I told my gf I'm against abortion and the pill and now she won't have sex with me anymore.
>>17125447
You got off easy. I'd have dumped you on the spot.
>>17125451
I think it's the same
She doesn't respond to my messages
Why do women have to be such cunts? If she's scared of getting pregnant, she shouldn't have spread her legs in the first place
>>17125453
That what she's doing now. Enjoy.
>>17125458
If you decide to have sex with someone you accept the consequences like an adult, you do not go the easy way just because it's more conventient for you... and you do not suddenly deny sex to your man just because you don't want to take responsibility for your actions.What kind of irresponsible bitch changes her mind like that. She should have said no from the beginning, now she shouldn't be allowed to quit that easily, it hurts me not to get sex from her. Abortion is murder and the pill promotes promiscuity anyway.
>>17125453
well you're a fuckin retard.
What is wrong with this board.
>>17125465
You don't really expect people to honestly bite, do you?
>>17125465
baitbaitbaitbait
>>17125451
>>17125458
He said he is against abortion.
Not against using condom.
For fucks sake give him a break.
I know you 21st century bitches are all about "muh body here", "muh body there".
My apologies darling, but nature made you a breeder by design. If you want to steamroll your way into something completely different, society allows it thanks to technology.
Actually I am surprised how many cunts are against capitalism and technology but when it comes to dealing whimsically with the consequences of their actions (read: pregnancy) they all become science fanatics.
Another think you cunts do (and I assume you are all anglo Saxons, because that's typical of your degenerate culture) is never to negotiate. E.g. assume OP is someone who is not well-informed or hasn't taken a woman's perspective in the best sense of the term. Now, even if she had sex with him, she wouldn't go to the length of convincing him or talking to him.
Basically, the summary of the story is:
>she fucked him well but as soon as a moral issue emerged she preferred to back off rather than negotiate
So fucking typical of English bitches. This either/or attitude. Their brains are like minefields and you never know what's beneath the tile you are clicking on.
Not perchance these bitches grow up in countries with a colonialist mentality.
>>17125482
delicious fresh pasta
>>17125482
She was against condoms because they're unreliable to her and she trusts her pill better, also something about making period pain go away etc. I don't care it still allows for promiscuity. If the condom breaks good women are for raising children and staying inside the home anyway, they shouldn't be doing anything else.
you did good, abortion is a baby murder. i hate left wingers ,relativists ,postmoderns and colectivists, they are cancer of the world
>>17125447
If you don't want to have kids, and neither abortion nor birth control are on the table, what other options foes one have? It seems to me that she has done the sensible thing.
>>17125522
She's the one that gets pregnant... not me
It's her responsibility to raise the child
Not mine
>>17125527
The fucking bait here, jesus can noone be dumb enough to try to debate this stupid shit?
Can everyone stop posting so this thread dies already.
>>17125451
Given that most people are religious, you are most likely a hypocritical retard
Holy shit
I don't care if you are shitposters, gullible kids or just bored, this is pitiful
>>17125527
>She's the one that gets pregnant... not me
>It's her responsibility to raise the child
>Not mine
And, as previously stated, she doesn't want to get pregnant. If you're going to take abortion and birth control off the table, then she has one option left, and she is taking it. Can't fault her on that one.
>>17125491
Do you realize preventive pill, day after pill and abortion pill are 3 completely different things with regards to purpose, timing, and mechanism of action?
Btw where are you from?
>>17125490
I made it on the spot.
100% fresh
0% pasta
>>17125550
You don't start fucking a man and then suddenly stop you cunt. That shirt hurts. If she didn't want to risk a pregnancy sge should have never spread her legs in the firsf place. Now she's leaving me blue-balled and it fucking hurts, bitch shouldn't be allowed to do that.
>>17125545
>this
This what?
>>17125562
I subscribe to this.
OP is saying:
>she puts "not having a pregnancy" or "using the preventive measures I like" above love
This is pretty equal to saying:
>sorry OP I am a slut. I don't care for your feelings even if I messed with them. I am an egocentric bitch who first got involved with you and then went away at the earliest sign of difficulty... and didn't even try to talk you out of this.
As I said, this either or bitch thinks of you just as a dick to ride and not as a human being with feelings and shit.
Congratulations to this bitch for being a slut.
>>17125569
Why should anyone love a massive selfish piece of shit like OP who doesn't care for his gf's feelings and safety? That's not love. He doesn't have any feelings for her. If he's willing to make her risk a massive health and financial hazard like a pregnancy she doesn't want, and doesn't care that she's suffering and is in pain he doesn't love her, he just wanted to use her and now he's mad she put herself to safety from him.
