Hey /an/
I bought a purebred Shiba Inu, show quality. Currently 13 weeks old.
She's on a breeding contract, and so far besides teething, she's great. She loves learning, already know a lot of tricks, but is having a little trouble leash training. ( I need some advice for that please )
I want to be a reputable breeder, and recently found out that for some reason it seems you 'need' to put your dog in the show ring for it to be show quality.
Her parents are champs, and she's been bred for show quality, but I don't understand why she'd need to enter in shows?
It seems like a big old people circle jerk to me.
Do I have to take her to a show? I live in a rather small city that doesn't do shows (I'd have to drive quite far for them). So if they ARE necessary, would there be another option to take her to a private judge as a different option.
I know there are people who show dogs for you for a fee, but I still think they're redundant.
OR TLDR: Convince me why I should show my purebred dog in the ring, she's meant to produce amazing pups in her future, and be an amazing companion.
( on iPod, not sure how big pic will be )
>>1999824
>for some reason it seems you 'need' to put your dog in the show ring for it to be show quality.
that's literally what show quality is
why do you need your dog to be show quality? answer: you don't, fuck off.
>she's meant to produce amazing pups in her future
now you can REALLY fuck off, future byb
>>1999826
I'm not going to become a byb
I'm going to follow the ethics and responsibilities that are being a reputable breeder.
I'm not breeding for the money, but for improving the breed.
I'm not going to raise puppies in a half assed diy dirty whelpinv box. But a clean and large whelping box with a dedicated room for when they are learning to walk.
I've learned all of the ethics, but it's never been clear to me if shows are necessary to show how amazing your dog is.
>>1999826
Also I should have worded that last part better and explained.
She's not going to become a breed mule. The original reason I wanted her on a breeding contract was because I hate spay/neutering pets. It'd be horrible if you lost your privates, right? And it also can damage how long they'll live, I just feel bad thinking about missing a few more possible years with a beloved animal.
I eventually started thinking that it'd be nice if she could experience having a family herself, since it was a possibility. I talked with the breeder, and she wouldn't have sold me the pup if she thought I wasn't responsible enough. And her daughter is our vet, so regular check ups are a thing.
>>1999829
>wants to become a breeder
>parrots whatever they can google about "how to be a reputable breeder"
>wants show quality dogs without showing them
>clearly not involved in the shiba breeding community enough to know about showing
>no mention of how much money they have saved up to even begin breeding
>no mention of health testing, just "lol clean whelping box and their own room c::"
I've seen you around before here. this is your first shiba and you have another non-shiba dog, right? only your first shiba and you're looking to breed? you got it with the intention of breeding?
>I'm not going to become a byb
surely you jest.
![8d4edb9e874d2a0534689912a6fc77483abaca7b0c1bf29069feb456f065ce51[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/xqDezDx.jpg "8d4edb9e874d2a0534689912a6fc77483abaca7b0c1bf29069feb456f065ce51[1].jpg")
>>1999832
>It'd be horrible if you lost your privates, right?
>I eventually started thinking that it'd be nice if she could experience having a family herself
now I see your true nature
there are a bunch of other things you can do to prove the dog is a quality dog but just because she does well at agility, herding, dock diving, search and rescue, whatever doesn't mean she is show quality till it is actually in a show and places well.
>>1999834
Got it. I now understand showing is a must.
I've been contacting and researching what I can do to do the best I can for breeding her. Yes she is my first Shiba but I've spent half a year researching the breed and asking people how they think it's like.
I know about health check ups and it's not going to be for another 1 year and 9 months before I start breeding her. I know that health problems can arise even after she's fully mature. Same goes for her future puppies. Shots, deworming, and proper brand food to get them going. Even emergency stuff and vitamins when they're whelping or when she's pregnant.
I'm beginning to save up for what's going to happen, I know how expensive it's going to be and how much time I'll have to invest in them to socialize, feed, clean up after, and check on th puppies. And care for my dog as well.
I'm just starting out here and wanted everyone's opinions and advice before I did anything.
Is there anything else I should worry about? I didn't really think I needed to mention anything about the health issues because I've thought of them as mandatory.
I've been wanting to try it and see if it was right for me. I've always loved dogs, and wanted to always improve the breed.
>>1999840
Show her you love her but actually loving her body. Most first time matings hurt because of the hymen. Knowledgeable breeders break it with their fingers and water based lube. Yes use gloves you don't want to give her an infection
>>1999848
I've seen that before in videos, and I will look into that more. Thanks friendo.
Animals life longer when fixed and are less risk of diseases. It causes the animal no harm. However for every pup she has there's one more puppy in a shelter that won't be adopted.
>>1999859
To be honest, I wouldn't want a shelter dog, or rather it wouldn't be my go to. They have no health guarantees and even when reformed from aggression if they had it, the next family to bring it in might trigger something that'll make it snap. I find there are too many risks and I would take a risk if I were older and had the amazing amount of money to cover the health costs of something happened.
The reason the majority of shelter animals exist are because of puppy mills and kitten mills, which have inbreeding and dirty kennels which create an ridiculous amount of death, disease, and sickness. Then the dog/cat you adopt die from whatever it came with a few years later. A short lived and struggling life.
Now I'm not saying I hate shelter pets. I donate and support those who do adopt and let them fly at it. Those animals deserve good families.
But there are people who would rather pay the extra grand to have a purebred puppy, because they favour the colour, size, temperament, etc. That's what reputable breeders are for. To make healthy, socialized, well temperament pups. To create the perfect family pet, bitch, stud, and/or specimen.
With the way things are now, puppy mills and kitten mills are being tackled down, people are adopting pets. Overpopulated cats are being spayed and neutered. And reputable breeders are creating the best possible pet for you, allowing the breed to become better and better.
