a wrestler?
>>64073771
nu52 Superman is faster than teleportation.
>>64075973
>>64075997
>>64075866
It's explained that there is a "Speed-Force Wall," (Known as the Speed of light to germ-worlders), which stops all matter from moving above a certain speed. The Speed Force allows it's champions, the speedsters, to go beyond it.
>>64075933
> that's like saying rock beats scissors, so rock must beat paper.
I think of it more like
> rock beats scissors! but the nuclear warhead doesn't give a shit.
>>64075961
And an MMA fighter. He threatened to beat one of his opponents into "a living death" and is one of the most hilarious things of all time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDgLWGJ0-8o
>>64075973
it comes down to this
when superman fights he is fighting at a speed your average joe can perceive as a blur and when goku fights hes doing so at a speed that highly trained top tier galactic warriors can't even see him
>>64076017
And Flash is faster than Superman.
I thought only DBZ fans with inferiority complexes gave a shit about this
DBZ is stupid as fuck, but *attosecond*, really? Nice line, writer, now explain how anyone could conceivably beat flash ever
>>64075723
toriyama is dumb as hell lmao
>>64076049
Wow. Lol I never knew he did mma
I said living death coma because the story said he had to regenerate. What a turn of phrase though.
>>64076097
By having plot armor.
>>64075723
He still needs time to think where he wants to teleport.
>>64076152
He started out in MMA in Japan and then fought in the UFC when that got started. Guy was a legit Catch Wrestler.
>>64076160
Well I mean, Wally is pretty scrub tier when it comes to flash powers. Barry is the only invincible Flash.
>>64073588
Please tell me that Flash isn't really that over powered, is he?
He literally taps into the very properties that govern all movement in the universe. If Goku can transmit somewhere instaneously, the time it takes him to get there is 0. Flash then can get there taking -1 units of time.
>>64075874
At the start of Z goku probably wasn't strong enough to destroy the planet. He probably wasn't strong enough to do that until Late Frieza Saga.
>>64076226
It's not like he's capable of constantly moving at that speed. If a car's max speed is 160 MPH it can't maintain that speed for long and is difficult to attain.
>>64076160
Sometimes it seems Deathstroke and Batman are conduits of the Job Force.
It's not just that they beat someone, it's that it's reiterated they're either peak or slightly enhanced normal humans but beat super-someones.
Often without trying.
It's this shit. This shit.
>>64076253
He was able to beat Nappa and Vegeta who destroyed a planet in one episode. I think that was filler though.
>>64076206
Wally is the fastest though.
>moving faster than light
>seeing where you're going
Explain this shit
>>64076302
Vegeta Killed Nappa. Goku Lost to Vegeta. The only reason Vegeta lost in the end was because Krilling, Gohan, and Yajirobe were there assisting him.
But yeah, I don't count non-canon episodes.
>>64076253
Not him, but Roshi destroyed the moon early on in Dragonball
It wouldn't be too far of a stretch to assume Goku could destroy a planet at the start on Z.
>>64076326
Speed Force speed lends and accelerates photons moving towards him.
Alternatively he doesn't use light to perceive things.
>>64076253
Autism activate!
King Kai said that if he mishandled the spirt bomb technique it could destroy the planet, therefore it had to be used as a last resort aka deus ex machina.
>>64075874
>Doomsday beat superman into what we can safely call a living death via a coma
No, after Supes died killing Doomsday, he was legitimately dead. His revival was a lot more involved. Pa Kent had to retrieve his soul.
>>64076304
And also one of the dumbest.
>>64076426
I don't remember the soul bit, but I wasn't a regular superman reader, mainly there for steel and eradicator
>>64076267
But being able to get to that speed at all still seems really over powered.
>>64076391
The spirit bomb isn't goku's own strength though. He personally isn't strong enough to destroy the world. He knows a technique that can. All the power of the Spirit Bomb is borrowed. It hardly uses his own strength at all.
>>64076569
see
>>64076364
Keep in mind Roshi destroyed the moon with his own strength
>>64076569
Then take this post as proof. If the turtle hermit Pervy sage could shoot the moon out of the sky the Gorky could definitely level the planet.
>>64076364
>>64076618
Ty anon you beat me by a minute. But I have to go to bed, work in the morning. Goodnight all
>>64076364
>>64076618
The moon is a whopping 4x smaller than the earth. It took Goku up till he was about 15 to get stronger than Roshi. Even then, this is mostly just based on assumption.
>>64076744
You're right it is assumption, but considering Goku beat King Picollo (the person that very easily kills Roshi) as well as his child (whom was stronger still) I don't think it's too far of a stretch to assume Goku is strong enough to destroy the planet at the start of Z.
>>64076885
Perhaps, but besides that point, is this argument implying superman hasn't been able to destroy the planet for...forever? i mean, it can be equally assumed that supes has the destructive power that Destroying the planet would be a piece of cake.
>>64073771
Teleportation isn't speed to begin with.
