How smart are pigs really? Everyone says they're clever but I'm not convinced? Are they clever like rats that cat be trained to go through a maze or clever like Chimps that can figure out how to use tools, or clever like dolphins that can figure out how to rape?
All three actually.
>>1995887
Baby boars are so cute. Like little baby deer with snuffle faces.
Wild boar aren't very smart, even though their babies are much cuter and the adults look much cooler.
Domestic pigs are smart as fuck though. I am not sure why or how that happened.
>>1995968
Maybe when people were breeding wild for domestication way back then they also bred intelligence without knowing it
>>1995961
Too bad they grow up to be massive assholes. Oh well, it gives me something to hunt
https://youtu.be/2BNBWgMqn3A
There was an experiment in which they gave 40 piglets 3 syllable names. Later when they grew up they called them out for food with a speaker so that only the right-named pig could eat. And it worked.
It was also confirmed that they are capable to recognize themselves in a mirror like apes or dolphins.
Mangalitsa/mangalica pigs are born with stripes. These manga/red wattle crosses were born with a plaid pattern. Although it's pretty hard to see, Manga moms are pretty aggressive so I couldn't take as many pictures as I'd like.
Pigs are incredibly smart. Incredibly social. Incredible animals really. They're trainable, they don't really use tools like chimps because they don't have hands but they're smart in the same way because they can learn how to operate gates, clasps, buttons, pig operated feeders/waterers and can escape from almost anything. And they certainly know how to rape.
I think a lot of people don't recognize immediately the intelligence of a pig for several reason. Probably reason number one is that most pigs are badly kept for industrial farming. Also the way they interact with their world is by snuffling through it with their noses which doesn't appear clever at first glance. And they're loud. And they're also kind of creepy sometimes, they make creepy noises and they will happily lap up the blood of a comrade slaughtered right in front of them. They aren't like cats, dogs, or even apes. They're another kind of creature.
>>1996315
yeah, they seem to be lacking empathy.
But there was a recent study in which they triggered a group of pigs to either stress or positive emotions. If you put untriggered pigs into this group they will also state to show these emotions.
maybe their feels get fucked up due to wrong conditions and too much stress.
>>1996339
Very possible. Incidents of cannibalism vastly rise in overcrowding. So certainly a lot of it is probably just that. That and maybe they're just so food driven that is trumps any social behavior even though they're normally pretty socially complex. Because my hogs have a ton of space and they don't ever bite tails or anuses but still if something bleeds they're going to eat it and it can be kind of morbid. But is easily manageable enough. It's just a little silence-of-the-lambs-y creepy. I can see where it may have been an evolutionary advantage for them to be like this though.
>>1996339
>maybe their feels get fucked up due to wrong conditions and too much stress
Ya think? Domesticated pigs are kept in some of the most deplorable conditions of any animal.
>>1996345
the piglets at my uncles always seemed friendly and into humans.
Do they get dangerous when they grow bigger?
Would your pigs eat you alive if you'd cut your finger?
>>1996398
No, they're not so vicious. I've heard a lot of tall tales about pigs eating people who drunkenly black out in the pens or eating one another alive if they fall and break a leg but that's a bunch of bull. If you cut your finger in their pen they would maybe try to lick the blood and give an experimental nip but they'd respond to you reacting to it in pain and fuck off unless they were very crowded and stressed out maybe. If you cut your finger and blacked out in their pen they might really fuck up your hand. But they really only will start to eat something when it has died, when they can bite at it and it doesn't react in pain. That's when they'll cannibalize for real. Otherwise it only happens when they are very crowded and they will bite each other's tails and sometimes their anuses blast out when they're crowded and stressed (I know gross) and they'll tear at that and really mess that pig up. But if a pig or a human is just injured they will not fuck with it other than to prevent it from eating simply by out-competing.
This is Jerry, he got paralyzed in his back when his mom sat on him. It was her first litter. No one at him and with love and steroids he made it to slaughter.
They can get dangerous in other ways though. Like if you have a good mother pig and you grab up one of her piglets she may leap a 5 foot fence just to come try to gore you. And some breeds are more aggressive like the Mangas. They are perfectly nice to me but vicious to roving dogs and strangers.
>>1996464
>No one at him and with love and steroids he made it to slaughter.
This just sounds like severe human mental illness to me.
>Oh that poor thing. Let's help it. Then kill it and eat it.
>>1996549
He had a pretty good quality of life for his 6 months of life after about 2 weeks of being separated he got to go back and just had a bit of a stiff leg. Would it be better to just off any food animal the second it was in less than perfect health because you were just going to kill it anyway? Because that sounds more mentally unstable to me and also a great way to lose money.
I love all my pigs and make sure they have the best quality of life possible running under the sun and through the grass, produce them in the most ecologically ethical manner possible, until they are slaughtered as humanely as possible and made into delicious organic pork products. If they are sick, I nurse them back to health. If their quality of life is too bad, I euthanize them and bury them/grind them up for dog food.