My point is, some people don't want a shelter pet and would rather have a pet from a RB.
>>1999859
I see. Well, I'll definitely spayed her later in life. Thanks for searching that for me.
that is all fine and dandy except for saying the majority of pets at shelters are because of puppy/kitten mills. The vast majority are there because of irresponsible people breeding on purpose or accident. Then most of those puppies end up with more irresponsible people. Then they grow bored of their new puppy, move, have a kid, whatever other BS reason they can come up with and either dump them on some other idiot or at the shelter because it was just a $50 dog. Most are mutts. Even most of the purebred dogs at the shelter come from byb originally. Most of the idiots that buy a puppy from a puppy mill/pet store pay out the ass for them and are less likely to just dump them at the shelter. They try to sell them to get some of their money back and I guess eventually when it has been passed around enough and the going price is low enough it could end up at a shelter but it isn't that common. "I bought fluffy for $1200 from Petmills R Us and am selling her for $600. Such a good deal" if you are another idiot and plenty of people are.
OP if you want to breed her here's what you should do first to see if she would even be a suitable candidate:
-Pair up with an experienced breed mentor, someone who has been breeding for a long time and active in the national and regional breed clubs
-Join your national and regional breed club and attend club events
-Finish your dog's championship (conformation shows will give you an objective view of any structural or type deficiencies that might be passed on to the puppies)
-Obtain some kind of competitive obedience title (CD or RN--NOT JUST CGC), this will tell you whether your dog has any temperament or trainability issues that might be passed on to the puppies
-At 2 have the following health checks done: http://www.caninehealthinfo.org/brdreqs.html?breed=SHU (you should also have clear results from her ancestors at least three generations back)
IF you do all these things, AND you have the time and money, AND you have found a suitable stud who meets all the above criteria and offsets your bitch's faults, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY others with more knowledge and experience have told you that breeding her will make a post invite contribution to the gene pool THEN you can consider breeding her.
And never breed because "you want her to experience motherhood", that is not a thing. Birthing a litter is very stressful and never without risk, no dog should go through that without a good reason.
>>2000152
Thank you, anon. I'll be back posting in almost 2 years. Just you wait!
Just because both parent dogs were show quality doesn't inherently mean your dog is show quality.
For the continuation of the breed, at a minimum breed standard, you must be prepared to do health testing, and also accept that as your dog matures you may find that it presents one or more faults that would disqualify it completely from the show ring. Perhaps some of the adult teeth do not come in, perhaps the adult stance is wrong (which could indicate a decrease in the functionality of limb movement and is not something that can be ignored) or maybe the tail will curl too much.
The easiest way to learn if your dog has these flaws -- beyond learning the breed standard by heart -- is to enter shows and have an unbiased judge assess the animal. (Your eye will almost always been lenient, but you are nothing more than a BYB if you are unprepared to ensure the good continuation of genes, or the betterment of the breed, but would just breed any faulty dog, throwing more faults.)
Just learn to show. It isn't that unenjoyable.
>>1999829
>improving the breed,
Not to be a dick or anything, but;
Shiba Inu are already one of the healthiest, most sound breed of dog available. 'Show' quality dogs are usually unhealthy and shitty (just look at show GSD.)
Op you have an awful lot of easy to answer questions. Why didn't you do some research BEFORE getting the dog? Why isn't the breeder there answering these questions?
>>1999826
>why do you need your dog to be show quality? answer: you don't, fuck off.
But that's wrong you fucking retard. Pretentious breeders make it a prerequisite so that poor people can't breed their dogs for money like they do. Stop being another contrarian retard that just yells BYB when backed into a corner just to justify your shelter mutt who dies of displacea at 6 years.
>>2000152
>-Pair up with an experienced breed mentor, someone who has been breeding for a long time and active in the national and regional breed clubs
You can learn everything a "mentor" can teach you on the internet in a week.
>-Join your national and regional breed club and attend club events
Not everybody lives in Springfield, USA.
>-Finish your dog's championship (conformation shows will give you an objective view of any structural or type deficiencies that might be passed on to the puppies)
This means nothing for a healthy breed
>-Obtain some kind of competitive obedience title (CD or RN--NOT JUST CGC), this will tell you whether your dog has any temperament or trainability issues that might be passed on to the puppies
Temperament is not hereditary you fucking retard.
>-At 2 have the following health checks done: http://www.caninehealthinfo.org/brdreqs.html?breed=SHU (you should also have clear results from her ancestors at least three generations back)
Health checks are a pretty obvious thing to get done.
>>2000812
>keep poor people from breeding their dogs
yeah, and breeding dogs the responsible way (health testing isn't cheap) IS expensive you moron. cheap breeders are how backyards full of interbreeding siblings with numerous diseases sold on CL to whoever has enough cash, only to get dumped at a shelter, happen
are you the same guy getting butthurt in all the threads that have BYBs in them? get the fuck over it. BYBs are a problem that fills shelters and create other issues
>>2000815
OP only asked why taking your dog to a show matters, and it doesn't. It's just another arbitrary expense tacked on by these lowlife ranch wives like your mom.
>>2000814
BYB detected
>>1999824
Op, look at your dog's pedigree. Do you see all those little "ch's" in front of all the other dogs names? That means champion. As in they placed at a show. This is the only thing that determines show quality, is past lineage and accomplishments. If your breeder did not supply you with a pedigree, then I highly doubt your animal is show quality.
Also, if you need advice on how to leash train your animal then you are in no way ready to become a breeder. This anon>>1999836 may be right.
>>2000814
Certain aspects of temperament is hereditary you fucking retard
>>2001205
this. how do you think we got dogs in the first place?
