How can I acquire unstoppable drive? How is it possible to keep going in spite of disappointments, insecurities and terrible odds?
Has anyone here who was a fucked up slacker managed to change this much?
I'd like to learn from those who have personal experience with this, not random opinions.
>>17253253
How old are you? On top of that, are there people in your life that believe in you?
If so, then I think I can help you.
Heres a life secret: Make it personal. Take that shit to heart and make it personal. Not in a retarded cute way. Personal as in you'll get pissed off or upset at yourself if you don't accomplish day in and day out. If you become your own biggest critic, then nothing can stop you.
>>17253269
29. Vaguely, yeah, in the sense that they'd believe anything, it's indifferent. They're in the same boat, but they don't care.
I made something of myself with this: Give yourself 5 seconds of bravery each day.
That's really all it takes to start a job application or ask out a pretty girl.
>>17253270
I find that being self-critical is a lot easier than not being brought down by self-criticism. How do you remain strong under heavy fire from your inner critic? A common advice is to silence it, but the most productive people seem to be those who are not deeply hurt by an exceptionally active and demanding inner critic.
>>17253391
What if the challenge takes more than 5s to complete? How do you overcome the growing emotional discomfort hour after hour?
>How can I acquire unstoppable drive
Believing in yourself; seriously.
>How is it possible to keep going...
One way is to think about the reward. It should feel good to do something and see the result and know that YOU were the one who did it.
Ego (the Freud one) is important. There is a singular voice in your mind that is you and is no one else. Not God, not your Mommy, not your SO, not your boss, not Ghandi or Machiavelli or Facebook. It's the mind created by the brain in your head.
Don't *trick* yourself into doing things. Start being more intentional.
It's 7am on a Monday and you have to go to your shitty job. Figure out why you're going to your shitty job, then take a shower (wash your ass), put on some khakis, tie your shoes (two knots), and get out of the door. Remember who is doing these things and why ($15/hour*8hours=$120 (less tax/withholdings).
There is an action (going to work) and a result ($). You are in between. You are the moment between the striking and the fire.
>in spite of disappointments...
Be logical and realize that a big part of what makes something disappointing is a misalignment between your idea of reality and reality itself.
Failed a test? If you tried hard enough during the test, then you didn't study hard enough. You didn't know what you didn't know. (re-read that, it's a salient point).
> ...insecurities...
Accepts the facts.
I'm a bit chubby (~15 pounds overweight). I still look good. I'm not a fox! Though I look better than I was; 4 years ago it was ~35 pounds overweight.
I have a bald spot. My hair doesn't look as good as some other people. So what. I still attract people. Now I have a man bun. It looks better than it was.
Something becomes an insecurity when you let it disproportionally affect your self-worth.
Fatalism is bad: "Oh I can never lose weight" "Oh my hair will never look good."... bullshit. Either stop caring or fix it. Both solutions are good. Never delude yourself
>>17253402
My point is that the first 5 seconds are the most uncomfortable. It's the difference between starting a productive day or sitting on your ass for the next 12 hours.
(continued)
> terrible odds?
Don't play when you don't like the odds. You're worth more than that.
And if the odds are always against you, then change the game. It's not some Hallmark bullshit phrase; changing the game is fucking critical. Successful people always know how to create the third option (don't be an asshole though; you're a person, so if you hurt other people you're hurting yourself, ontologically speaking).
>I'd like to learn from those who have personal experience with this, not random opinions.
I don't think that I was ever a fucked up slacker. But I realized from an early age what the world was and start re-evaluating my shit.
I knew there was no man in the sky who would figure my shit out for me. Or that my parents would just bail me out.
First and foremost, rely on yourself. Not strong enough yet? Start working on it.
> "Nothing is permanent." -- some wise dude
When you understand what this means and are also able to avoid nihilism, then you are on the right path.
>>17253426
Is there a mental strategy to build pain tolerance that doesn't involve sticking to small increments? An attitude shift, a qualitative change with better results than brushing your teeth with your inept hand.
