I want to buy a new chef's knife that is durable. I'm tired of having blades become dull so quickly, and I don't want to get them sharpened often.
What is a good brand for this? I was looking into Shun, but they seem overrated and more expensive than their worth.
>>7572901
>I don't want to get them sharpened often
nigga, do you not sharpen your blades
Victorinox aren't that expensive and are really good knives imo for just home kitchen stuff.
Global
>>7572903
I try to hone them often, but I have never sharpened them or sent them to be sharpened.
Chicago Cutlery
>>7572933
I'm really forcing myself not to be a prick or condescending, so I will be nice.
Why don't you buy a knife sharpener?
>>7572942
I've heard the pull through ones destroy the quality of the blade, and all the stone ones I've seen seem to take hours to sharpen. Are there other options?
>>7572901
Read the sticky
Oh my mistake, we don't have one since 101 questions like this can not be redirected to a fucking sticky coz we don't need one
>>7572942
Most knife sharpeners are made for outdoor blades, thus giving a wider bevel than culinary knives. Also, pull through is on a microscopic level much less sharp or durable than someone legitimately sharpening a knife.
>>7572978
dat autism
>>7572904
Seconded
Got this one a year and a half ago and it sharpens really easily and well with a stone.
http://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Fibrox-Straight-Chefs-8-Inch/dp/B008M5U1C2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00
I even tried it with an electric sharpener and it seems to be quite good.
>>7572901
buy this and go away
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00032S02K/
>>7572901
If you're going to get a Henkel I would recommend the Twin Signature made in Germany rather than the international made in Spain.
My favorite chef knife for chopping veggies is my victorinox. It's taller than the Henkel and more comfortable for chopping.
As far a sharpening goes- good knifes take time to break the factory edge and sharpen, but they will hold that edge better than cheap knives. You should be able to sharpen an 8 inch chef's knife with a Lansky 5 stone set, any larger and I'm afraid you need a full on jig. The Lansky set is great if you don't have the practice or patience to work a knife on a stone holding the same angle on every pass. PS- 20 degrees is good for kitchen knives.
>>7573015
Piss off. Those suck.
>>7573044
This is my victorinox. I had to look it up because it was a wedding gift.
http://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Swiss-Rosewood-Chefs-5-2060-20RUS3/dp/B00FJDR08S/ref=sr_1_1?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1460692771&sr=1-1&keywords=5.2060.20
>>7573044
How do you use a 5 stone set? Would my time and money be better spent sending my knives to be professionally sharpened?
>>7573044
>As far a sharpening goes- good knifes take time to break the factory edge and sharpen, but they will hold that edge better than cheap knives. You should be able to sharpen an 8 inch chef's knife with a Lansky 5 stone set, any larger and I'm afraid you need a full on jig.
This is someone whose advice you should never ever listen to.
>>7573083
proper maintenance of your tools is a great skill to have, anon. buy the stones, learn them, save time and bux in the long run.
![global-knives[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/NWIu5eL.jpg "global-knives[1].jpg")
>>7572908
I really like my globals, only issue is that you need to make sure the handle is completely dry or else rust spots can happen.
My girlfriend also used one of those handheld ceramic knife sharpeners on a few of them and the blades are scratched for a half inch or so above the cutting surface along the length of the knife. Sucks but should be able to take it out the next time I get them professionally sharpened
>>7573136
why the fuck would it matter if the handle had a rust spot? are you afraid someone is going to see your knives and give you shit about a tiny dot of rust on the handle?
Dexter Russell. Cheap and sharp.
Having worked in kitchens for close to two decades now I've owned several expensive as fuck blades. I've had them stolen from my car (twice), knocked off counters causing the tip to bend or break a few times and even utterly destroyed when the dipshit prep cook used it as a can opener. He never came back to work after that day.
A ten inch Dexter with a plastic handle is now my work horse. Light, so it's comfortable and holds edge for a week plus under extremely heavy usage. We're talking up to 100lbs of proteins and probably double that in produce. Daily. Run it down the steel a couple times and it slices a tomato with ease. And if something happens to it a replacement is <$30. I have it professionally sharpened about weekly. They have all the kit for it (expensive if done right) and only charge me $5.