Ignoring the fact that Barry was just joking around in the imagine, and he's also the second slowest Flash -- Goku isn't faster than ANY Flash, except Jay.
>>64077413
Well as of now the only concrete evidence we have of his best shit are top speed and top strength
We haven't seen him blow anything up that's bigger than a (natural) a mountain or (mechanical) an aircraft carrier
>>64076426
Birthing Matrix and the Eradicator saved Clark.
Either way, it's never been made clear if he was truly dead.
>>64077457
I'm sure Superman's beaten people who have though.
![Kent_confronts_Superman[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/efutaqs.jpg "Kent_confronts_Superman[1].jpg")
>>64077515
Pa Kent literally convinced him that he was too stronk to be dead though.OR WAS IT A DREAM?
>>64077543
This image 100% supports what I just posted.
He's not actually dead. He's in a comatose state. The Eradicator identified Clark's body because it was still alive and full of energy. That's why he took him, put him in the matrix and leeched off him.
>>64077521
The only planet buster he's fought is Darkseid, and he needed help to hold the guy back. Darkseid oneshotted him when they first tussled. I know their intro story is widely considered a shitty story, but canon is canon.
He's since fought Helspont, who he compared to Darkseid, and Mongul, who he compared to Weak Darkseid, but Mongul's planet busting is aided by his ship-planet and Helspont kicked Supes' ass twice, Supes came away with nothing to show for it.
Post-Crisis Supes has come out on top of planet busters, Nu52 Supes has only beaten one, and it was with a magic sword.
>>64073771
His teleport has a limitations though, first you have to know the place you're teleporting to or already had been there, can't remember exactly. Then you have to think that focusing his ki or something and bringing his fingers to his forehead also takes time.
Goku would only win a race in very specific scenarios.
>>64073588
those races were for charity
>>64077622
Well you got me there. Honestly I don't know much about DC comics in general.
>>64077543
>You--You're Kryptonian
Thinking about it; what the FUCK does that have to do with anything?
They're all dead, he says as much.
Shit if there's anyone more familiar with death than anything else it's an extinct species.
Clark is one of the last for a reason, that life shit didn't work out too well for them back on Krypton.
>>64077413
The only point I was arguing was whether or not Goku was capable to destroy a planet at the start of Z, nothing more.
>>64077714
Well, there's been two reboots. It's hard to keep track of what's "true".
Like this is the biggest guy Superman's beaten on his own as of the new timeline. A planet killer, but no multiversal threat.
>>64073771
Flash has beaten instantaneous teleportation.
>>64077904
Wally has. Barry doesn't have shit aside from something he made up about attoseconds.
They all lose to Moonface though
>>64076271
And then Deathstoke manages to beat the shit out of Batman too. That's his power.
>>64077965
What version of Dr dooms armor is that
>>64078024
Let's get something straight here.
In a fight, Superman wins.
In a rap battle, Goku wins.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MW9Nrg_kZU
>>64073588
No he didn't OP.
That would imply you actually have friends.
>faster than time
What? Shut up DC, that doesn't even make sense.
>>64076097
>Nice line, writer, now explain how anyone could conceivably beat flash ever
It's easy, you create a character who's ability is literally "Always faster than The Flash, under any and all circumstances"
Or you make a god-like being who's the living personification of the speed force. Like, the speed force given physical form and sentience.
>>64077913
>>64077904
To clarify. Wally did this with amp's from everyone on Earth combined with a dimension full of radiowave creatures. Teleportation still isn't really speed though. His physical movement is far greater than Goku's.
Regardless, he still ran across the universe in less than a week. He outran the big bang, big crunch, Krypton's explosion, etc.
The Human Race was basically just speed feat after speed feat across the universe.
>>64076097
>DBZ is stupid as fuck, but *attosecond*, really? Nice line, writer, now explain how anyone could conceivably beat flash ever
By having him say, literally seconds later, "Lol just kidding Superman I can't actually think that fast"
>>64073588
Considering Goku can become a god now. He can beat everyone, but maybe not Superman.
>>64079886
Do you even Hypercrisis?
>>64079886
Time is light speed. Read this book.
>>64079886
The Speed Force controls movement, including the flow of time.
Flash's don't just run fast.
It makes sense, because they can move faster than time. He ran from the moon to Earth in less than planck time.
>>64075705
As Akira pointed out if the fight keeps dragging out a sayian is going to get to his opponent's level. In his interview with battle of the gods he said Goku would have reached Bills level if the fight lasted longer.
>>64080034
That's not even how Saiyans work.
They only become more powerful after they've recovered from a near death/considerable loss.
>>64080065
How do you kill la chupacabra?
>>64073588
I've had faggots saying the following
>Ganon can take hits from Galactus
>Link is a casual multi-planet buster and also possible galaxy buster
>Broly is faster than Superman and Flash
>Link swings FTL you have to swing FTL to touch the "light based" magic projectiles Ganon shot at him. (the faggot even admitted the projectile wasn't light speed but still says it counts)
>Captain America > Hulk because of one comic where he beat Hulk.