>>17253451
not that anon that you're replying to.
no, increasing things in small increments leads inevitably to those attitude shifts. as that happens those small increments become exponentially larger until you find your self running up that set of stairs you were wallowing in front of when you started.
what is your purpose anon? are you living just to live or are you living for a reason? what mark do you want to leave? anything is possible (within reason, before i hear that defeatist "wah not everything is possible" argument. I could literally endeavor to build a skyscraper tomorrow and so long as I make the right connections and work to prove myself to those connections I can make it happen. anything. is. possible.) find the reason you want to live and constantly work towards it, taking whatever steps you can.
>>17253451
>Is there a mental strategy to help build pain tolerance...
Only go through pain when you feel like it's a good exchange.
Determine whether the menial/difficult/challenging task that you are doing is worth the potential reward.
Say you're practicing piano. Practice until you have to do something else or you don't want to anymore. When you stop practicing, think about why you are stopping. When you start, think about why are starting.
Your conception of drive seems to be really focused around pain. Like there is some amount of pain (emotional/physical) that you have to bear to get what you want. As if determination is simply the ability to bear pain.
If there is a way to get what you want without enduring pain (and without being a total prick by stealing/cheating) then do it that way. Because that's the smart way to do it.
>>17253253
Think about it like this
You have one life
That's an average of 70 years
70 years to experience everything this universe has to offer
Relative to the universe, you are nothing, but neither is anyone else
Life is so insignificant that you should stop caring and just do it, there is literally nothing to lose
>>17253519
>what is your purpose anon?
Oddly enough, to figure out self-determination thoroughly. I think the disconnect between understanding and action is what leads to most of the misery we experience individually and socially.
You live on as the person you are, if you accept that then you can live in this world with no regrets
>>17253528
My conception of drive as (largely) being able to overcome pain (well, adversity) comes from observing athletes and reading about extremely productive people, who tend to be self-critical to an unhealthy degree and yet keep working on their goals, whereas most people would give up due to the pressure. This form of resilience seems to be an essential element.
>>17253554
Correct.
I was ultra depressed throughout my teenage years. I had no drive, and I only wanted to waste time, drink, a few different drugs, vidya, etc. At best, I had a shit job at a grocery store putting people's purchases into bags for them. Slept with a fat chic to lose my virginity at 18, then not again until 21 or 22.
Ultimately, I just got tired of it one day. I hated being a loser. I started to envision those cliche scenes in movies: gigantic building collapsing, everything rubble and dust - but wait! Out of that comes the hero, flying and unstoppable even by all the shit and obstacles everywhere.
I don't know why, it just makes me feel good. And I'm not a visual thinker either.
Another thing is that I always push myself to consider that cliche saying, something to the effect of "if you don't try, you're guaranteed never to succeed". That works with everything from job applications, to fucking women, to meeting with executives over lunch. (who you know is not as important as who knows you)
One more: I always shoot for the stars. Even if I only make it half way up, I've already climbed tremendously higher than someone who was satisfied with a lower goal. Who cares about actually achieving the goal anyway if it's not a high goal?
Anyway, I've had people describe me as the most driven person they know. I make a good salary for my age (30), I'm constantly receiving awards at work.
You may need something unique to you but this is what works for me.
Remember that you are just an animal, and an animal is just a build up of chemical reactions maintaining homoeostasis.
All you do is what you are. Treat things as though they are a habit you have had for years. It can be difficult to do something if you think of it as hard or new, but if it is just the usual, if it just a part of what you do then it is natural to do it.
>>17253983
Assuming what you say is true, this is the kind of reply I'm looking for. Thanks.
>>17254015
Makes sense. A lot of difficulty is artificial.
>self-reliance
>picture of a guy who owes his entire legacy to government handouts and access to unfree labor
I can't really give proper advice because I'm a chronic procrastinator, but I have a friend who's a pretty good example of this.
No one would at first think that he's got that drive, because he seems super chill and not particularly ambitious, but I've known him for 6 years and during that time he's gotten everything he's wanted and done whatever he's set out to do. Instead of being "driven" really, he once explained that it's all just about setting realistic goals and working towards them slowly and surely by finding the best means to get there. If the first steps are easy enough to achieve it builds confidence and the odds that the next attempt at something bigger will succeed as well.
It made sense so I kinda use that as my own guideline now. Know your own strengths and what you can and cannot do and set your ambitions and life goals so that you have realistic chances of achieving it.
