Is there any truth to the whole alpha and beta male thing? It seems the people who care about it are all insecure in some way. Can you really put people in groups like that?
I think it paints a very simple picture of what a man should or shouldn't be and I'm not sure what to think of it.
>>16908627
In terms of biology yes, it's a real thing. For instance, a troop of gorillas will have one dominant male, refered to as the alpha.
In terms of young, inexperienced guys spouting off online, there's some crap where they think they can be a dominant male without every interacting with any other males, or they think they can be part of a group where everyone is the dominant male. I think they get it from those "want to pick up chicks? just give me your entire life savings and I'll tell you how!" pop-ups you get when you download unverified torrents.
not really
>>16908744
that's gorillas. Humans are markedly different than gorillas.
OP like every good lie there's a grain of truth to it, but really - it's all bullshit. People are way too individualistic, society is too large (basically: you can just float to some other social group at will) and the idea is way too simplistic.
chicks do dig confidence though
>>16908627
No, not really. It's basically just people that are secure and people that are insecure. Being secure takes on a ton of different forms, and there is no "alpha" where a singular type of person is more successful than the others.
It doesnt exist, you silly goose.
>>16908627
Course not, you fucking moron.
It's that for robotic autists like us, it easier make sense of life that way.
To an extent.
It boils down to confidence.
Confidence = attractive = girls like you. Call that alpha if you want.
No confidence = not attractive = girls don't like you. And girls will call boys "beta" behind their backs on social media and stuff, I've seen it.
Lifting weights and treating girls like shit isn't really "alpha" or confident behavior it's just aiming for the bottom, you WILL get plenty of ass doing that but it won't make you happy because it's just sex and not an emotional connection.
Theres a slight bit of truth to them, that being said people look way too deep into it nowadays and try too hard to be alpha, when in reality thats the opposite of alpha. You need to realize "Alpha" is different for different people in different situations. But generally, some good guidelines id say to follow would just be to stay confident and in control, but also just realize life isnt all black and white and their will certainly be times where the line between alpha and beta is blurred.
>>16908627
In this context, It's still only a term for comparing different people in a group
>>16908852
>Confidence = attractive = girls like you. Call that alpha if you want.
no no no, you've messed up the order!
>Attractive= confidence= girls like you
>>16909350
Not really, a fat guy who loves himself will always do better with women than a gymrat who hates himself. They can smell insecurity.
>>16909489
Nope. This what PUAs teach so people will drop three grand to hang out with them, but in reality, if you're ugly, there's only so much you're going to be able to do about it, and you'll always have to think of someone else to get off with the beasts you can slay.
>>16909524
have you had sex before
No.
It doesn't paint a picture of what a man should or shouldn't be at all. Society does that. It's survival of the fittest not survival of the /fit/est.
Women do have a large bias towards attractive males in both their reply/message rate on dating sites and in real life. There's animal research that shows the fact that only 20% of males reproduce in nature. It doesn't project perfectly on human society because we have all these laws, standards (monogamy mainly) and our world is smaller, you don't stick to your group as chimps would.
Pic related is a very nice graph to show you how women appreciate men and how men appreciate women. Sorry I couldn't find one without the subtext (not from okcupid). I don't mean to bring that up. It's just a nice presentation. But the statement about
This graph does not mean that women don't settle. Everyone settles. But the gap between the sexual interactions with females have been tending towards 'alphas' getting all the action and betas getting less. Of course since it's usually 1+1 in bed the fact of the matter isn't that women stopped sleeping with betas. It's that they stopped sleeping with betas and started sleeping with alphas.
I don't see why people are so willfully dishonest about this. It's plain as day really. Unless I'm misunderstanding the alpha-beta terminology. Another point to bring up is that in real life situations since betas have a higher chance of rejection their confidence is usually going to diminish. Which is unattractive. So betas actually make themselves more unattractive, alphas either retain confidence or get more. So that's an alternative way to explain alpha-beta. This okcupid study doesn't account for that. There's no user interaction so it's just based on looks.
>I don't think okcupids men are pretty enough, despite what that subtext said
Look it up.
Personally I consider the male graph more ideal. It reflects the situation better and leads to more total satisfaction if we were both like this.
>>16908627
no there's no such thing as alpha and beta
everyone is beta to a degree, some much more than others, but the "most interesting man in the world" alpha male that never spills his spaghetti does not exist
>>16909724
I'm so sick of the lack of respect for other people that makes you think it's OK to lie to them in spite of the facts. This bias is massive.
Your best hope if you're not seeing success is lose weight/gain muscle (depending on if you're skeleton or not). Gain confidence via that or other stuff. Consciously make an effort of being a confident nice dude and never stop trying. There's no reason not to. If you're only concerned with your own success. But for the most part there's no drawback other than girls going on Twitter and bragging about how they're soo fawned over all the time it's bothering them.
They're complaining about being complimented on their looks all the time. You probably can't even imagine that as a male. I get them so rarely (without being active/initiating) that I get caught off guard. Might aswell punch me in the gut and tell me I take a punch well. I'd have about as good success to reply to that successfully.
Alpha beta is a fallacy. If other guys think you're good with women, you're an alpha. If you're an alpha, then people will perceive you as being good with women.
>>16909741
You're not describing a fallacy you're describing a feedback loop (not psychology use, the general use).
Unless you're saying this has no effect on women (or men, same thing applies). Which is plain wrong.
I never hit these threads early enough to make an impact..
I should probably make a pasta.
>>16908852
>confidence - > attractiveness - > girls like you
No clearly confidence and attractiveness should be swapped.
>>16908627
>Is there any truth to the whole alpha and beta male thing?
Like most social movements that catch on in any significant way, there is a kernel of insight that can be found if you dig deeply enough.
In the alpha/beta think, that kernel of truth is as follows: if you allow your fear of getting rejected prevent you from asking women out, you will not get any girls. Betas are just their word for people who fear rejection too much. Alphas are everyone else.
>It seems the people who care about it are all insecure in some way.
Yeah, pretty much.
>Can you really put people in groups like that?
Sure you can. It's not a useful thing to do, most of the time, but that doesn't stop people from doing it.
>>16909927 see >>16909489
We all know that fat guy who's always banging hot girls.
Being confident is what makes you attractive, male body is less important.
Confident guys get women, self-hating guys do not. You can scream "alpha and beta don't exist" all you want but this fact remains.