It is only the modern separation of food production and food consumption that makes this feel "unnatural" to people unaccustomed to it. To those who produce "natural" non-intensively produced animal meats it feels very natural and normal to love and care for animals and then to eat them knowing you've done it right.
I don't mean to rant, you may have meant that light-heartedly and jokingly.
>>1996559
Not that guy, just a curious passerby. Do you ever feel sad when you kill your animals, or miss them when they're gone? Is it ever difficult for you at all - do you ever make "exceptions" for animals you particularly like and give them a more pet-ish role until they die naturally?
>>1996559
Do you eat your grandparents also? I mean, hell, just because you love them, that's no reason to not eat kill them and eat them, even though there's absolutely no good reason to do so and it's not necessary in the slightest, right?
>>1996595
Yes, the sows and boars generally. You have them year in and year out. You have a working relationship with them. You respect and befriend them. I don't personally kill my own pigs usually because to sell them they have to be slaughtered in a federally inspected facility, but there is always a sadness on slaughter day. Or a bitter sweetness, anyway.
These pigs with my dog were orphaned and I bottle raised them all. Many of them are still with me as sows and two boars but the ones that were slaughtered were really difficult I couldn't load them up or be there. They definitely count as exceptions although they aren't pets because the two sows in the litter really weren't the breeding quality I'd usually need if I kept them over but I was attached so now they're breeders but only as a means to earn their keep because I like them.
>>1996655
That's the most absurd, alarmist and sensationalist comparison you could make. There are many reasons why it is silly, but for one there is a very serious reason why you should not eat your grandparents. Or even why you shouldn't eat great apes. If you eat humans you can get kuru, mad cow disease for humans. If you eat either you can get any numerous terrible diseases because anything in their body is perfectly adapted to invade your own.
And also shit, I love the pigs but not like I love my grandparents.
>>1996687
>That's the most absurd
Of course you want to think that. You love your cognitive dissonance. You get to kill animals for your own pleasure AND think you have the high moral ground. You're wrong. It is NEVER necessary for a human to eat an animal. We don't require it. You do it because you want to. And there is absolutely nothing inconsistent about what I said. You said so yourself, just because you love something, that shouldn't stop you from killing and eating it.
>but for one there is a very serious reason why you should not eat your grandparents
Why? Give me one reason you shouldn't that doesn't also apply to every other animal. And "humans are special snowflakes" isn't a reason. They're just gonna die anyway, they're past breeding capacity and they just use up resources. If we don't eat them they'll get overpopulated so we should be able to bow hunt them. Besides, I like nature, that means I should be allowed to kill and eat your grandparents. It's not like they have feelings like I do or anything.
You get kuru by eating brain matter of an infected person. When you discover mad cow disease in cows, you don't eat them. It's that simple. You kind of just invalidated your own argument.
>And also shit, I love the pigs but not like I love my grandparents.
I don't care if you love grandparents and want to "humanize" them. I'm gonna hunt them, hippie.
>>1996824
not who youre replying to, but in the end, its because i want to. and no laws prevent me from doing so. so i will keep doing it.
dont you have some vegan rally to go to?
>>1996687
Man, I love my animals but they're just so delicious...
>>1996655
>hurr durr killing a pig is the same as killing one of your parents
>>1996824
>I don't care if you love grandparents and want to "humanize" them.
>I don't care if you "humanize" humans
The fuck am I reading
>>1995968
Wild pigs are smart as fuck, dude. People here (east Texas) used to hunt them at night with spotlights until the pigs figured out that bright lights=gunfire=dead pigs. After that, you could scare them off with a flashlight. Then, people started using green spotlights. The pigs supposedly couldn't see that spectrum, but they figured it out pretty quickly. Now, flipping on any light around here makes them run. They also figured out how to knock over deer feeders by leaning on and collapsing one leg. They can even bump off cattle feeders.
Wild pigs are smart bastards.
>>1997028
Do you think pigs and crows are on the same level of intelligence?
If you somehow found a way to equalize everything except for mental capacity, who would win in a competition for food/survival, a crow or a wild pig?
>>1996824
I just gave you a very serious specific scientific reason, every human disease and virus passes effortlessly from human to human, to eat dead humans would create all manner of epidemics. Look at what the consumption of bushmeat does to Africa and that's with great apes. This is why there is an evolutionary disadvantage and taboo against eating deceased humans. Deceased humans aren't healthy, it isn't a good idea to eat them. Even cancers can occasionally leap host to host if they have the same type of cells. It would be a terrible idea.
Als humans are humans so of course you can humanize them. They're a full order of intelligence and empathy above pigs.
>>1997038
Crows are damned near people-smart. Like, they can recognize masked humans who antagonized other crows that they themselves never met. Crows actually pass learned material down. How, I haven't a clue. But they damned sure do. Ever seen a crow hit by a car? I never have. Even though they hang out in roads all day.