>>17253253
its internal, and its inherent. you know you gotta do something, so you do it. if you cant naturally do that you wont find a way to do it.
and assuming there was a process to get that motivation, you wouldnt be motivated enough to use that process now would you?
>>17253253
>How can I acquire unstoppable drive?
Stop masturbating
>>17255376
How has that worked out for you?
>>17253253
>How can I acquire unstoppable drive?
cocaine
>>17255460
I acquired unstoppable drive to keep going in spite of disappointments, insecurities and terrible odds.
>>17255517
>>17255517
Perseverance.
When you prove them wrong and realize your true potential.
People have been kicking shit in my face since I was a kid, I was bullied because I did better in school and happened to be prettier than others.
I grew up relying on the few friends and family members I had, I never made a decisions on my own, when girls said they liked me I'd reply with "ok" because the thought of someone actually appreciating me was just out of my mind, it didn't even exist, that's how fucked up I was.
Then I got my first job and had to take responsibility and start thinking for myself, I worked hard and became pretty depressed, seeing no change or hint of direction in life, but I'm so glad I kept going.
After about a year I had saved up a bit of money and decided to spend it all on traveling, which was the best decision I've ever made. I met some amazing like-minded people and after a while I realized that I'm actually a person as well, I realized that I'm better than all these pieces of shit that have pushed me down throughout the years and that realization fueld me like nothing else.
I want to find peace and a place to belong and I'm doing good, I've met a wonderful girl, I'm working hard, I try to help those I feel like have soul, I practice my hobby in my spare time and I feel like I'm learning something everyday.
>>17255517
kys
My driving force was misery.... Pushed past the suicide phase because I decided to try and get to a better spot and if I was still miserable then I'd off myself.. However I was a drunk for 3ish years.. Don't have a highschool education or any college.. Ever since I was a child I've been miserable sharing a living space with people so all I've ever wanted to do was live alone. That paired with misery became my driving force... And the harsh truth is that the best way to get somewhere in life is through connections. I'm a homeowner under the age of 25 and make just under 80k a year.. All through connections.
Insecurities will get you absolutely nowhere.. They serve no purpose and realizing this is the first step in accomplishing whatever you're after.
>>17256064
but I stopped tripfigging, also see
>>17255476
Learned Optimism by Martin Seligman
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://duniahartanto.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/ebooksclub-org__learned_optimism__how_to_change_your_mind_and_your_life.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwisyaXt8qrNAhULKh4KHU3SDuwQFggaMAA&usg=AFQjCNGrZlPiqlBtfmv6zX9CxbsnR4hevg
>>17255197
Don't listen to this anon, it's complete bullshit.
Drive is essentially discipline. And the ONLY way to acquire discipline is to practice it, the same way you'd practice any skill.
The key is persistence. You need to understand that your brain is easily conditioned and right now, following years of procrastination - it's conditioned to procrastinate and look for reasons NOT to do things.
Start small, set day-to-day goals for yourself. For instance - make your bed the moment you get up in the morning. Then go on to more difficult things like doing some stretches or a light workout in the morning.
Also: it helps if you're forced into an environment in which you have no choice but to act, ie a certain job, university or military.
>>17256778
>>17259259
thats literally what i said though faggot.
you know what you have to do, and you do it. what you said doesn't change that at all. it still requires actually doing it.
saying 'baby steps' doesnt change what i said. its inherent and its internal. there isnt some magic combo that does it.
>>17259630
>thats literally what i said
>"if you cant naturally do that you wont find a way to do it."
No, it's the exact opposite of what you said, you halfwit. Discipline is not something that you either have naturally or don't have at all, as you made it seem.
And taking baby steps is crucial in training discipline because it's easy to get overwhelmed at the beginning and feel discouraged because of it.
You clearly don't know what you're talking about - so stop giving shit advice.
I used to play MMOs 14 hours a day and barely leave the house
Somehow I got a job as a stock trader after uni though I'm a quant now, thinking of getting into hedge funds while thinking of business ideas
My motivation is giving money to medical research - life is just a game where I'm trying to avoid game over to me.
>>17260579
>Quant
so you're a techie or you actually develop trading systems that use fundamentals-based inputs?
are you a BridgeWater or a Renaissance type of quant?
