Does the China study prove we are all wrong about eating meat?
>>7484249
I haven't read it, but if it's saying Chinese people are healthy I have my doubts about its credibility. In general they tend to be scrawny, literally sallow, and get sick easily.
well it does indeed but people dont eat with their brains they eat with their mouths.
>>7484249
The China Study is less about meat and more about protein, it's just that plant protein is healthier than animal protein.
>>7484256
It has nothing to do with that.
>studying food in china
No thanks senpai
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrv78nG9R04
>>7484279
hahahahaha
It suggests that, but it completely ignores the much higher prevalence of stomach cancer in the Chinese population.
Who is "we" and what are "we" wrong about? Mainstream nutritional advice is that meat consumption should be limited alongside most other animal products. Animal products are the primary source of saturated fat and cholesterol, which are detrimental to health outcomes. They also fail to provide beneficial nutrients like fiber that you would get from plant foods.
Logic and ethics proves we are wrong for eating meat
Check out this book. It backs up every claim with a superscript pointing to a science. The list of sciences alone is 148 pages.
>>7484408
It's because they eat too much pickled stuff.
>>7484419
Citing one or two studies is not enough to support a claim. That's not how "sciences" works.
>>7484414
Are people really continuing to fall for the "saturated fat and cholesterol is bad" meme?
>>7484419
and you don't need to pay for it:
https://kat.cr/how-not-to-die-discover-the-foods-scientifically-proven-to-prevent-and-reverse-disease-epub-pdf-t11994618.html
>>7484249
China has the highest cancer rates in the world, so I guess they're doing something right, right?
>>7484279
What exactly are the differences between animal and plant proteins? Are the amino acids somehow different when produced by plant ribosomes vs animals?
>>7484422
It's only what all the science and all the scientific bodies say and what all the evidence points to. "Saturated fat and cholesterol are not detrimental to health" is itself the biggest meme of the past couple years. I hope people realize that the only reason this meme exists is because it's excellent clickbait for shitty blogs fishing for fatass Americans who want to feel good about continuing their diet of garbage piled upon trash
>>7484436
I have better things to do
>>7484249
I'm reading the starch solution by dr McDougall. Meat is just bad food to primates.
>>7484439
Enjoy plaque in your arteries and colon cancer
>>7484249
From a strictly scientific standpoint, the healthiest possible diet is one based around whole grains, vegetables and fruits with little to no animal products. There are hundreds and hundreds of studies showing that meat, eggs and dairy contribute heavily to various diseases. You might not hear too much about the studies because there's so much money interested in keeping them quiet but they're not hard to find if you want to look them up.
Animal based food should be considered in the same manner as alcohol and smoking. It is absolutely unhealthy and it's up to you to decide if the enjoyment you get from these activities is worth the long-term health consequences.
The American Institute for Cancer Research, one of the most preeminent institutions on nutrition and cancer risk, is very clear that the most important things you can do to reduce your cancer risk are eat whole, plant based foods, don't smoke, don't drink and don't eat meat.
>http://www.aicr.org/about/advocacy/the-china-study.html
There have been plenty of studies based in other countries showing similar results.
>>7484454
Greger > McDougall
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb3zl4FliiA
http://nutritionfacts.org/?s=coffee
We'll have no choice but to reduce our meat consumption when the largest fossil aquifers are depleted.
>>7484473
>earing corpses
I Went vegan after discovering dr Gregor
But i just recently discovered McDougall and his way is easy and proven historically.
>>7484506
>I Went vegan after discovering dr Gregor
Same here. I'd used nutritionfacts.com as a resources for various nutrition info for a few years but hadn't really spent a lot of time browsing it, just enough to know that Greger knew his shit. I saw that he had a book out and thought it would be a interesting read.
A couple days later, I was vegan...or at least, I will be once I've eaten all the animal food I have sitting around the house. I'll be damned if I ever admit it to anyone, though. It's a shame that most vegans are such faggots that it's impossible to discuss the health benefits without being stereotyped as a massive faggot.
>>7484506
They seem to be in disagreement about white potatoes. Someone asks Greger about it on reddit and he gives a non-answer:
https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/3w8eeh/im_michael_greger_md_founding_member_and_fellow/cxu9hha
>>7484424
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>>7484528
>yungrabbit 5 points 3 months ago
>I've never considered potatoes to be so controversial ... until now. Dr. John McDougall, for example, laudes the potato as one of the most healthful foods, while others such as yourself have a different idea, going as far as to say they are toxic. What's the verdict, doc - will potatoes, sweet potatoes, and possibly yams - boiled or baked - make me regret eating them regularly (say, three to four nights per week)? Thanks for all your kind work.
