Yalla jahudis, i am gathering ideas for a university-project, about how migration changed the foodculture in different countries.
Im still looking for some examples to name, so far i have ceviche (technique imported from spain), dönerkebap (turkey--->germany), paella (rice saffron from arabs), western foods adapted to japanese taste after the fall of the shogunate (torikatsu etc),chinese-american food. Any input is greatly appreciated.
All modern pasta in Italy (brought to Italy by Moors and Berbers).
>before then, we used barley, regular wheat and other starches, but not semolina
Pasta in the horn of Africa and Libya (they were Italian colonies and were introduced to pasta from us).
Most modern curries today in the world (chilies were brought from central and south America and the Caribbean to Portuguese trade colonies in curry-eating places).
Gado-gado, sate, bumbu kacang and pecel (peanuts brought from south America to Indonesia, a Portuguese trade colony).
Sponge cakes in Asia (again, the Portuguese).
Brazilian pastéis (sp?) (brought to Brazil by Japanese immigrants in the form of harumaki, then adapted to Brazilian tastes into the form known today).
If you go back far enough virtually everything we eat is the product of cultures coming together and sharing what they know with each other (yes, often as the result of on population conquering another).
If I were doing a project like this I'd look at Hawaiian cuisine, as it's a fairly modern example of half a dozen different immigrant cultures creating a somewhat distinctive cuisine (and dialect) due to circumstance and relative isolation.
>>7705323
Al Pastor tacos, tacos Arabes and quipe all show Lebanese influence on Mexican food.
Banh mi sandwich shows French influence on Vietnam.
Swedish meatballs and stuffed cabbage are supposedly the result of a Swedish king importing a Turkish cook.
Chinese egg custard tarts are directly lifted fro Portuguese.
Goan vindaloo also has Portuguese roots.
Skyline Chili is a Greek immigrant's version of Greek pasta sauce passed off a chili.
>>7705367
Damn, those are some great ideas, im especially thankful for the 2 dessert ideas, i hadnt even considered that. Both are great and directly relatable to historic migration.
>>7705380
Thats what makes this project easy&complicated at the same time. I just have a hard time finding dishes that really embody the spirit of migration, and can be traced back to particular points of time, i guess i should have specified that.
General Tsos Chicken, Korean Armybase Stew, Chicken Tikka Masala, döner kebap are my top ideas so far, not sure yet if migration of a certain ingredient will be presentable enough. To be honest i know next to nothing about hawaian food since im in a european culinary school, so i also have to be able to present decent recipes along with my ideas, which will be weird if i cant judge authenticity of recipes. Thanks so much for the ideas!
It's harder to find cases where some food isn't brought by foreign influence in one way or another. A good example of people and crops moving together from one continent to another would be creole food in Louisiana.
>>7705401
Thanks matey, i see banh mi is a great idea and ill be able to come up with a decent recipe for that. Ill check out the others. <3.
I actually really enjoy thinking about food and migration, it puts things in a very interesting perspective
Didn't Noodles come from China?
Modern french cuisinse was due to a queen of france being from Italy and demanding some of her cooks come live in France with her, and their cooking shifted in style over time to accomodate french tastes along with italian.
>>7705506
This happened a lot throughout Europe with Italian regents introducing X, Y and Z to other countries.
Portugal, China the Arab world, and Italy are the four most influential nations on the planet in terms of cuisine, listed in descending order most to least influential.
I believe tempura came from portugal before japan.
>>7705521
I think there's influential in two regards, one is trader nations who take/develope influences from other countries and then export new markets to their products, and the other is biologically diverse, and cultures with early agriculture development, which are the ones to export useful domesticated crops to other regions.
>>7705546
Indeed. Lots of things came from the Portuguese, stuff you wouldn't even imagine. They also introduced Brits to tea and the various buns (paan) eaten by people in Sri Lanka.
It's amazing that they were so influential back then.
>>7705546
thats cool,never would have thought of tempura.
Does anybody know about more recent migration that influenced the culinary landscape in the country receiving?Besides Turks in germany and the migration to the us i have a hard time finding a migration with strong impact in a culinary way.
>>7705569
True. There's also simple sphere of influence. After Gaul was conquered by the Germanic tribes and all viniculture was lost, Italy reintroduced wine-making back to France through the armies of the Papal States.