>>17261667
I work on trading strategies in the areas my company has chosen to focus on but most of it is very low tech and dull really. The vast majority of the work is maintenance/making small changes instead of new development and the industry as a whole is very static and honestly not very interesting except for the paycheck (maybe about 1.5x what you can get from Google etc. with the same level of skills).
It's fine if you want to save a few million and retire somewhat early. Entrepreneurial types should look elsewhere unless it's just a stepping stone. At least the discretionary prop traders of old got the opportunity to learn lots about the economy and big businesses which they could use to start their own companies in other industries - quants/developers don't get that perk.
>>17261667
While I would like an Renaissance salary and access to their fund, I know I'd go crazy stuck on Long Island for years or decades with nothing to but sit in a mansion or the office surrounded by no one but rich nerds.
I'm bored and kinda isolated as it is already. I'd rather find friends to make a company together with in a more dynamic industry even though part of my brain tells me that mixing feelings with making money might not be most rational. That search continues.
>>17261714
I develop custom software for retail traders myself. I'm also developing semi-discretionary systems mostly for commodities and currencies.
Interesting how your outlook on the industry is so soul crushing. In my experience the absurdly tough competition push investors to favor quants/devs for fundamentals-based methods.
Would you mind telling what company/area you're working in that's so dull? My impression is you've ended up grinding out hedging strategies.
I don't even want to think about the M:F ratio at these hedge funds.
I'd probably hardly ever get a chance to talk to a girl outside of marriage ever again...
>>17261748
>make a company together with in a more dynamic industry
So start you're own hedge fund/manage a few client portfolios with a few friends.
Low capitalization and a specialized approach puts the chances of beating markets/zirp on your side.
>>17261754
Horrendous M/F ratio. Most banker/hedgef traders are macho fuckwits.
On the flip side quant strat dev is pretty STEM so few women even try to start with.
Funny thing is female traders tend to perform better (median) because they lack a predisp to impulsive decisions.
>>17261750
What I work on admittedly doesn't involve much deep, non-formulaic math. Don't wanna say where I work but the pay is good vs. the living costs in the area.
I've studied math for almost a decade now so the attraction of high level methods has kind of worn off for me. (Neural networks? more like a few linear regressions stuck together, big deal.) I'm more interested in the value I can impart on the world now rather than precisely how I do it. Entrepeneurship seems like a deeper and more rewarding logical puzzle than working for Renaissance could ever be.
>>17261748
I don't understand what you do, so disregard the following if it doesn't apply to your situation.
I find that thinking about money frequently, like thinking about sex frequently, generates unnecessary insecurity and an inflated need of these things. It takes a toll.
A job in which the focus is on value creation could be more fulfilling.
>>17261784
Even if it had money as a strong consideration in its selection.
>>17261784
Yes, exactly
hey op, i remember having that once. it's great when you really have nothing else going for you and you want to make something of yourself.
i was at a really low point in life. i was ugly, no friends, no boyfriend, family was ashamed of me, people looked down on me or made fun of me, socially awkward, etc. i even failed to get into the college i wanted to get into twice, which was what started my intense progress of self-improvement.
what drove me is to prove those mother fuckers wrong and i was determined to show everyone they were wrong about me and that i would be someone they wished they didn't treat like i was worthless or embarrassing. i guess i was just angry and wanted to stop hating myself.
i knew i had to start from somewhere, so i began the slow grind on everything i was failing at... eventually i started seeing my improvements, and it was highly addicting, which drove me to push myself further. i acquired everything i wanted for myself in just under 2 years. very easy to do when you have no one but yourself to worry about.
now i'm at a comfortable place in life where that drive suddenly stopped because i stopped hating and i'm fairly happy. i have a hot and loyal boyfriend, people are constantly wanting to be friends with me and always admiring me, i'm relatively fit and well-groomed, graduated from my dream college, etc... but i kind of wish i had that drive back.
that shit just felt so good when i was in the process of it, i never felt so alive back then.
i'm currently trying to focus on my career as an artist and trying to build and promote my skills. i remember dreaming i could be a world class master artist, like some of my idols.
hate to admit it, but since acquiring my boyfriend, everything went down the loo as far as my drive goes... my focus shifted to building my relationship with him instead. the day he breaks my heart though, i'm ready to get back into the game more than ever.
hope this helped
>>17261759
Maybe one day when I have more experience and am not just talking out of my ass
I find it hard to make friends in this industry to be honest. I fantasize about joining a game company or something a lot but I like the money too much.