>Actually thinking Broly is a galaxy buster.
>The Twins from Crash Twinsanity are overpowered reality warpers.
>The link fag used to imply Link = beyond omnipotent because Demise beat Hylia.
I have seen some shit.
>>64080017
Speed is a function of spacial distance over time though. Time is a dimension. Saying "faster than time" is like saying "faster than up."
Also, we're always traveling at the same speed through spacetime. Technically no one is faster than anyone else.
>>64076097
It fucking says right there he can PERCEIVE an event that lasts an attosecond. Like you can perceive a single frame in a movie being different but that doesn't mean you fully see every bit of it. Though this image is misleading as fucking hell anyway
Besides, what does that even affect? Superman can hear people whispering on other fucking planets, does this mean he can't be beat?
>>64077457
Does that really matter when evidence shows that Superman is trillions of times stronger than Goku? If Goku kept at range he would win, but if he goes in for fist fight Superman will maul him.
>>64080233
What evidence? All I know is that he can bench press a planet, go from Pluto to Earth very quickly, blow up a mountain by fisting it, and destroy an aircraft carrier by blasting it. I don't know anything about Goku's abilities, so why would I make any assumptions?
>>64080086
Broly totally might be a galaxy buster
>>64080332
He's not, that was all complete mistranslation. He was attacking the galaxy actually and the fight took place IN the galaxy he "destroyed" plus you can see tons of visible stars in the movie anyway.
>>64080288
Any time Goku lifts something he struggles like a little bitch.
Goku's strength has always fallen behind his ki powers. At the beginning of Z when Goku was at least a moon buster he struggled with ten times gravity. In the Buu saga he struggled with 40 tons.
Goku's best feat is punching King Kai's planet in Battle of Gods which would give him roughly mountain level strength (AKA Billions of tons).
It's also worth noting that bench pressing a planet was not really straining Superman and in the fight against H'El he was stated to be fighting at an even higher level than that.
![17jzwxt3vvhgbjpg[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/I0VAR0z.jpg "17jzwxt3vvhgbjpg[1].jpg")
>>64080390
Mistranslations are the best thing though
>>64080175
>Superman can hear people whispering on other fucking planets
Superman can hear through space?
Man, that really tells you just how fuckbroken Superman and Flash are.
Most superheroes break the laws of physics in some way... but in this case, it's a passive ability, so it's like the laws of physics are just lying down and saying "I give up."
>>64080126
>Also, we're always traveling at the same speed through spacetime.
>Technically no one is faster than anyone else.
Relatively speaking.
>>64080457
>Relatively
>>64080435
>Superman can hear through space
Not anymore
Helspont created atmosphere in space specifically so Supes could hear his own assbeating coming
>>64080126
"And then once I've had my fun, I'll release my writings on relativity to the public. Then everyone will be fast! Then NO one will be."
>>64080496
What does Helspont creating his own atmosphere have to do with Superman being able to hear in space?
>>64080552
Every time you acknowledge physics, one of Superman's powers dies
>>64080426
400 tons.
He was on the planet of the kai where he was under 10 times normal gravity.
That's just him without the super saiyan powerup. He lifted it but it was heavy as fuck.
After he went super saiyan 1 he could lift it like it weighed nothing and canonically they're base strength increases by 50.
Meaning....400 tons x 50 =?
PS The kai planet he was training on might have had greater gravity. Mainly because it was a training planet. I don't really recall.
>>64076160
Bull fucking shit
>>64080594
It was never stated to have greater gravity ever. There's no reason to assume it had greater gravity.
400 tons is still tiny compared to Superman and you're not going to reach anywhere near Superman without a 50 multipliers. More than Goku has.
Most DBZ fans accept his and try to argue around it by saying that Dragonball Z characters punch harder than their strength level would suggest. This is contradicted in the Freiza saga when Frieza is able to hurt Goku with a bear hug, which shows their punches don't hugely outstrip their strength
>>64078636
Is there a .rar with all the bait macros?
>>64073588
Do people seriously not see that characters like Flash, Batman, and Superman are becoming the biggest Mary Sues ever?
>>64080929
>no fun allowed.jpg
>>64073588
>>64073588
Sorry but if it was in universe goku would eventually just get stronger until he could somehow defeat the flash, theres no way flash could stop that.
>>64080991
Speed steal followed by a billion infinite mass punches
>>64080991
Flash could punch him so hard he dies. And then go to the afterlife so he can punch him so hard he dies again.
>>64080991
Flash would just go back in time before Goku got stronger and take him out, you dumbass
>>64076097
i know who has an even more rediculously unbeatable power
>>64080961
You can have fun characters without making them so overpowered that the only conceivable reason they haven't solved the entire world's problems is because they are functionally retarded.
>>64081251
Maybe you should actually read the comics and enjoy life a little
>>64081277
I try really really to enjoy but whenever I read something a second time I start asking too many questions and then everything falls apart
>>64081251
What does power have to do with being a Mary Sue?