Pigs aren't that smart, but they're not dumb. They learn quickly and well, though.
>>1997052
>Ever seen a crow hit by a car? I never have
>drive from one state to another
>middle of no where
>dead kangaroos literally everywhere, thousands of them
>crows/eagles feasting on corpses
>goats chilling by side of road
Mfw the only thing that ever gets hit are the damn kangaroos. Even the goats are smart enough to stay off the road.
>>1996824
You sound incredibly retarded.
>>1995887
just like dogs. maybe even smarter.
you tell it 'no' and 'bad' just like a dog and it listens. it'll be protective of the yard. mine use to ram the fence when people got too close. it would get out sometimes and come back like a dog. we built it a little house and kept it ouside with some blankets and one night it got wrapped up in it and beat down the house trying to free itself and woke the whole house up squealing. we gave it away to a farm because eventually it ate too much damn food and the whole situation became ridiculous. it was fun though.
>>1997038
The crow, probably. Not necessarily because the pig would be stupid in any way, but merely because crows are among the most intelligent animals there are. Some even claim them to have ape-level intelligence.
>>1996946
Or man I love my animals but I just have to eat to survive. You fucking illogical yuppie.
>>1996824
Jesus, you're the kind of autistic fuck that gives animal lovers a bad name.
>>1996824
>It is NEVER necessary for a human to eat an animal.
Top kek.
>>1996824
>I don't care if you love grandparents and want to "humanize" them. I'm gonna hunt them, hippie.
That sounds like conspiracy to murder, that could easily be 5-10 years. Fortunately for you, no animals will be harmed for the hearty semen diet you'd be eating.
>>1997052
Crows have been known to use cars to crack open nuts they can't open themselves.
>>1995968
>yfw deliciousness is directly proportional to intelligence
>>1996269
Do pigs wag their tail when they're excited like dogs do?
>>1996276
Even ants can do that when you put a spec of paint on them they freak out and touch themselves.
>>1996559
Love you pig-anon. I buy my meat from someone a lot like you in Illinois. Thank you for providing people a more sustainable choice. I wish you the best.
>>1999680
to be fair, theres a difference between feeling paint on you, and looking in a mirror and seeing it.
>>1997064
That's sad as fug. There are plenty that learn though. Kangaroos that is.they haven't had as much exposure as marsupials. They've been removed from other types of mammals and man's bullshit.
>>1999697
Look it up. They use the mirror tests and the ants notice the paint on them then.
>>1999700
Well, it was one study, that hardly means anything.
>>1999696
Oh geez, I love you even more. Keep doing what you do please. You're helping people while living the life you choose, and your choice happens to be full of love and compassion. You prove those militant vegans wrong by loving your animals and giving meat consumers a chance to be sustainable as well. I've probably bought half a hog from you, but I won't ask you to disclose yourself. Just know I'm the type to buy half a hog from small farmers instead of buying into the cheap factory farmers even though I don't make much money. You provide the moral choice and I wouldn't eat pigs without you, anon.
>>1999704
That dismissive attitude means nothing and proves you didn't even bother to look up the study.
>>1999705
Much love to you too, anon, your existence makes mine possible!
>>1999712
That's just science anon. One study means almost nothing. The next study may very well show the opposite. One study is simply anomalous. When there have been 10 we will talk.
>>1999733
>One study means almost nothing.
not him, I have no idea what you're arguing.
but we don't publish follow-up studies that repeat and confirm existing results.
so one study is as good as fact until someone comes along and contradicts it.
>>1999733
oh, nevermind.
you're talking about that ant thing published in a fake journal.
I love how you pretend to know how science works but don't even look up the impact factor on the journal he cites.
it's fake.
not science at all.
>>1996824
spotted the vegan
>>1999680
pigs did not react to that kind of mirror test.
7 out of 8 pigs just used the mirror to find a hidden source of food.
>>1997052
Crows also go fishing by tossing bread in the water, they use tools by curving wire into hooks to get certain things (because no hands kek), and they have their own games.
>>1999680
>Even ants
you're saying this as if ants are some sort of inferior species.
you realize they have the highest brain to body mass ratio in the entire animal kingdom right.
>>2000097
You realize brain to body mass ratio isn't the ultimate test of intelligence right. Don't speak like an authority when you aren't one.
For the record, ants are impressive as hell for making up so much of the world's animal biomass.
Too bad this is a pig thread. Go make an ant thread.
>>2000100
>You realize brain to body mass ratio isn't the ultimate test of intelligence right
you realize no one was claiming this right.
>for making up so much of the world's animal biomass.
that's the least impressive thing they've done.
once again you managed to add absolutely nothing to a thread other than baseless assumptions, congratulations.
>>2000094
From what I've heard they also understand the concept of water displacement, which is something we can't grasp until the age of 6.
>>2000103
fuck off
>>2000103
>once again you managed to add absolutely nothing to a thread other than baseless assumptions, congratulations.
speaking to yourself again, faggot?