Oh, here's something rarely talked about: simple, southern Italian bread? So called peasant bread (pane cafone)? Well, we know it's the predecessor to nearly all other breads native to Europe today and, by extension, most of the bread eaten in the whole wide world.
However, its origin dates back to prehistory.
In Egypt.
Rural Egyptians to this day still eat, leavened, crusty, sourdough bread baked in 400°C woodburning ovens identical to those eaten in Italy. A documentary I saw about it with one of the Hairy Bikers exploring Egypt mentioned more of the history behind it than I can recall, however.
>>7705598
Two things come to mind: Americans everyfuckingwhere and Punjabis working the dairy industry making mozzarella in southern Italy.
Curry pasta was trendy a few years ago.
>>7705444
Here's another fun one: Corned beef and cabbage as an Irish American food. Ireland was famous for it's corned beef, but the Irish themselves never ate it - it was one of their major exports. When Irish immigrants got to New York they ran into Eastern European Jewish immigrants who established a culture around delis serving corned beef and pastrami. A successful Irish workingman could actually afford to eat beef once in a while, unlike back in Ireland. Corned beef and cabbage was adopted as an Irish-American meal.
The popularity of corned beef outside of the strictly Kosher deli allowed for a very American makeover with Thousand Island dressing, cheese and sauerkraut in the form of the Reuben sandwich.
Here's another one, the chicken parm sub:
Eggplant parm was a dish Italian immigrants brought with them to America. They landed here in the midst of a French bread craze, which allowed them to take a bunch of their cold cuts, cheese and hot food sold at a pork store and invent the sub sandwich as we know it. While the meatball, sausage and peppers and cold cut combos proved popular (and in South Philly the roast pork with rapini) the eggplant parm never caught on as well, because Americans didn't share the Italians' love of eggplant. When they replaced the eggplant with a chicken cutlet (something that never would have happened in Italy) a new classic was born.
>>7705615
Indian diaspora in Africa are quite influential in local food scene I've heard, although many of them have probably been there since many centuries.
>>7705616
Thats a really nice story behind the reuben and the sub, thanks so much.
I know there existed strong migration from communist asia to eastern europe, anybody knows of some dish resulting from this movement? I guess i also didnt really think about what americans exported to the world, maybe theres some other cool dish like Budae Jiggae that was influenced by the american soldiers<7immigrants but adapted to local taste?
>>7705616
The Cuban sandwich is another:
Cuban expat joints in Florida came up with the Cuban sandwich, similar to the medianoche served in Havana, but with different bread. Those in close proximity to Italian immigrants included salami in it. As the sandwich traveled north it became popular with Puerto Rican and Dominican immigrants, who frequently replaced the mustard with mayo (often garlic mayo) and never even bothered with salami.
>>7705648
>>I know there existed strong migration from communist asia to eastern europe
When I was in Latvia there were quite a number of shashlik restaurants, and I assume they're found all over former Soviet. So central asians, in particular Uzbek food seems to have spread there.
>>7705648
Sure. Spam musubi. Look it up.
>>7705670
Ill definitely read up on hawai, this countries cuisine really is one huge meltingpot of recent migration.
>>7705656
I know theres many vietnamese in Czech Republik (Sapa is a famous vietnamese market/town close to prague), hungary and many more countries as a consequence of exchangeprograms during communism, would be super exiting to find a eastern european meal influenced by vietnamese or vice versa
>>7705656
just visited a friend of mine in riga btw, really enjoyed the food/products
>>7705656
>>7705695
>uzbek
>former soviet
Look up 'Korean carrot salad.' I'm pretty sure there are mentions of it in English, but if not, I can see if I can translate a Russian-language article for it.
It was developed by Korean migrants in central Asia and Eastern Europe, but is completely unknown to Korea. It's pretty good.
>>7705736
Wait Uzbekistan isn't former Soviet?
>>7705744
Oh, it is, it is. Sorry if my greentxt confused you. I meant it more to highlight that what will follow it is relevant to Soviet/Uzbek cuisine.
German migrants to Pennsylvania (Pennsylvania dutch) brought a lot of tradition with them.
>>7705323
Pizza
>>7705753
Swiss, actually. The Amish speak Alemannic, which is spoken outside fo Germany, most notably Switzerland and western Austria, rather than German itself (or even Dutch). Most Swiss German is Alemannic.