>>17125569
>she puts "not having a pregnancy" or "using the preventive measures I like" above love
Remember girls, any man that doesn't put your safety above all else and whines you aren't willing to risk your health and well-being for him doesn't love you.
>obvious bait
>/adv/ gobbles it down anyway
>>17125584
Its pathetic really.
>>17125564
The fact that this thread is on first page
>>17125453
what are you even talking, you mental midget?
baiting like a fucking rookie.
>>17125581
>Why should anyone love
Love is not an ought, I agree. But you put it as if love is something you decide on spot and rationally. I smell bullshit here.
>a massive selfish piece of shit like OP
You are framing OP according to your feelings and values
>who doesn't care for his gf's feelings and safety?
Who said he doesn't care? Now expressing an opinion about contraceptives = not caring for somebody? Is it that easy?
>That's not love.
Again, apologies for having had feelings without asking a legislator such as you are if something like falling in love is permissible.
>He doesn't have any feelings for her.
Again, that's your decision. Are you a mind-reader?
>If he's willing to make her risk a massive health and financial hazard like a pregnancy she doesn't want, and doesn't care that she's suffering and is in pain he doesn't love her, he just wanted to use her and now he's mad she put herself to safety from him.
OP had just expressed a strong opinion during a conversation and you triggered bitch are reacting as if he forced someone to do something.
He had fucking expressed an opinion and she suddenly walked away as if nothing else mattered.
So that's how you Redditors argue: by means of fallacies.
>>17125583
>implying abortion = woman's safety
>implying messing up with one's own hormones = wellbeing
Op cucked himself.
>>17125622
my man
>>17125619
You are the one that's projecting on OP. His posts show he doesn't care for her at all.
>>17125666
>implying forcing an unwanted pregnancy with all of its horrible consequences = caring for her safety
>implying forcing someone to suffer period pain when they've told you they're better ofc on the pill = caring for her wellbeing
Fuck that man
The girl doesn't want kids and power to her
When i didnt have a condom ready and my girl was humping me and rubbing herself wet on me i grabbed her and moved her away and said no
She was confused as fuck because we both wanted it but hell if im risking it even if its 1%
>>17125447
Hey my ex was the same. I'm happy on the pill, easy to take, no consequence on my lufe besides no more period pains and no more heavy bleeding which I love, and suddenly he starts spouting this inane bullshit just like yours. I told him to shut the fuck up and that I wasn't gping to ruin myself listening to harmful crap opinions like his. He got butthurt. I dumped him and now I hope he's dead. :)
>>17125798
Good, why can't people be smart about this stuff because its not a game
If i knew you irl id give you a high five
>>17125761
>When i didnt have a condom ready and my girl was humping me and rubbing herself wet on me i grabbed her and moved her away and said no
>She was confused as fuck because we both wanted it but hell if im risking it even if its 1%
You people are like cats.
>>17125562
>You don't start fucking a man and then suddenly stop you cunt. That shirt hurts.
In that case, we are at an impasse: continuing to fuck you is not an option, but ceasing to fuck you is also not an option.
>If she didn't want to risk a pregnancy sge should have never spread her legs in the firsf place.
For what it's worth, I actually agree with you on this point. But it's not a useful point to be making: the past is done, and cannot be undone.
There is another problem: information. If you are only open to sexual options with a high risk of pregnancy, you should have discussed this before having sex with her. As things stand, she had no way of knowing the risks you would require her to take, which directly led to her improper former actions. Viewed from another angle, by hiding this, you denied her the ability to give proper informed consent.
Do you really want to take this line of discussion any further, OP? I am willing to let it drop, right here, if you are. And I think you are
>Now she's leaving me blue-balled and it fucking hurts, bitch shouldn't be allowed to do that.
I've been there, bro. There ahould be no doubt that teasing is a cruel practice, and while it cannot be forbidden by law without doibg fatal damage to the concept of consent, it should at least be more widely viewed as unethical.
But it also doesn't sound like she is teasing you. It sounds like she is acting on new information that you had previously withheld. It is only fair that, given the significance of that information -information which, I reiterate, should have bwen given before your relationship turned sexual- she be given a chance to change her mind going forward. Not backward in time, obviously -I do not argue for retroactive rape, as some might- but going forward.
I've had blue balls. They are not fun. But they are, frankly, just not all that bad, nor do they last long. It is reasonable that you be asked to just get over it. That is well within your ability.
>>17125447
Good riddance.
You're better off without the amoral trollop.
>>17125465
Lmao you are such a hypocrite you tell her not to spread her legs and then bitch that you aren't getting any. Grow up you man child.