>>17261781
Perfectly understandable. The only issue with wanting to start a company that creates value is that this is the wrong economy for it.
Most successful startups are just vehicles for tech innovation, mlms or 'unicorn' companies that put a twist on a consumer-facing business model.
Look at Elon Musk. People worship him despite the fact that his companies are horrendously over-valued, most of his revenue comes from government grants for renewables (Tesla, Solarcity).
We're in a low-growth ZIRP/NIRP economy and it can only get worst in that aspect. Someone like you should enough enough CAPM to know the implications.
My belief is that low-cap fund managers are needed to bet against the current financial machine that keeps tripping over itself. If anything fund charities with profits.
>neural networks
>renaissance
examples of what's wrong this the industry
the marketing value of strategies and relying on flash orders for liquidity-based profits is something that can only be counteracted by successful funds with a different model
Believe in yourself.
I was born smart and creative. I wasn't simply the best in my class - I was far ahead of the class. I've been receiving top grades from grade school to uni non stop, with little effort. Everyone always assumed I knew the answer to every question. In group projects, my partners counted on me to make a good project. I was elected class chairman in junior high, in high school, and in university. In gaming communities and online forums, I always gained moderator/leader positions after some months of participating. Why is this?
I've come to understood that all the praise I received as a child from teachers, parents and peers has led to radiating a strong inner confidence, which makes people around me trust me. I don't think this confidence would exist without the constant praise and confirmation given by my surroundings. In a vacuum, I am insecure and lazy. Left with my own devices, I achieve little.
TL;DR: Make promises to others, and their expectations will lead your hand.
hey,
so you will experience some drive at first, but you will get burned out. take some time to meditate over a candle, and channel your energy, and center yourself. sit still, then regain your focus and keep going. you can also take breaks in between such as learning an instrument, watching a favorite show, or chatting with a friend, masturbating, etc. as long as you are moving towards a goal, you're ok. it's not a race, it's a marathon.
i'm a pharmacy student and have been "driven" for a quite a few years now, despite many obstacles and challenges i've faced. a lot of things happen unexpected, but thats when you have to meditate or pray, and re set yourself, and adapt quickly.
#future pharmacist
>>17253253
Anon, it may not be your cup of tea but read Joseph Campbell's Hero with a Thousand Faces and then listen to/read Power of Myth interviews with Bill Moyes.
Im struggling with something similar to what a lot of other anons seem to have gone through, but the first step was my reading this.
It was like it switched a light on in my head when he lays down some great concepts like "follow your bliss" and finding your rite of passage to the next stages of your life etc
I think the most important this is just to keep sloggin' away.
I don't think people have "unstoppable drives" in the sense that they're always motivated, energetic, and driven.
I think the difference is that they keep moving even when they don't want to.
bump for
>>17261819
>>17261790
>>17261788
>>17261784
>>17261781
>>17261748
>>17261714
>>17260579
anon
would love to have conv regarding your experience/life outlook
cont ITT would not be best
>>17261861
Third and fourth posts are mine, I believe you mean the other anon.
>>17261862
Apologies, I do.
>>17261861
Well I'll have a look at this thread after work if you want to leave your email.
>>17261898
Thank you kindly
[email protected]
>>17255465
More like mountains of Adderall and a shiny new coffee machine.
>>17253397
I'm a staunch self-critic, but I see my failings as opportunities for improvement.
>>17261821
You know I really don't want to believe that the optimal thing for me to do in life is to just become another hedge fund manager (or Partner at GS or whatever).
It's like being given a mathematical system where there's an uninteresting trivial optimum and you suspect there are more interesting higher optima, but in the end there's only the trivial solution that requires no mental creativity.
>>17263759
Then find something fulfilling to do. Start by volunteering in your free time and let that put you in touch with your emotions again to figure out what to do.
>>17263771
I'm just interested in making money for now to be honest. I don't trust the irrationality of emotions.
I've thought about moving back to academia in a more impactful research area but no matter how I think about it things are constrained more by funding than number of people wanting to be researchers.
Guess nothing to do but become a hedge fund manager huh
>>17263938
Emotions are part of rationality in the sense that matters - living optimally. Losing touch with them is what generally leads to mid-life crises and late reassessments.