Rape
>>7705748
Oh alright, I honestly don't know that much about central Asia so I was insecure about that.
Anyway speaking of food that's not known in the original country I've only through /ck/ learned about the "swedish egg coffee". And I assure you as a swede that no single person in this country would know what the fuck it was.
>>7705757
This is true. Most PA Dutch speak with Swiss German accents.
>>7705768
Ah, it has about as much to do with Sweden as the manufacturing of quality furniture.
As far as I know, egg coffee has its roots in cowboy cuisine, with ranchers trying to find methods to clarify and/or filter coffee. Well, eggs can be used to clarify this and that, so why not eggs? And so they did.
The other explanation I've heard is that it's Hungarian in origin, but having never been to Hungary, I can neither confirm nor deny.
I'll say this, in my part of Italy, there is a coffee drink made with egg yolk and sugar. The two are beaten together to a smooth, uniform yellow then hot coffee is added, a drop at a time at first, then in a steady but thin stream, beating the yolk mixture all the while, to make a large foam. The foam is divided among serving cups then topped off with the liquid coffee left in the serving pot.
>>7705736
Awesome, exactly what i was looking for. Thanks so much for all the input, hope you guys still have a good time with this topic.
>>7705323
Californian/ southern states connected to mexico being influenced in food preferences (i.e texas chilli con carne, tacos/burritos in cali etc)
Instead of going with easy examples like the döner where a guy migrates to berlin and invents food inspired by his origins, you should go with more complex cases.
Try figuring out the origins of a hamburger.
>>7707108
>origins of a hamburger.
In the early part of the 19th Century there were carts selling beef patties cooked in butter to German sailors on the piers and by the docks in NYC. Credit for serving it as a sandwich is claimed by Louis Lunch in CT, where the burgers are cooked in a weird custom grill and served ob toasted white bread. The custom bun for the burger came later. It took some time after the Jungle to convince the public that ground beef was a safe food, but it eventually beat out the hot dog as the national fast food dish.
>>7707169
urban myth.
>>7707182
Louis Lunch exists, and those grills are from the late 19th Century. You're not going to find an older example of a burger that closely resembles its modern form.
Same is true for pizza in America. You can claim someone had to have made pizza in America before Lombardi's, but that coal oven is from 1905, and you really won't find a record of pizza in the US before then.
>>7705323
Not sure if it is relevant but a two guys from Bristol UK moved next door to me a couple months ago and they taught me how to make a great sausage roll. Now I make them for my lunches all the time.
>>7705323
Pastes (UK--->Mexico)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paste_%28pasty%29
>>7707330
>You're not going to find an older example of a burger that closely resembles its modern form.
How about ancient roman?
There are numerous accounts of beef patties served inbetween bread as streetfood in roman times, and even preserved recepies.
>>7707330
We have accounts of pizza with tomato, basil and cheese in Italy dating to at least the 1880s. It was brought to the US by Italian immigrants, then modified into the various regional sorts known throughout America today.
Louis' Lunch, however, is well-known for its invention of the hamburger sandwich.
>>7707424
Sure, but the history of how a particular food came about in a particular culture is what's interesting. You could, for example, trace the hot dog back to Germany, Denmark and Eastern Europe. But the reason the beef hot dog became the gold standard in the US and for a while the most American of foods is interesting. Doubly so if you contrast that with the history and various hot dog dishes popular in Latin America. The stories behind the Chicago hot dog, the Papaya Kind dog with Greek onions and the Coney are completely different from those behind the slachichas torta, slachipapas. and pic related.
It's not where the dish came from, but what happened to it when it popped up somewhere else. That's what I think OP was looking for in this thread.
>>7707490
There's no doubt pizza is Italian in origin. But making it in a coal oven with cow's milk mozzarella is American. And the degraded version, made in a gas oven with low moisture mozzarella and frequently topped with pepperoni is as uniquely American as a fucking chili dog.
>>7707526
That's odd. I didn't know you guys do coal ovens for pizza. Why not wood? Gas, I can understand (muh kuhnveenyintz), but coal over wood seems odd.
>>7707540
Coal ovens were the standard in NYC when the first Italian immigrants arrived here at the start of the 20th Century. To this day there are a bunch of coal oven pizza joints that have been grandfathered in to get around city pollution regulations in NYC. Lombadri's in Manhattan and Totonno's in Coney Island are two of the classics.