>>17125447
Seems like a childish reason, dump her or smack the attitude out of her.
>>17125447
Get a vasectomy, faggot
That way everyone wins. She doesn't get pregnant, doesn't have to be on the pill, and neither of you will have to worry about getting an abortion. Also, you don't spread your retarded genes.
/thread
>>17125957
>/threading oneself
I bet you like the smell of your own farts.
>>17125584
What's wrong with calling someone pretending to be a pathetic retard a pathetic retard?
>>17125989
/adv/ loves being trolled.
>>17125447
Honestly if she doesn't respect human life or is so uneducated in biology and medicine that she thinks life begins at some arbitrary point that she decides regardless of reasonable evidence then you have dodged a bullet, even if you can't see it right now.
As for the birth control thing, that's just her being a whiny, overreacting child. What a vast majority or people don't understand is that there are pretty major drawbacks to any form of birth control, and it's not just some symptom free super pill that let's you be as sexually irresponsible as you want.
>>17125969
I agree with >>17125957
Nothing wrong with it when it's one of the only sensible replies in this thread. This place is getting more retarded by the day.
>>17125957
kill yourself you disgusting faggot
>>17126002
He is perfectly right; I just pointed out that he shouldn't close the thread on himself. 4chan etiquette, if you will.
>>17126004
>4chan etiquette, if you will.
>>17125998
OP is the one that doesn't respect human life, wanting to force her to risk a pregnancy she doesn't want despite knowing how a horrible and disgusting and human rights-violating that is. You and OP should get killed for the good of humanity.
>As for the birth control thing, that's just her being a whiny, overreacting child
You are a whiny overreacting child. She has a form of birth control that is proven to be highly safe and she's comfortable with and you want to force her to risky sex or to use a birth control that's not as safe and she's not comfortable with? I reiterate you and OP should both get killed.
>>17125916
>not wanting to get pregnant
>wanting to keep using the birth control you're happy with
>childish
Why don't robots kill themselves already?
>>17126027
>wanting to force her to risk a pregnancy she doesn't want despite knowing how a horrible and disgusting and human rights-violating that is
You realize that to get away from the "horrible" occurrence of reproduction she's killing a human being, right? And that's being respectful of human life? You're not thinking logically here and it's clear you are way too emotionally invested in this.
>You and OP should get killed for the good of humanity.
Funny how you claim the pro-abortion supporters respect life, and then you tell two people to kill themselves. Not that I expected anything more than hypocrisy and scientific illiteracy from barbaric child killers in the first place.
>You are a whiny overreacting child.
Man you got me. Fuckin' rekt.
>She has a form of birth control that is proven to be highly safe and she's comfortable with and you want to force her to risky sex or to use a birth control that's not as safe and she's not comfortable with?
No, I never said any of those things. Don't put words into my mouth. I said most people don't know about the many drawbacks and it's immature of her to get pissed off because someone is against it. Everything else is just bullshit you imagined up so you could attack me more easily instead of being reasonable, something you obviously are incapable of.
>I reiterate you and OP should both get killed.
I'm guessing you didn't make it past highschool, right?
>>17126059
I don't see the fetus before three months as a human being. It's a clump of unfeeling cells without a brain and should be treated as such, especially if its existence is unwanted and therefore damaging to the mother. Why do you want to force women to risk something they do not want?
>Funny how you claim the pro-abortion supporters respect life, and then you tell two people to kill themselves
I claim nothing, I don't speak for others unlike you. I speak for myself. I see you clearly do not respect the life of women so you deserve to get killed. Same goes for OP.
>No, I never said any of those things
OP has admitted the pill has been beneficial to her and you called her whiny overreacting child for sticking to something that OP himself has admitted to be beneficial for her. You do not care for her well-being just like OP doesn't.
And yes a child you don't want is horrible. Your body being violated, pain and suffering for nine months. Being forced to waste your time and money on a piece of crap you don't want to spend your time and money on. Even with the adoption he might come pester you later and you don't want that. Being forced to emotional abuse from others because you don't want a piece of crap that was FORCED AGAINST YOUR WILL on you by assholes like OP and yourself.
>>17126007
Fuck off, faggot. If you weren't a summerfag you'd knew you're not supposed to close thread on yourself.
>>17126078
Kek now he's going to say "If you don't want to be pregnant don't have sex" which is exactly what OP's ex-gf is doing... and OP is all butthurt about it
>>17126078
I bet he thinks the unlatched egg is a human being even though it cannot become anything more than an egg without the uterus' lining and if the woman wants to thinnen her uterus so the egg cannot and will not ever attach it's her body and her right to
>>17126078
>I don't see the fetus before three months as a human being.