I've come to realize over the years that expensive knives are basically the same as designer clothes. With few exceptions, you're paying for the label. If you insist on spending the money though, MAC was my favorite.
Oh, pull through sharpeners are garbage.
These any good?
http://www.amazon.com/Kai-Japanese-Professional-Knife-Sharpening/dp/B000UZET0M
>>7573139
Because I'd rather not see my expensive knives literally corrode in front of my eyes. What's the point of buying anything nice if you're not going to take care of it at the lowest possible level? What's the point of washing your Ferrari, are you afraid people are going to judge you for the bird poop on the hood?
>>7573258
if i had a ferrari i would literally cover it in bird shit just for the pure irony
maybe intentionally key the fuck out of it and draw dicks all over it in spray paint
it would be super punk
sharpen your knife everyday
everyday
Dester Russell, Victronix for budget. If you are going to spend the money for a Shun, at least look into a Mac knife first. If you are considering a Global, don't do it, Mac is better & cheaper
>>7573111
What do you have against a Lansky? It's done a bang up job on every knife I've sharpened with it.
>>7573083
It's a jig that sets the angle for you and comes with stones from extra coarse to extra fine. They make a set with only 3 stones, but I would recommend the 5 stone because it comes with the extra fine stone which is pretty much a ceramic polishing hone. Picture related.
>>7574107
I'm not the guy you're replying to, but I find it to be more of a hassle than it's worth. By the time you unpack everything from the kit box, assemble the guide rods to the stones, clamp the knife into it, etc you've already spent more time and effort than just using a stone freehand. It's a complex solution to a non-extant problem.
>>7574107
>What do you have against a Lansky?
You filthy casual.
Its like you haven't got a phd in knife sharpening from an internationally renowned university, and spent 12 years living in japan learning knife sharpening skills from master knife men.
I assume you want to ruin your tempering and grain structure
>>7574107
Guided sharpening systems are much slower to use than freehanding once you know how, and since its only the last ~10 passes per side that determine how sharp the edge edge turns out, guided systems are a solution to a non-problem.
>>7574154
Sorry you're so buthurt that you can't sharpen, but it really isnt that hard to learn to freehand kitchen knives.
You just suck :^)
genuine reply, OP:
if you want a knife that has the physical properties of staying sharp longer, look into japanese chef's knives- they are typically MUCH harder than the knives already mentioned, and consquently will not wear down as fast and require resharpening. You can get good quality knives like the Tojiro DP chef;s knife for ~$50-60 and its a great knife.
the flip side is that you have to be carefuller with these knives, since the extra hard blade will chip much more easily than the other knives mentioned, and a chip is a much bigger problem than a dull edge
>>7574363
>since its only the last ~10 passes per side that determine how sharp the edge edge turns out
You are genuinely confused my friend. When you change the angle on a knife that has hard steel and take it from say, a 35 to a 20- it takes time and effort. If your knife is set at a 25, you won't affect the point of the edge if you hold it at a 20. Your last ~10 passes only determine how fine the edge is, which aids in cutting, but without setting a sharper angle your knife isn't going to retain that edge nearly as long.
>>7573136
>completely dry or else rust spots
>stainless steel
>rust spots
?
Unless you have a carbon version or some shit man. The only kitchen knives that are "stainless" and rust are things like the Miracle Blade III and other similar quality garbage.
>>7574530
high carbon stainless can definitely get spotty. My carbon steel knives get a patina on them, but the high carbon stainless do not, but they will show mild corrosion if you let them stay wet consistently. One on mine you can actually the weld line because of the staining now. Doesn't hurt the knife but its a fact
You have to sharp a knife every fucking time you use it to keep it sharp.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBn1i9YqN1k
>>7574634
That's honing.
>>7574596
Never had that problem, thanks for the info. My carbon blades have patina, though I oil my cleaver so it hinders its formation.
If you really want an always sharp knife, get a ceramic. You're going to replace it every couple of years but it will stay exactly as sharp as the day you bought it until it's too badly chipped to use any more.
>>7574643
Yes, we know. Honing is a subset of sharpening. Thus it is perfectly accurate to describe that as sharpening.