>>64081321
>I try really really to enjoy but whenever I read something a second time
From your whining in this thread, it looks like your reading comprised of out of context image macros like the OP.
So kind of like the rest of /co/.
>>64080991
Goku has lost fights before so, no, not really.
>>64080991
Wally, Bart and Jay can all speed steal.
Wally can Speed Force dump.
Wally can IMP.
Wally has one-shot characters as durable as Superman.
Barry can Speed Force dump without touching you.
Barry can atomize shit by looking at it.
There's pretty much no way he wins.
>>64080780
1.All of those kai planets have greater gravity you fucking idiot.
2.400 tons was apparently the max he could lift after working out for what might have been days nonstop as a non super saiyan.
3.Once he went super saiyan ONE he was able to lift it with no problem what so ever. It was so light that it might as well have weighed nothing.
MEANING that at super saiyan level 3 he will be lifting millions of tons at speeds that equal or surpass the flash.
That's not even including how he can use ki to increase the speed and power of attacks. He's lifting that shit unpowered up and in base ss3 level.
>>64081767
How on Earth did you get that because he could lift 400 tons with ease as SSJ1 that he'd somehow be able to lift millions of tons and be faster than Flash at SSJ3?
This is why no one likes debating about DB shit.
Because people are dumb as hell.
>>64080780
Are you say King kai's home planet wasn't 10x Earths gravity? That's just wrong. It also should be noted that after Frieza, practically no one trained outside boosted gravity because Bulma built the gravity chamber.
>>64081866
...
You don't even fucking know anything about either goddamned character.
What in the everlasting fuck are you even doing in this goddamned thread?
>>64081960
Please. Just go.
>>64081979
Dude/dudette
Take your old fag lantern and get out. You're fucking stupid and have no idea why because you don't understand the source material you're arguing about or for.
>>64082144
I love DC, I really do, but when trying to run VERSUS discussions around in my head, the only conclusion I can come to is any DC super, especially superman, must be disqualified from winning any versus on grounds of character consistency.
The likes of Goku has only ever had one man at the helm. Thus his character can proceed in a steady and predictable manner. Superman, like all DC supers, gets passed around writer to writer like a five dollar whore. It goes so out of hand they have to regularly reset THEIR ENTIRE UNIVERSE to set characters straight with disturbing regularity. So you get people trying to argue entirely different, and blatantly unrelated, versions of a character as proof of why they win. All Goku has is his one and only canon depiction. Hell, people will even bring in ELSEWORLDS tales for Superman as if they mean something.
Here's where the DQing comes in, though. So you have all these different versions, and it's unfair to use different versions to justify the same win. So you choose one and argue it. Well, which one then? There's no wiggle room here. Which version of Supes/DC you pick will make or break the fight. There is no fair way to decide what version of the character is used because there is no unbiased way to choose.
The only thing left is to go checklist style over every version of the character that ever has been and go
>Can defeat Goku
>Can't
>Can
>Can
>Can't
Which is entirely decided on the basis if that version of superman is capable of punching hard enough to hurt goku and only that.
>>64082144
Wow dude, shut the fuck up.
See >>64081883, that's me. Agreeing with you, but even I think you're an ass clown now.
>>64082484
I like that you felt you had to type an elaborate five minute post to state something that's been said so many times over the years
>>64082509
It took you five minutes to read that?
How slow are you?
>>64082521
I was assuming that due to the length it took you like five minutes to type
>>64073588
If he can only think at the speed of light then he cannot perceive events that last less than an atto-second.
>>64082484
The entire point of these threads is to come up with reasons why the comic character will win while using examples from every version. That's what makes it fun.
>not realizing everything is canon anyway
Hypercrisis is real
>>64082493
I don't need you to agree with me. .
It's like me telling a fucktard that the sky is blue and you come back later with a page from wiki and co-sign it.
That person hasn't the first fucking idea of what they are talking about and I slapped them in the face with my dick.
They even resorted to posting pics with no arguments.
>>64077515
toplek, trying to make something mystical out of bad writing
>that's bullshit, but i believe it
>>64076206
>Well I mean, Wally is pretty scrub tier when it comes to flash powers. Barry is the only invincible Flash.
lol no, you are retarded
>>64082549
>The entire point of these threads is to come up with reasons why the comic character will win while using examples from every version.
What? Most people specify only one version.
>Nu52 Superman
>Post-Crisis Superman
>Silver Age Superman
Are the main ones
>>64077515
Didn't he have a zombie in Blackest Night? Sounds fairly clear to me.
>>64082535
What do I look like? Someone with a WPM of 1?
>>64082583
Yep, he was pretty dead by Johns' rules, and Morrison confirms.
>>64082583
And the rings tried to take Barry too.
Nekron sent them after them because they cheated death. He says as much.
>>64082558
Okay champ.
>>64082595
If you had a WPM of 1, you'd have stopped at >I love DC, I really
>>64082606
They cheated death by coming back. And Barry was dead, just that speedsters go into the speed force when they die.