Because you don't understand biology.
>It's a clump of unfeeling cells without a brain and should be treated as such, especially if its existence is unwanted and therefore damaging to the mother.
It is by definition a human life according to the agreed upon characteristics of life used in the biological sciences and the medical world. If human life holds intrinsic value then it holds such universally. Drawing distinctions such as the one you made is logically inconsistent with an egalitarian worldview that universally respects human life, as those same arguments can be recycled to allow for the killing of any group of people.
>Why do you want to force women to risk something they do not want?
Because the alternative is killing what something that is verifiably a human being. Discomfort over an irresponsible mistake is far preferable to murder, as you would see if you'd consider this from an objective, reasoned perspective instead of latching onto emotionally appealing propaganda spouted by feminist groups that don't possess any empirical backing.
>I claim nothing, I don't speak for others unlike you
Uh, here >>17126027
you did speak for her by saying she respects human life in that she held the opposite viewpoint of OP, who you said doesn't respect human life. You also spoke for other people several times by accusing me of saying or believing things I never indicated a belief in and telling both me and OP to kill ourselves. I'd say this is you being hypocritical, but from what I've seen it's unintelligent on your part, as you don't seem capable of understanding what's being said here.
>OP has admitted the pill has been beneficial to her and you called her whiny overreacting child for sticking to something that OP himself has admitted to be beneficial for her.
Yes, because to break up with or stop talking to someone because of something like that is immature and childish.
>>17126078
>You do not care for her well-being just like OP doesn't.
More strawmanning. There are clearly documented, but not well publicized drawbacks to hormonal birth control pills, and it is reasonable to be against it and childish to be militantly opposed to any who disagree with that viewpoint. That is all I said, everything else is, as I said before, your bullshit that you pulled out of nowhere as a means of attacking me.
>And yes a child you don't want is horrible.
You know what's more horrible? Murder.
>Your body being violated, pain and suffering for nine months.
Nine months is a hell of a lot shorter than eternity after death. Also it can be avoided by being careful and it's not justifiable even in the case of a mistake to kill an innocent third party.
>Being forced to waste your time and money on a piece of crap you don't want to spend your time and money on.
See, here's more indication you have no respect or care for human life. You're referring to a human child as nothing more than a "piece or crap". Do you not see the blatant, inhuman hypocrisy you're supporting here?
There's also the alternative of adoption if money is a legitimate concern.
>Even with the adoption he might come pester you later and you don't want that.
Yeah, I get this. It's definitely better to kill the child that maybe having to deal with it later down the line. It's not as if this whole thing could be avoided in the first place or you could ensure there's no possibility of being found if it's actually that important to you. Do you honestly think it's preferable to kill an individual rather than have to deal with a possible petty annoyance down the line? Do you actually see that as a reasonable, ethical response?
>eing forced to emotional abuse from others because you don't want a piece of crap that was FORCED AGAINST YOUR WILL on you by assholes like OP and yourself.
It was your actions that resulted in the pregnancy, and even if they didn't, murder isn't justified or proportion
>>17126080
>summerfag
>it's early May
>talking about 4chan etiquette
>>/b/ faggot
>>17125482
It isn't their body they mess with, it's the infant's body
>>17126126
Cry me a river fag.
>>17126102
Human rights start at birth. Undeveloped fetuses don't have human rights because giving fetuses rights would violate women's own rights as it already happens wherever abortion is illegal. The mother is more important than the unfeeling clump of shit.
>Discomfort over an irresponsible mistake is far preferable to murder
And with this you show you ignorance. It's not mere discomfort, it's poverty and depression and emotional and psychological abuse, when not a hazard to the physical health as well. Killing an unwanted fetus is far preferable to letting a woman and her child suffer through all that.
>that don't possess any empirical backing
Except for studies that link abortion to decrease of crime rates and that denial of abortion causes depression and resentment in the mother, leading to more abusive households?
>she respects human life
Yeah in my opinion she does. She respects her own and she doesn't force it on others unlike OP and his shitty disgusting whining.
.
>You also spoke for other people several times by accusing me of saying or believing things I never indicated a belief in and telling both me and OP to kill ourselves
Telling you to kill yourself isn;t speaking for you, retard. And your calling someone a whiny and overreacting child for wanting to keep a safe birth control they're happy with and not risk a child THEY DO NOT WANT tells enough. You ahve clearly indicated your beliefs that you do not care for other women's safety and autonomy over themselves. Kill yourself.