>>7574845
Nah, ceramic knives get dull just like steel knives do, it just takes longer because the ceramic is harder.
And ceramic knives are very limited as to their usefulness: ceramic is brittle so you'll never find a ceramic boning knife, etc. They are also limited to small sizes. That's fine for a paring knife but it's useless for a Chef's knife, etc.
>>7574516
Since you are unable to grasp context I will spell it out for you:
Precise angle control does not matter much, if at all, to the final sharpness obtained when sharpening a knife because, as long as you apex the edge, it will be only the last ten or so passes per side that determine the character of the apex.
Thus, using a slow sharpening system for precise angle control is pointless since that precise angle control contributes very little to the final sharpness.
Most people would be better off with the speed of grinding and burr minimization options you get from freehanding because the two most common issues people have is failing to reach an apex or leaving a burr they cannot remove.
>>7574845
> wash ceramic knife with cold water
> slice hot chicken
> it shatters
>>7574634
Don't take sharpening advice from TV stars who haven't sharpened their own knives in 20 years.
>>7574865
are you retarded? How the fuck to you think machine tools are sharpened? I can hand sharpen a plane blade to a .000mm tolerance for flat by hand, I can sure as shit do it with a kitchen knife.
You make the rounded apex by choice, the Moran edge is the best for edge retention and slicing soft matter, not because lolidunno
You can make any shape you want at the apex, most people start off learning to make a full flat acute final bevel, especially with a jig to help them
>>7574865
You're right, I'm failing to see how you can make a knife with a 45 degree bevel as sharp as one with a 20 degree bevel. You can polish and hone that 45 all you want, but it's still a 45 and consequently duller than the 20.
>>7574877
> I can hand sharpen a plane blade to a .000mm tolerance for flat by hand
Put the huge bevel on the stone and move it around with consistent pressure across it.
> I can sure as shit do it with a kitchen knife.
The knife doesn't give you the same kind of convenient guide to judge the angle as the plane blade. The knife is curved. The knife generally has a symmetric edge, whereas the way you hold it during sharpening is not symmetrical.
Good on you that you can do it both, but you are reversing the difficulty.
what about this one /ck/?
http://knifewear.com/collections/nakiri/products/tojiro-red-handle-nakiri-165mm-f-171r
>>7574940
To use as a chef's knife? No.
>>7574998
for fruit and vegetable processing
>>7574940
Seems a lot of money for what it is, standard steel, meh handle, Nakiri. You can do better for less.
https://www.amazon.ca/Mercer-Culinary-7-Inch-Vegetable-16-5cm/dp/B00AE37XFI
>>7574877
Please calm your autism, I was not saying that it isn't possible to get a very precise angle freehand, just that there is absolutely no point in spending money on a guided system that is slow as shit to achieve it.
Precise angle control only really matters in the last few passes that set the apex.
>>7574931
You are talking about cutting ability, not sharpness. Sharpness refers to the width of the apex, not to the thickness behind the apex.
Think of it this way, you could thin out a Mora by laying the primary grind flat on a stone and grinding it, but it would not be sharpening.
>>7575141
Yes, but a thin apex on a fat angle will disappear faster than a thin angle. I can pick up my knives and use them (without honing) for months at a time and they remain sharp.
>>7575436
I think its actually the reduced force necessary to make cuts using a thinner edge geometry that results in the increased edge retention.
Just buy a cheapo Walmart knife and then buy another one when it gets dull. Perfect solution for you OP
I've got a cheap as shit, Ikea stainless steel knife and a pull-through knife sharpener (pic related) and I just sharpen it every time i want to cook. I swear to God I've done all the tests you see reviewers on YouTube do to their fancy knives (like slicing slivers of a tomato at an angle etc.) and it cuts like a boss.
If you think you need anything more than that as a home cook you're pretentious, I'd say don't get anything more expensive than a Victorinox. Besides, the joy of having a cheap knife is that I can sharpen the fuck out of it every time I want to cook and not worry that I'm wasting my precious blade away.
>>7575464
pic
>>7575464
Kekl, enjoy your garbage edges on your garbage knives :^)
>>7575481
Does it seem to you like OP is some kind of accomplished chef who would need anything more than I described?