>>64073588
Shut the fuck up, both of you /a/ssholes don't read comics.
>>64082606
>Nekron sent them after them because they cheated death
Right, because they were dead and came back. That's how they cheated him.
>>64082616
I don't think one letter words usually count towards WPM scores.
>>64082666
That's because WPM is almost as illogical a measurement as the inch or the pound, but what can you do
>>64081767
>1.All of those kai planets have greater gravity you fucking idiot.
No evidence of that.
>2.400 tons was apparently the max he could lift after working out for what might have been days nonstop as a non super saiyan.
Again no evidence he had been working out for days. The other Kai's also regarded 40 tons as impressive.
>3.Once he went super saiyan ONE he was able to lift it with no problem what so ever. It was so light that it might as well have weighed nothing.
Yes, that clearly makes him able to tangle with a casual planet mover. Besides that Goku was clearly powered up when he lifted the weights as a Super Sayain, He was on fire and glowing.
You're exaggerating the SS multipliers as well. To get to millions of tons you'd need three 50 x multipliers.
Considering turning Super sayain 3 took Goku from slightly weaker than Buu to slightly stronger, its not 50 times.
No way in hell Goku is faster than the flash outside of IT. He has zero feats to suggest that.
>>64080390
Is that really so much better? He was capable of annihilating a galaxy, start by star, within an apparently short period of time. Likely a matter of a few years. How many fictional civilizations have the capacity to combat something like that, much less stand against it?
>>64073588
that picture explains everything wrong with DC
>>64082729
Honestly, I think the difference in dead lift numbers has to do more with american comic book writers having no concept of what numbers mean and Toriyama having a vague one than any real difference in power.
>>64082782
Only if you lack an imagination and assume it would hinder stories
>>64082729
>No evidence of that.
It's directly stated.
>>2.400 tons was apparently the max he could lift after working out for what might have been days nonstop as a non super saiyan.
>Again no evidence he had been working out for days. The other Kai's also regarded 40 tons as impressive.
Except all he does is work out nonstop. And the fact that they say 40 tons on a planet with increased gravity has no actual bearing on the conversation.
>Yes, that clearly makes him able to tangle with a casual planet mover. Besides that Goku was clearly powered up when he lifted the weights as a Super Sayain, He was on fire and glowing.
Yes we all know what super saiyan is stupid.
>You're exaggerating the SS multipliers as well. To get to millions of tons you'd need three 50 x multipliers.
You apparently don't.
The reason I emphasized that he was only at super saiyan 1 seems to have flown completely over your head.
>Considering turning Super sayain 3 took Goku from slightly weaker than Buu to slightly stronger, its not 50 times.
Super saiyan one takes him to 50 times his base non super saiyan bodies strength. Dumbass.
And since he was only struggling with 400 tons on the kai world and lifted it with nothing but ease after..I would say that he's significantly stronger at super saiyan three.
Both because his base physical strength increased exponentially since then, and it is a multiplire that is..I think somewhere in the hundreds or thousands.
>No way in hell Goku is faster than the flash outside of IT. He has zero feats to suggest that.
Teleportation is just directed super speed.
>>64082617
>>64082629
Barry's didn't die. Yes, he went into the Speed Force. Johnny Quick and Max Mercury were both in the Speed Force. Wally lived in the Speed Force for years. The only case of a Flash's soul going into the Speed Force is Bart, in which outside tech had to be used to restore his life.
Bart is the only one who is claimed by the Black Flash, the other being Johnny Chambers who dies in Flash Rebirth after touching Barry who had become the Black Flash due to Thawne's tampering.
Superman never died. The Eradicator takes his body and puts him in the Birthing Matrix to heal him. Pretty sure Eradicators entire shtick was to protect Kal.
>>64082763
Expounding on this further, there are about 300 BILLION stars in our galaxy. Now, I recall hearing that the mentioned galaxies in DB are decidedly smaller than average. As such, lets really low-ball it and go with 30 billion. Let's also figure that Broly spent 10 terran years ripping up the southern galaxy. He'd still have to destroy over 8 million star systems a DAY.
>>64082817
It does for non comic book readers.
>>64082782
An out of context scan explains everything wrong with DC?
90% of the people here haven't even read Grounded.
>>64082911
Fuck them
>>64076391
>>64076569
Funnily enough, the Spirit Bomb was used quite a few times in the anime, and was frequently touted as the strongest move Goku has. Yet it only worked what, once? I only remember it successfully destroying Omega Shenron.
>>64082915
>90% of the people here haven't even read Grounded.
That's a good thing
And what previous anon wanted to say is that /co/ is far too obsessed with power levels and out of context images.
>>64082886
What Wally did is clearly different. The other speedsters all died Earth deaths but didn't have to move on all the way to the normal afterlife due to being connected to the speed force. They were still dead though.
>>64082950
There were some good moments in Grounded. I agree the vast majority of it was terrible.
>>64082884
>It's directly stated.
Show me the scan then,
> >Again no evidence he had been working out for days. The other Kai's also regarded 40 tons as impressive.