>Yes, because to break up with or stop talking to someone because of something like that is immature and childish
You are the only one immature and childish. I would not want anything to do either with someone who would want me to risk a pregnancy I don't want or force me to change my choices over something personal and important like birth control for the worse. That's offensive and disgusting and completely unacceptable. I want nothing to do with such an asshole.
>>17126090
>I bet he thinks the unlatched egg is a human being even though it cannot become anything more than an egg without the uterus' lining and if the woman wants to thinnen her uterus so the egg cannot and will not ever attach it's her body and her right to
A fertilized egg is by definition a living human, and to kill that is to commit murder. Whether you acknowledge this or not is irrelevant, since there's not much you can do to convince the scientifically illiterate and indoctrinated to accept reasonable evidence. Your viewpoints is comparable to creationism or flat earth theorists in it's stupidity.
Good. Now OP`s inferior genes won`t spread.
This entire thread is bait, OP said something to his girlfriend, she disagreed now instead of getting a new girlfriend who agrees with him. He'd rather complain about being pussy whipped.
>>17126132
>Human rights start at birth.
We're not discussing law here, and this isn't even consistent throughout the world anyway. What has been discussed this entire time is when life begins from an objective, scientific viewpoint, and the ethical/moral implications of the idea that you can kill human beings out of convenience.
>Undeveloped fetuses don't have human rights because giving fetuses rights would violate women's own rights as it already happens wherever abortion is illegal.
Read this again and tell me you don't see why this is illogical. You're saying a fetus can't be a human life, despite evidence to the contrary, because then it wouldn't be ok to kill it. This is a circular argument that is only supported by itself. The doublethink here is ridiculous.
>The mother is more important than the unfeeling clump of shit.
More unreasonable viewpoints. To say one human life is worth more than another isn't a judgement you can make. You're sure speaking for others now, in the child is inferior to the mother, aren't you?
>It's not mere discomfort, it's poverty and depression and emotional and psychological abuse, when not a hazard to the physical health as well.
Not necessarily though, and the entire situation is avoidable in the first place. Even if it's not avoidable, how can you say that murder is a superior choice to discomfort?
>Killing an unwanted fetus is far preferable to letting a woman and her child suffer through all that.
By this line of reasoning shouldn't we euthanize the poor? They live in poverty and discomfort, so why is it not reasonably sound to kill them?
>Except for studies that link abortion to decrease of crime rates and that denial of abortion causes depression and resentment in the mother
Bullshit. There is nothing substantial or peer reviewed that supports this and you know it.
>Yeah in my opinion she does.
So you are and were speaking for others, despite what you claimed previously? It's like you can't follow your own reasoning.
>>17126118
Those risks apply to a minority of women and even then they aren't kept a secret, so don't pretend they are. My doctor examined me, asked me about my general condition and told me what signs to look out for to determine whether the pill was for me or not. Turns out I had no problems at all. Keep your scaremongering to yourself.
>You know what's more horrible? Murder.
No, a child you don't want is worse than murder. That's why pregnant victims of rape kill themselves.
>Nine months is a hell
And a lifetime of mental scarring.
>a lot shorter than eternity after death
Which nobody can know anyway because you don't have a consciousness to sense the passing of time when you're dead. The nine months of hell are objectively worse.
>Also it can be avoided by being careful
Like OP's gf is being?
>and it's not justifiable even in the case of a mistake to kill an innocent third party
It is when the fetus is not wanted.
>You're referring to a human child as nothing more than a "piece or crap"
An unwanted child is exactly to the poor mother that was forced to have him considering he's nothing but an unwanted leech and a problem that should go away.
>It's definitely better to kill the child that maybe having to deal with it later down the line
You can't force anyone to deal with someone they don't want to deal with.
>It's not as if this whole thing could be avoided in the first place
Yeah by not fucking pieces of shit like OP. Oh wait!
>Do you honestly think it's preferable to kill an individual
A fetus IS NOT formed enough to be considered an individual and IT'S NOT a petty annoyance. How fucking dare you call what is a huge deal for a lot of people a "petty annoyance".
>It was your actions that resulted in the pregnancy
No.
>and even if they didn't, murder isn't justified or proportion
Fetuses aren't people, so there's no murder here.
Now kill yourself.
>>17126132
> She respects her own and she doesn't force it on others unlike OP and his shitty disgusting whining.
She's killing another human being. OP stated an opinion. Who here is imposing their will upon another individual?
>Telling you to kill yourself isn;t speaking for you, retard.
It literally is.
>You ahve clearly indicated your beliefs that you do not care for other women's safety and autonomy over themselves. Kill yourself.