When people talk about irrationality in connection to emotions, they mean being overcome with emotions (overwhelmed), as opposed to using them as part of your decision-making algorithm, along with other input.
While emotions can't be the sole arbiters of your decisions, they can't be ignored without producing the emptiness you appear to be experiencing.
>>17263954
I just want to improve the world as efficiently as possible to be honest. I'll feel like I didn't do enough in life if I don't achieve that.
All I need is a 2-3 hours a day of free time to keep up with my weeaboo hobbies, maybe socialize occasionally and not burn out.
>>17264005
You won't feel you're doing that because you won't be as unfulfilled as you are now, which leads you to think in abstractions while you sell your happiness to buy... what?
If you're so rational, read a bit on the science of happiness, apply what the researchers recommend and compare with your current results. You may find you're severally misguided, which deep down you know already.
>>17264008
What's important to me isn't subjective feel good factor but objective, measurable impact though.
I understand if someone is physically and mentally breaking down from working 12+ hours a day. But allowing one's career to be pulled in a certain direction based on statistically random emotional attachments seems kinda strange to me. I see no reason why one job should be intrinsically more enjoyable than another assuming equal natural aptitude and work environment.
>>17264038
So I guess "nothing to do but become a hedge fund manager huh"?
Is that the way to improve the world as efficiently as possible?
You see no reason yet you're questioning your choices. Some would say you think you could enjoy something else more.
>>17264059
That was me being half sarcastic
It really is hard to come up with better ideas though. But that goes without saying
>>17264079
I'm sure it must be hard when emotions are excluded from the decision making process. The outcome isn't very impressive, though.
>>17264088
Emotions are just chemicals in the brain dude.
>>17264109
Why do you think they exist?
>>17264118
Ancient evolutionary pressures
>>17264145
What's their function, or what was it if you don't believe they have any now?
Realize that you will never, ever be Elon Musk, figure out what your realistic ceiling in life is and add 5.
>>17264152
Survival-promoting flight/fight triggers and reward mechanisms
>>17264180
You said you're just interested in making money for now: >>17263938
Why do you think that's the case?
>>17264180
Out of time, unfortunately, so I'm gonna finish with the following:
Your professional choice is certainly not improving the world as efficiently as possible
You also seem to recognize the importance of things like: "All I need is a 2-3 hours a day of free time to keep up with my weeaboo hobbies, maybe socialize occasionally and not burn out."
Emotions are motivational anchors, as you admitted (triggers and rewards). Since you're not being consistent with your stated goal (so much for objectivity and rationality), consider that you may have been motivated by an emotion (no matter how repressed), only a negative one: insecurity.
"Feelings of insecurity incline people toward materialist values, the research suggests" http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/08/health/materialism-is-badfor-you-studies-say.html
Anyway, best of luck!
>>17253253
>opnions
As long as you are a kind person I dont think you can be a disappointment to people who matter in your life.
Your insecurities don't matter. No one needs to know and if they call you on your faults then make lightly of it how ever you can. You can always better yourself.
The odds dont matter either. You are not at odds against the world. Youre capable of doing more than you realize. Set your priorities straight once and for all.
>>17264271
samefag
As for priorities mine that have worked are
>money
>education
>family
>hobbies
>frirends and intimate relationships
I conquer one in the list to where its easy then can add the next in line on. Its not impossible to juggle all the important parts of your life if you are giving it effort and some self sacrifice.
Most importantly I learned to never despair or get mad. This has helped me get back on track after fucking up for years.
Money is definitely hard to come by, i make shit wages but I accept as many hours as possible and get good benefits that cover my health insurance and pay for college.
Education i mean in a broad sense. I always volunteer to do something new and learn and apply myself. When it comes to formal education do it when its possible. I'm lucky I can go get a bachelors degree since this is really important in building yourself up in the eyes of employers.
I love my family
I need time to myself
Occasionally I get to work on romance but all the other things I'm doing are building my character and status. It helps a fuck ton. Eventually I will have time and the notion to go meet people actively, but its really on the back burner. I'm just nice to people and joke.
>>17264184
Because money is necessary for things like charity, pushing social change and scientific/technological research.
I have no interest in materialism.