Except all he does is work out nonstop. And the fact that they say 40 tons on a planet with increased gravity has no actual bearing on the conversation.
You've yet to prove it had increased gravity and 400 tons is still infinitesimal compared to Superman.
>Both because his base physical strength increased exponentially since then, and it is a multiplire that is..I think somewhere in the hundreds or thousands.
Hundreds of thousand times stronger!? That's going to help him against someone who can lift 5972 Sextillion tons.
>>Teleportation is just directed super speed.
Doesn't help when he's been punched a thousand times before he touch his head.
>>64082985
>Show me the scan then
He did way earlier in the thread dude >>64081883
Goku's probably still way weaker than Supes, but the way you've been harping on about the fact that "it's never stated" that Kai's planet is denser and more gravitational indicates negative things about everything you post
>>64082962
They didn't move on, because none of them were claimed by the Black Flash.
If coming back to life was as simple as running out of the Speed Force, as Barry, Max and Johnny did, then they wouldn't have needed Brainy and a half-dozen other people to bring back Bart.
Pretty sure Flash: Rebirth was written before, or alongside Blackest Night -- was it not? In which the events of Barry's "death" were revealed/retconned.
>>64081028
>>64081049
>>64081116
>>64081411
>>64081581
nekbeards mad their childhood hero would get obliterated by a anime guy.
If goku wanted to he could just surround himself in so much KI power that no matter how fast the flash was, the ATOMSECOND he came in the radius of the field he would be disintigrated
>>64082985
400 tons was his max before he went super saiyan. After he's probably somewhere in the neighborhood of 50,000 tons and that's before applying ki tricks to increase speed and power and kaioken.
Which would leave him doing somewhere in the neighborhood of 200,000 tons.
And that's only super saiyan 1. There's technically 4 ish other super saiyan forms and fucking super saiyan god which is littearlly broken.
>>64083006
That's not the planet Goku was on. Goku lifted the 40 tons on Grand Kai's planet. Which was as far I can tell a normal planet of normal size and gravity.
King Kai's planet was destroyed by cell and not rebuilt till some time after the Buu saga.
>>64083069
No.
>>64083077
And? It gets him nowhere close to Superman even if he's a billion times stronger as Super sayain God.
>>64083083
All of the kai planets have people training on them. And all of those planets have increased gravity.
The fighter training area has increased gravity.
The only people who don't train in increased gravity after the frieza saga are krillian, yamcha and tien and chaosu.
The only ones.
>>64083121
You seem to have trouble providing scans of this.
I'm not sure why this is so important. Does it matter whether Superman is a trillion or 100 billion times stronger than Goku?
in a strenght contest: Superman wins
in a fight : Goku wins
Flash would win in a fight against both
>>64078636
To be fair, he DOES look an awful lot like Doom (or maybe it's the other way around, I don't know who was made first)
>>64083109
Yeah, superman can pull multiple planets at a time.
>>64083156
Spectre, by about 20 years.
>>64073771
low tier
>>64080577
Every time you acknowledge physics, one of Goku's powers dies
Squirrel Girl and Saaitama could defeat both of them.
>>64083524
Goku's powers actually make more sense and are more consistent than Superman's.
>>64083121
The others you listed trained at Kai's like Goku in filler, where they had the Ginyu force job to them after Goku and Vegeta wasted them. After Frieza gravity stopped being the benchmark except for Vegeta's brief training in Bulma's gravity chamber thing to get to SS. They switched back to having them move heavy shit to show power levels, like Goku's magic weights and the sword the old Kai was sealed in. Regardless they never showed the capacity to lift planets.
My 2 cents are Superman's stronger, Flash is faster, and Goku has better energy projection. Fight goes to the writer's favorite, since in their own books at their best they'd all have a friendship/speed-force/superman asspull that would let them win depending on the circumstances.
>>64082976
The only good moment in Grounded was that with the sucidal girl. Everything else was shit.
>>64076017
That is some cool art in the left side, man.
>>64083549
No, they actually trained in heavy gravity. Remember the time chamber during the cell saga?
Remember that vegeta CONSTANTLY trained in 300+ times gravity?
As for the sword, yeah, it was super heavy. And
"never showed the ability to lift a planet".
No one has been shown lifting a goddamned planet.
Just hyperbole by the ton from superman writers.
>>64080929
No because Flash, Batman and Superman aren't Marvel characters, they're not SUPPOSED to be weak and relatable. They're mythological figures, it's like calling Hercules or Gilgamesh Mary Sues.
The stories are about the characters performing great feats and how the world and its characters react to their influence. Try reading All-Star Superman, Mark Waid's Flash, Morrison's JLA, most post-Crisis Batman, or pretty much any DC comics at all you fucking casual.
He's TECHNICALLY faster, since instant transmission is instant (not the speed of light, literally instant. Faster than any measurement of time we have).
But outside of that, yeah, Goku isn't faster.