More strawmanning and unreasonable bullshit. Go through and tell me where I have said or indicated a belief in any of these things. Not once have I said those things, and in fact this entire time I have been arguing for the maintenance of the right to life universally amongst human beings, while you have been arguing for legalized murder and the killing of undesirable people as an act of convenience.
>You are the only one immature and childish.
Got me again. Fuckin' rekt.
>I would not want anything to do either with someone who would want me to risk a pregnancy I don't want or force me to change my choices over something personal and important like birth control for the worse. That's offensive and disgusting and completely unacceptable. I want nothing to do with such an asshole.
All this does is show your inability to view this subject reasonable or understand that human life has an objective, scientific definition that exists outside your delusional views of the world. It is not reasonable to say that you have a right to kill people at will, as you have argued here repeatedly. That is the disgusting and inhuman position, to say that any person is undeserving of life and that anyone has a right to kill another, especially their own child, out of nothing but irresponsibility and convenience.
>>17126146
>Break up with whoever disagrees with you
Wow this is an amazing advice.
>>17126133
An egg is not a human and the woman can do whatever she wants with her own body, you are violating her body autonomy if you want to force her not to modify her body in order to prptect herself against unwanted strangers inside her. The uterus is not part of the newcomer's body, it's her to do as she pleases.
it's like I'm really on gamefaqs holy shit
>>17126165
>Those risks apply to a minority of women
This is simply untrue. Exposure to excessive hormones in the body is universally impactful on humans. You don't seem to have read up on the subject at all.
>My doctor examined me, asked me about my general condition and told me what signs to look out for to determine whether the pill was for me or not.
So you've simply accepted what others have told you? You haven't read up on the subject yourself using peer reviewed, published scientific articles that clearly document their results? Then you have no basis upon which to argue, as you are extremely uniformed on the subject.
>No, a child you don't want is worse than murder.
I don't even have to respond to this. I'd say this viewpoints speaks for itself.
>And a lifetime of mental scarring.
Key word here. LIFEtime. The right to life of the individual is not violated here.
>The nine months of hell are objectively worse.
By this reasoning it is preferable to kill yourself than face any amount of hardship or difficulty. That's just stupid.
>Like OP's gf is being?
Yes, actually. Birth control is a far preferable alternative to abortion, despite the many drawbacks that you seem to be uninformed about.
>It is when the fetus is not wanted.
So an individual that is not wanted or cared about is free game for murder? That's unreasonable and you know it.
>An unwanted child is exactly to the poor mother that was forced to have him considering he's nothing but an unwanted leech and a problem that should go away.
This goes back to my above statement. Do you honestly believe people or given value only by virtue of how much they are desired by others? From what you've said, it seems you think people don't hold any inherent value or rights, and that it is only determined by their relation to others and the ability to impose their will over a weaker target.
>You can't force anyone to deal with someone they don't want to deal with.
Actually you can, we do it all the time.
>>17126157
What has been discussed this entire time is when life begins from an objective, scientific viewpoint, and the ethical/moral implications of the idea that you can kill human beings out of convenience
No, what is being discussed here is how best can you force women to be slaves.
>a fetus can't be a human life
Exactly. Not until it can live by itself outside its host.
>Go through and tell me where I have said or indicated a belief in any of these things
Right here >>17125998 when you insult her for sticking to what is good for her.
>To say one human life is worth more than another isn't a judgement you can make
I don't see the fetus as human life. I see it as a parasite that can well be unwanted and no woman should be forced to bear if they don't want to.
>Bullshit. There is nothing substantial or peer reviewed that supports this and you know it.
Except what you say is false and you know it. Look at the poor crime-ridden shitholes where abortion is banned and women have to risk their lives getting an illegal one.
>>17126165
>You can't force anyone to deal with someone they don't want to deal with.
If "not dealing with" a situation involves the violation of other people's rights, then yes you can. They also got themselves into the situation.
>Yeah by not fucking pieces of shit like OP. Oh wait!
Yeah, actually. There's no "oh wait" here. This doesn't at all contradict what I've said. Avoiding sex is definitely a way to avoid pregnancy.
>A fetus IS NOT formed enough to be considered an individual and IT'S NOT a petty annoyance.
It is by definition an individual human life. I know you people enjoy making up your own definitions for things and ignoring fact, but what you're saying is simply not the case.
>How fucking dare you call what is a huge deal for a lot of people a "petty annoyance".
And how dare you say it is ever justifiable to kill an innocent human life. All things are nothing more than petty annoyances relative to an individual's life and right to such.
>No.