>MichaelGregerMD [S] 12 points 3 months ago
>Sweet potatoes (which in the U.S. is synonymous with "yam") are one of the healthiest foods on the planet! Even better, purple sweet potatoes! That's actually one of my favorite snacks. After scrubbing some purple-fleshed potatoes I cut them into wedges, sprinkle some malt vinegar on them, dredge them in a mixture of blue cornmeal and powdered rosemary and bake them until they're mashed potato soft inside. Then dip them in hot sauce spiked ketchup--yum!
Why did he even bother answering?
>>7484526
Now you just need to watch cowspiracy, forks over knifes, and Say bye to cow buttholes aka burgers
>>7484430
While the proteins themselves may be similar, they do not exist in a vacuum. How they are digested is also dependent on the different substances they are consumed with. For example, animal proteins raise the acidity of the blood when digested, whereas plant proteins do not have this effect, despite the fact that complete proteins from plants or animals are nutritionally equivalent.
>>7484543
>and Say bye to cow buttholes aka burgers
Yeah, that right there is exactly the reason why I'll never admit to being a vegan unless I'm forced to do so. Why do you have to exude this shitty little smug superiority complex?
I love a good burger just like I love a good drink but I'm convinced by the science showing how unhealthy they are. If you really cared about converting more people to your little cause instead of just jerking off, you'd drop the act and stick to the science.
>>7484544
>animal proteins raise the acidity of the blood when digested
FUCKING
DROPPED
>>7484555
I love cocaïne too
You loving X doesn't imply X is good for you
You only like it because it's salty saturated fats
Also
>implying i'm not superior to ooga booga corps eating retards
>implying i will beg you to be vegan
Eat shit if u want anon, i hold the right to tell you that you're retarded for eating it .
>>7484580
You know the person you're responding to is a vegan right? You're retarded and the lack of B-12 has atrophied your already puny brain.
>>7484544
>acidity of blood
>changing
>ever
no
maybe if u get acidosis
>>7484572
>I'm told meat burgers usually don't have a crispy exterior like many plant burgers do. Is this true?
Generally not, unless they're overcooked. I tend not to go for plant burgers anyway. After a couple months as a vegan, I've come to the conclusion that vegan substitutes for animal-based food are complete shit that will never come close to the real thing, with the exception of a couple soymilk ice creams that are surprisingly close. If I'm really craving a burger, there's no plant substitute that's going to work and the best thing to do is just accept that I'm not having a burger and to go eat something else.
>>7484601
>b12 deficiency
>fortified almond milk
Pick one
>>7484623
>collecting enough nuts in the wild to meet b-12 requirements
>then milking them
Fucking vegan fans I swear, ALMONDS DONT EVEN HAVE NIPPLEZ
>>7484623
>>7484633
>be vegan
>understand that synthetic vitamins are not only useless as replacements for naturally occurring vitamins but in many cases actually cause disease
>want to drink non-dairy milk
>every fucking brand is "fortified" with half a dozen synthetic vitamins
What am I supposed to do, make my own?
>>7484633
Dude almond milk has been around since the middle ages.
>>7484669
I looked that up and the only sources I could find for it were a bunch of pro-organic sites. There were absolutely ZERO reliable scientific sources for it.
>durr but corporate shills!!!
The irony of this statement. I recommend actually researching how corporate organics truly are.
>>7484249
Didn't they take the data and find a much higher correlation between heart disease and carb consumption?
>>7484669
It is pretty easy to make your own almond milk, so yes.
>>7484674
>taking that post seriously
Anon, please.
>>7484680
>I looked that up and the only sources I could find for it were a bunch of pro-organic sites. There were absolutely ZERO reliable scientific sources for it.
You didn't look very hard, then. This has been common knowledge for a while. Vitamins from real food = good. Vitamins from a laboratory = bad.
>We found no evidence to support antioxidant supplements for primary or secondary prevention. Vitamin A, beta-carotene, and vitamin E may increase mortality.
>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18425980
>Vitamin E supplementation at doses above 400 IU/d is associated with a small increase in all-cause mortality.
>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1479533/
>>7484421
The bibliography in that book is absolutely enormous.
It's the most evidence-based nutrition book that I've ever seen.
The author reads the nutrition literature vigorously, and makes videos about the studies that review the most important ones, looking at the experimental design, who funded it, and comparing it with prior research.
https://www.youtube.com/user/NutritionFactsOrg
That book is based on his findings.
>>7484762
Well that's exactly the same thing scientific bodies do, so I don't see why I need to consult a book of that sort when all the science-based advice is the same anyway, to consume loads of vegetables and to limit anything animal-based, preferring fish wherever possible.
>>7484439
>you guys are gay for going to the party without me
Anon we didn't know you wanted to go, come join us
>I've got better things to do
>>7484762
http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=the+china+study
obviously the Campbell's are economically motivated and composed a book that fortifies their investment. It completely ignores refined carbohydrates as a factor which is main-stream accepted as a main contributor to early-life type-2 diabetes.
tl;dr: rich people tell you what to eat so they can make more money.