>>64073825
Flash could only go back in time with the cosmic treadmill or with more speed force from others added to his own at best. For the most part only Zoom was the one that could properly time travel.
>>64084676
Read the thread, Flash is faster than instant.
He has power over the basic physics of motion.
There is literally no limit to this speed.
If Goku takes 0 time units to arrive somewhere, then the Flash takes -1 time units.
>>64076160
I'm still mad.
>Goku
>A low class monkey from a barbaric alien race who puts himself through intense trials to better himself and push himself to his limits, reaching higher plateaus of power as his ages and grows stronger, earns his abilities and skills through sheer rigorous training, seeking a challenge is what drives him.
>Flash
>A faggot who was given powers becuz lel hax i'm fast just because i was hit by lightning durr
Why are comic books so gay?
>>6408485
People who beat Anti-Monitor are not considered faggots.
>>64081883
I thought you were a dbz fan. They weren't on king Kai's planet at the time. It had been destroyed by Cell remember?
>>64080126
He outran a goddamned abstract concept and this is what worries you?
>>64080065
AND fighting. Zenkai is a separate thing.
>>64076373
fuck thats fast. lol
>>64084858
>I've been gifted with strange powers!
>I must use them to help people, rather than personal gain
>my power level is 900000000000!
>fool! You faced only a fraction of my real power!
>5 minutes of gasping reaction shots
I see how it would be immensely buttfrustrating to someone who somehow actually likes DBZ that a character whose sole motivation and personality trait is fighting and becoming stronger, in a series which has no other plot than fighting and getting stronger and goes out of its way to fellate the POWAH LVLS of its characters... would still get put down like a sick puppy by random mid-tier DC characters
>Goku would kill ______!
>*is proven wrong*
>wah, _____ is overpowered
DBZ made a whole generation functionally retarded, fucking worse than Sonic the Hedgehog
>>64086830
>Actually defending the complete cancer tier that is DC comics
Ha, HAHA, HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA
>>64086940
>Actually, defending the complete cancer tier that is Dragonball Z
Ha, HAHA, HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA
>>64087289
>Seriously pretending that the Flash isn't the epitome of sanic tier mary sue faggotry
UMM HE'S FAST HE CAN RUN FASTER THAN TIME AND HE ALSO CAN RUN FASTER THAN DEATH AND HE CAN ALSO RUN BACKWARDS IN TIME AND HE CAN ALSO BEAT SUPERMAN HIS NAME IS FLASH THE HEDGHEHOG AND HE'S MY OC DONUT STEEL !?!?
>>64087460
Are you fucking serious? You do realize there are people retarded enough to think Goku can pull this off right?
>>64087705
Yes, yes a large fraction of Dragonball Z fans are insane. I'm pretty sure a good portion would be happy if you replaced Goku with krillen in that picture.
>>64087960
Seriously, I hear so much crap about DC and Marvel being op but then no one cares when Kami Tenchi is brought up? That makes no sense.
>>64086830
>>my power level is 900000000000!
>>fool! You faced only a fraction of my real power!
>>5 minutes of gasping reaction shots
Have any of you actually gone back and rewatched DBZ? Because this is so fucking true, shit's unwatchable. I can't believe 9-year-old me liked that trash.
You're friend doesn't know anything about Superman OR Flash. Dragonball Z also has an autismal fanbase surpassed only by Sonic and MLP.
impending 404 btw.
Those numbers are invalid. Goku wasn't powered up at all during that, as he shows no aura for the entire scene. Therefore the scene gives no valid data, as we don't know how much more he could have increased his power without transforming.
A much more logical way to calculate that is by converting power level to weight, as punching strength was, (obviously) shown to scale evenly with energy attacks. Then you run into the problem of his power level being entirely unknown past his Frieza saga level of 150 million.
Fyi, in the Daizenshuu it's stated that SS2 is twice as powerful as SS1, and SS3 is 4 times as powerful as SS2. No comment has ever been made on the power of SS4. Toriyama also stated in an interview that SS1 isn't really a x50 increase, he said he doesn't have an exact number, but he always thought of it as a 100x-200x power increase. That's why in GT General Rildo states that SS1 made Goku 100x more powerful. If you wish to fact check this btw, you can find the information on Kanzentai.com in the battle powers section.
I personally have made my own power level calculations, which I believe to be as mathematically accurate as possible. Assuming a linear multiplicative increase, (based on known power level growth from the Saiayn-Frieza saga), by my calculations Goku as a SS4 post 100 year time skip in GT should have a power level of about 939 quinoctogintillion. By my other calculations of how much power level converts to strength, he should be able to lift the known mass of the universe about 32 octosexagintillion times. If you want that in tons, you're gonna have to do some conversions. For reference, there's 9 nonillions Earths worth of solar mass in the known universe, and the weight of the Earth can be found on wikipedia. So from there you just multiply 32 octosexagintillion by 9 nonillion, and multiply that number by the weight of the Earth. If you aren't familiar with these numbers . It's simple
arithmetic really. Have fun!