Oh, women don't have sex to get pregnant? You're even less informed on human reproduction that you've shown yourself to be.
>Fetuses aren't people, so there's no murder here.
Except they are.
Read a book.
>>17126176
Who are you quoting?
>>17126178
>An egg is not a human
We agree here and nothing I have said indicates otherwise.
>the woman can do whatever she wants with her own body
Yep, I agree here too.
>you are violating her body autonomy if you want to force her not to modify her body in order to prptect herself against unwanted strangers inside her
No, she is violating the rights of the human being inside of her by killing it. The right to life stands above all else, especially considering this situation can be avoided altogether.
>The uterus is not part of the newcomer's body, it's her to do as she pleases.
You know what is part of the child's body? It's fucking body that's torn apart and destroyed. It's insane how you people are incapable of critical thought and double back on circular arguments to make your points.
This is the weirdest /adv/ thread I've seen that hasn't gone into some sort of bondage discussion.
All of you motherfuckers need to shut the fuck up with your morality plays. This thread was either the result of a troll deliberately fucking with you all, or a gigantic tool, which may as well have been trolling in the first place for the response that's been evoked.
Goddamn. Go give actual advice, instead of pissing a fit.
>>17126201
I'm sure my doctor knows the subject better than some mysoginist on 4cha, and I trust her better than you, too, as you would force women to risk and have children they do not want despite you knowing how horrible and traumatizing that is.
>The right to life of the individual is not violated here
Plenty other rights are, which is plain fucking disgusting too. You cannot violate the right to freedom and body autonomy of anyone.
>By this reasoning it is preferable to kill yourself than face any amount of hardship or difficulty
>watch me jumo from to extremes for the fun of it
Nobody said about killing yourself over any hardship or difficulty. A child you don't want is though an hardship and difficulty and trauma a lot of people don't want to have, which is why pregnant rape victims prefer to kill themselves.
>Yes, actually
So you go back on your words of calling her whiny and overreacting? Excellent. At last you show some sense.
>So an individual that is not wanted or cared about is free game for murder?
A fetus is not an individual so it's not murder.
>Actually you can
You can't force a woman to deal with an unwanted child. She will kill and abuse the child because it's nothing but a source of pain and problems and suffering for her and she wants it out of her life. You underestimate the impact unwanted children have on you and that's your mistake.
>>17126207
>No, what is being discussed here is how best can you force women to be slaves.
More strawmanning bullshit. Nowhere I have said anything that indicates a belief in this. You're just out of reasonable arguments, as you've been the entire time, and can do nothing but insult me and attach labels and beliefs to me that make it easier to attack.
>Exactly. Not until it can live by itself outside its host.
Not sure what you're responding to here, because I never said what you quoted.
>Right here >>17125998 (You) when you insult her for sticking to what is good for her.
I insulted her for being unable to accept another person's opinion on the subject of birth control and supporting abortion. Read what I've said again because you still don't seem to understand it.
>I don't see the fetus as human life. I see it as a parasite that can well be unwanted and no woman should be forced to bear if they don't want to.
But this is wrong. It's like saying "I don't see evolution as being real" or "I don't see gravity as existing". It's demonstrably and verifiably wrong by the definitions of the words "human" and "life". Just read a fucking biology textbook and figure out what these words mean before you argue. My God, this is fucking ridiculous. It's impossible to argue with those who don't even know the meanings of the words they're using.
>Except what you say is false and you know it
Oh really? What have I said that's false? Do you have a peer-reviewed source to back up your claim?
>Look at the poor crime-ridden shitholes where abortion is banned and women have to risk their lives getting an illegal one.
More emotional appeal. Even if this were true, that outlawing abortion somehow increases crime, then how is it reasonable to argue for legalized murder to prevent other murder? Do you seriously not see the massive problem with what you're saying here? It's a mess of an argument that can't stand to reasonable analysis.
>>17126228
>I'm sure my doctor knows the subject better than some mysoginist on 4cha
Because doctors can never be wrong or provide you with incorrect information, right? It's not as if malpractice law is a huge field or anything.
>and I trust her better than you
You don't have to trust me. Hell, I don't want you to trust me. Go read up on this on your own. Don't trust anyone on the subject, you can look at the information yourself.
>Plenty other rights are, which is plain fucking disgusting too
Such as? Even if they are being violated, logical and functioning law and ethical systems are built from the fundamental right to life, which cannot be violated lest all other rights be violated. To say life can be violated to ensure another right, does nothing but ensure the violation of all rights of the individual.