>>7575486
I don't know, but unlike you he might not be too much of a bitch to learn to freehand on stones :^)
>>7575464
>God I've done all the tests you see reviewers on YouTube do to their fancy knives (like slicing slivers of a tomato at an angle
Most of that shit can be done with knife technique. If you take note of EVERY knife infomercial, they push down with the "competitor" or "regular knife" and get shit results and they push down while SLIDING BACK with "THE MIRACLE BLADE"
A good, sharp knife to me can simply be pressed downward and slice a tomato no problem -no movement forward or backward to complete the slice-
Jus' sayin' yo.
>>7575453
That certainly helps, but I've always figured that since the thickness of the metal directly behind the edge (or as this 'know it all' fucker likes to call it the "apex") then even when my "apex" is folded over on a microscopic level, I've still got a small angle behind it that's cutting chicken like it's warm butter.
>>7575508
I agree and yes a simple pull-through sharpener and a cheap but decent knife of about 10-20 dollars (not talking flea-market shit here) is enough for the job. My only quip with pull-throughs is that you can't choose the bevel you're giving the blade, but few people will really care about that.
>>7575464
I have to agree, pull through or electric sharpeners are the best
Fucking autists and their whetstones and oil
It's not the fucking middle ages mate
>>7575526
I'm the person you're quoting. I just wanted to say, I have a stone (a cheap japanese one) for sharpening knives but I bought it ages ago together with a cheap utility knife for bushcraft. That's a hobby and I can understand someone wanting to fanny about with a stone and their knife for hobby reasons once a month or something.
But for cooking knives, which I assume most people use every day, fuck that shit. Like you said it's not the fucking middle ages.
>>7574107
>What do you have against a Lansky?
I don't have any problem with whatever a Lansky is, I have a problem with taking a simple maintenance task and turning it into some autistic ritual.
>>7575615
*whips out whetstone*
*grinds katana for two hours*
*tips fedora*
Yare yare daze, you bakas don't even know what a true edge is...
*warps behind you*
*cuts you into a thousand pieces*
Gomenasaiya...
*posts on reddit and faps alone*
>>7575615
>the kind of people who have never handled a sharp knife are the same people who think sharpening a knife properly is some kind of autistic weeaboo ritual that takes 3 hours per knife
Why are you surprised at this?
Also there's some sperg who actually defends Lanskys even though better systems have come out since like 1944 or whenver that thing was invented.
>>7575620
Kek, it literally takes 15 minutes to get a chef's knife sharp enough to push cut newsprint you lazy cunt.
>>7575663
His time is valuable, he'd rather shitpost about vegans and baconmemes
do any of you knifefags actually cook?
>>7575677
they're too busy autistically grinding to actually focus on cooking
>>7575677
I've seen many a thread on here where the guy is using a $200 japanese blade to make some inedible pile of crap.
>>7575677
Who has time to cook when you spend all your time sharpening your knife?
>>7574938
>you are reversing the difficulty
if you have never been properly taught, maybe, but most people will natural make a curved apex and think its "good enough". If you get trained in how to really sharpen tools, you learn first that it is most important to learn to be consistent on a flat grind, and then you can adjust from there as you get better and better.
consistency first. fancy microbevels afterward. basics are key
>>7575732
>If you get trained in how to really sharpen tools, you learn first that it is most important to learn to be consistent on a flat grind, and then you can adjust from there as you get better and better.
I totally disagree. I think that failing to fully apex the edge or being unable to remove a burr are by far more common and more severe problems than curving the edge.
It's also really easy to avoid having edge bevel curvature even be a potential issue by making your edge bevels at an extra low angle and then raising the angle to set the apex with a micro bevel.
>>7575677
No, all you need to cook is a microwave. These fancy pans and knives are for show offs and yuppies
>>7575677
Frequently.
Hell, even my pocket knives get used in the kitchen frequently as paring and petty knife stand-ins.
>>7575732
People will make a curved apex when free handing because it's almost impossible to maintain a consistent angle without a large bevel to guide you. On a thin tapered kitchen knife we just have a tiny final bevel which provides very little feedback compared to the fuck huge flat one on the plane blade.