>>64088750
and yes, I am criminally insane!
That was his last line btw, also. People actually believe the bullshit wall of text above. For real.
DBZ fans and casual Flashfans are both dumb, OP
Read several books, nigga.
>>64077831
Nigger, he beat Vyndktvx. Don't tell me he can't beat Multiversal threats.
>>64080086
/v/ and /a/ don't read, either, /co/.
It's almost like...nobody reads!
>>64083154
But Goku was terrible at fighting. His most advanced technique was that sometimes he flailed his hands AND feet at the same time, m8
>>64076271
I mean in that very same comic he breaks Kyle Rayner's hand and takes his fucking ring because Kyle wasn't "focused." The same Kyle who's a veteran JL member and has taken on world ending super crises a dozen times over. But Deathstroke's there? Too scurry for him, lost all his willpower!
Oh and then he gets fucking beat by Green Arrow jumping on his back.
>>64076429
I dunno, depends on who's writing him. Sometimes he does shit like learn how to be a super architect or how to make a computer that operates at near lightspeed on the fly because of how fast his mind can process things.
>>64083069
And then Flash shuts off his brain by turning off his neurons with speed steal, if you want to talk about stupid bullshit that the characters are capable of I will gladly put Flash against the entire DBZ universe and laugh as he stomps all of them a million different ways.
>>64084718
What? Zoom couldn't time travel -- he was trying to force Wally to time travel and go back and save him from getting mauled by Grodd.
Wally time travels all the time(or used to before becoming some asshole black street punk criminal thanks Venditti). Barry was the one who needed the treadmill because he sucked at it.
>>64077665
To be fair, he doesn't always need to have to have previously visited the spot he wanted to instant transmission to, like he did when trying to find Broly, or new Namek.
Also, he doesn't always have to put his fingers to his head, it's just proper technique, in the cell fight he instant transmissioned while using both hands for a Kamehameha.
I love Dragonball Z, and I love DC. But fuck, don't compare them. Just enjoy them separately.
Neither Goku nor Flash can beat this guy.
>>64089365
I thought he only worked on characters who were fiction-within-fiction. Goku and Flash both exist within the confines of their respective universes, m8.
>>64089108
I meant fucking Professor Zoom.
>>64089365
>only worked on characters who were fiction-within-fiction
You're talking about Bohemian Rhapsody.
Cheap Trick has the power to be on your back.
>>64089531
That's Bohemian Rhapsody, not Cheap Trick.
Marvel and DC combined have only one character with insane overpowered abilites and he's Superman and he is the only one who would beat Goku in a fair fight I don't even know how it's a matter of debate that any other character could keep up with Son let alone kick his ass, the dude can blow up planets without an effort and is an inhumane martial arts genious, name one other Marvel/DC character besides Superman who can do the same
>inb4 Batman
Just because you like a character and dislike DBZ doesn't mean you should be blind for the facts
>>64090064
>only one character
>both Marvel and DC have dozens of characters more powerful than Superman
Anon, you're an idiot. Please leave.
>>64090064
Galactus, you miserable shit.
>>64075609
The speed of light is inconsistent in the DBZ universe. Like when they shoot "lasers" at each other it somehow travels slow enough to be dodged.
>>64090064
Are you joking, or..?
Hal Jordan literally handwaved away the multiverse.
Planetbusting is by no means impressive.
Rookie Kyle Rayner blew up Oa his first week on the job.
Captain Atom created a universe, then destroyed it.
Flash has damaged the Anti-Monitor, when a combined assault from the Justice League did nothing.
Imperiex wiped out a galaxy.
Lex fucking Luthor blew up New Krypton.
Trigon destroyed multiple universes.
There are hundreds upon hundreds of planet+ busting characters in Marvel and DC respectively.
The canonically most powerful character in DB was only stated to be a solar system buster. Even that isn't displayed.
>>64090064
>>64090064
You might want to specify hero there, even then:
Dr. Fate, Spectre, Phantom Stranger just from DC.
>>64090207
>Are you joking, or..?
It's obvious bait.
>>64083524
>>64083546
Did you seriously try to claim glowing monkey balls that explode follow the laws of physics?
>>64083524
I don't think they acknowledge physics in DBZ or DB
Information processing is actually bounded by the speed of light. Any signal can travel only as fast as the speed of light. So if light would only travel the distance of a molecule in one attosecond and the dude can actually think that fast his brain would have to be MUCH smaller than a molecule to do any processing in this timeframe.
>>64091895
It's speedforce, I ain't gotta explain shit.
>>64090178
That's because they're faster than the speed of light, obviously.
itt: people who don't read the flash and people who don't read dbz
dbz has the worst power creep of anything, probably. given people get 10x as strong as the last arch and old characters just can't compete at all. the thing is there's nothing to really compare it to after db, because knives and bullets don't ever get used, so it's super easy to have these discussions with them going nowhere.
i mean if you wanted to have a real pissing contest pit flash against demonbane or super ttgl why not
these threads are shit
>>64093485
git fukt