>watch me jumo from to extremes for the fun of it
You still didn't address the argument. That is your belief taken to its conclusion. It's not my belief or my reasoning, it is what you have said applied universally. If you think it's an "extreme", then maybe you should reevaluate your beliefs.
>So you go back on your words of calling her whiny and overreacting? Excellent. At last you show some sense.
I'm not even sure what you're attempting to say here. I've been consistent throughout this entire argument.
>A fetus is not an individual so it's not murder.
Once again, by definition it is. You can't argue with objective fact.
>She will kill and abuse the child because it's nothing but a source of pain and problems and suffering for her and she wants it out of her life.
Or she could give it up for adoption.
>You underestimate the impact unwanted children have on you and that's your mistake.
Show me any evidence that a majority of women kill their unwanted children. This doesn't happen on any large scale.
>>17126210
>No, she is violating the rights of the human being inside of her by killing it
If a woman thinnens her uterus so the egg cannot attach she is not touching the egg at all, she's only modifying her body for her own protection. Not her fault the egg cannot survive once automatically expelled from her body like the waste it its.
>If "not dealing with" a situation involves the violation of other people's rights
Like having your freedom and autonomy respected?
>They also got themselves into the situation
By being raped? By being forced by others to unsafe sex? Huh?
>It is by definition an individual human life
No it's not. It's a literal parasite and needs to be treated as such.
And how dare you say it is ever justifiable to kill an innocent human life. All things are nothing more than petty annoyances relative to an individual's life and right to such.
Wow you have just admitted you have no consideration for other people's abuse and suffering with this. A woman could be raped and tortured and forced to become pregnant but hey, her horryfing trauma is just a petty annoyance to you.
>Oh, women don't have sex to get pregnant?
No, plenty women have sex for intimacy. They don't want to be pregnant.
Which is why we use birth control and dump people who reveal to have dangerous disgusting opinions like yours and OP's.
>>17126249
>Because doctors can never be wrong or provide you with incorrect information, right?
I have no reason to distrust my doctor. Try again.
>Such as? Even if they are being violated
Stopped reading there. You advocate violating other people's rights with horrible, real consequences on their life for an abstract idea of life, even though terminating an early pregnancy is proven to be the most humane course of action.
>it is what you have said applied universally
No, it's what I said distorted to an extreme. Do you think having a minor annoyance is the same as dealing with the trauma that is a child you don't want?
>Once again, by definition it is
It is not.
FYI there are plenty situations where you can kill someone for violating your rights. A thief enters your home, you can kill him for defending your property. A man tries to rape you, you can kill him in self defense. You get pregnant when you don't want to be, you cam terminate the pregnancy. Wherever there is a violation of your space you have the right to defend yourself.
>she could give it up for adoption
Because that's not traumatizing and not a potential danger at all.
>>17126249
>Show me any evidence that a majority of women kill their unwanted children. This doesn't happen on any large scale.
>In 1937 the Japanese army took over Nanking, which at the time was the capital of China. In the resulting seven-week occupation known as the Rape of Nanking, as many as 80,000 people were raped.[46] Chinese women and girls of all ages were raped, mutilated, tortured, sexually enslaved, and killed; unknown numbers of them were left pregnant.[46] Many pregnant Nanking women killed themselves in 1938, and others committed infanticide when their babies were born.[46] During the rest of the 20th century there was no record of any Chinese woman acknowledging her child as having been born as a result of the Rape of Nanking
>When a mother commits neonaticide, killing an infant younger than 24 hours old, the child's birth being the result of rape is a main cause, although other psychological and situational factors are generally present
>>17125465
>it's childish not to want to be with someone who doesn't care about you
kill yourself anon
>>17125482
Do I sense a little resentment here ? Clearly you have some "Colonialist" issues that you need to discuss with your therapist ....
Just so the buttdevastated anon knows: the only consequences you care about when taking birth control are whether it's safe and good and effective for you personally. The rest doesn't matter because birth control is a personal and private matter.
Pretty good b8
>>17125447
Why the pill?
What about a condom?
I'm against abortions too but I would get one for my girl and then feel bad for the rest of my life for killing an innocent human.
>Tfw Virgin
>>17125447
your values are different, just move on
>>17125447
What did you expect?
Ifs shes not ready for kids/marriage etc. you and her cant make it.
Either grow up and enjoy sex, or find someone ready to have your retard babies.
>>17126090
Any girl who for whatever reason makes me more prone to the risk of pregnancy is one I won't sleep with. If I was a girl and only felt comfortable having sex with the pill, then I have every right to do that. If even more, the guy said if I get you pregnant you have to keep it I would say fuck no.
You can't make people have a kid if they don't want to, if they take the risk then that is on them.