>>7484415
Go on, humor me.
>>7485446
I think the bottom line is what's true for the majority isn't true for the individual. If you have high cholesterol, sure, eliminate fatty protein. But saying that an all-vegetable diet is ideal for everyone is just asinine scientific reductionism (in the words of the author)
>>7484249
The animal with the longest life-span on the planet eats meat
http://www.afsc.noaa.gov/nmml/education/cetaceans/bowhead.php
checkmate vegs
>>7485459
This is now an anti-veganism thread
>the china study has been debunked over and over
>they always neglect how important fish and meat were in the development of humans
>they always fail to mention that vegan/tarian cultures eat a shit tonne of insects
>there is nothing to suggest that a vegan diet is actually healthier; every single study is observational
>most vegans I seem to encounter are horribly malnourished; knew a girl in high school with a whole vegan family that almost died because no iron
>everyone knows they do it for attention and not any true interest in what they're doing, despite this being impossible to prove
>the body can't even process cellulose properly
>vegans tend to stay away from saturated fat, despite it being essential for brain function
What did I miss?
>>7485465
>it's incredibly difficult to properly integrate micronutrients into a proper diet
Good luck finding calcium and omega-3 you fucking faggots.
>>7485465
honestly I don't understand veg's. Just because plants don't scream for pain, doesn't mean they don't have feelings. Have you seen a venus fly trap? are you telling me that doesn't have feelings? Obv it does or it wouldn't know when to close.
fuck off vegs
2-0
>>7485475
>vegans love animals
>in their ideal world animals have free reign to do whatever they please and to complement that vegans plan to
>steal their food
Vegans are literally braindead.
3-0
well veg's ? we have 3 air tight FACTS about your bull shit, where is your rebuttal? Are you allowed to use words with meat in them such as 'rebuttal' ... 'butt' ... you are the worst kind of people.
"plants that don't have feelings" can regenerate and regrow"
Why are you slaughtering this superior life form?
4-0
I wonder how many vegetarians have been convinced to stop eating vegetables from reading this thread so far.
Guessing like 82.
>>7485460
>Eating Fruit
They have far too much sugar my friend.
>>7484249
>Does the China study prove we are all wrong about eating meat?
Yes, basically. It's overwhelming.
I tried to give up meat and dairy. Didn't go all that well. Too much of a change too rapidly.
Went back to drinking milk. And eating cheese.
>>7484419
If being vegan makes you life longer, what do vegans die from?
>>7484249
From the wikipedia page:
>They [the authors] write that "eating foods that contain any cholesterol above 0 mg is unhealthy."
>The authors are critical of reductionist approaches to the study of nutrition, whereby certain nutrients are blamed for disease, as opposed to studying patterns of nutrition and the interactions between nutrients.
Book is garbage.
>>7485722
Non-alcoholic fatty liver disease. All that fructose bombards your liver, which has to convert to glucose.
>>7485739
nah.
>>7485868
Quit shilling this bullshit book
>>7484619
I'm not a vegan but a lot of veggie burgers are delicious. I need to start making them own my own.
>>7484419
If this book is anything like his youtube videos I'd like to avoid cherry picked data and half-truths.
I will eat meat, do drugs, drink alcohol, smoke cigarettes, and die, just like the rest of you.
But hey, while we're starting up the book club of fraudsters, may I suggest How to Eat to Live by Elijah Muhammad?
But really, I quit smoking, don't drink alcohol, don't do drugs, and I'm seriously considering veganism or in the very least pescetarianism (sp?). I've heard fasting is actually a good method. Not crash dieting and binging on rabbit food and aternatively starving oneself, but more like eating 600 calories for two days of the week, having one day of just cheating, and two cheat meals for the rest, and then the other days and meals are balanced. Might be bullshit, but I've looked at every 'diet'--Pritikin, Atkins, South Beach, juicing, paleo, etc.--and I'm confused about human nutrition. I won't ask for advice or ask any particular questions, but if someone wants to point me in the right direction, I'd appreciate it.
>>7485947
Are you fat trying to lose weight?
>>7485962
I'm 180ish at 5'10". I wanna lose about 50 lbs. and get back into cross country shape. Yes I'm a guy. I'm thinking low-insulin/low-glycemic index diet coupled with intermittent fasting and dietary veganism or pescetarianism.
>>7485962
In a word yes
Vegan here
The link between meat and cancer seems to be less along the lines of "thanksgiving turkey will give you brain tumors" and more that processed red meat gives you a higher risk for colon cancers, which most people already assumed because of the nitrates (studies that came before show a possible link)
If you're healthy, you're healthy. Just don't be a fat fuck and have blood work done once in a while, and remember to give your doctor a call.
>>7486215
Isn't chicken worse for your colon tho?
