I'm scared that even after dropping all this weight, going to the gym all the time and lifting and just in general getting /fit/, getting /fa/shionable clothes, having a undercut, and reading a fuckton of books like how to win friends and influence people, that come this upcoming semester I won't be able to get people to like me enough via joining clubs and rushing frats to be able to build up a social life on the level thats needed to get laid.
I'm not gonna be able to go on if I cant pull it off this time, I can't watch another year go by and still be a fucking virgin, I'll be 20 this time next year, I cant keep doing this.
>I'm afraid that it might be something that's less easily changed like my personality that makes me so damn unlikeable
It's probably true. People don't like people just because they go to the gym or can dress themselves well, they like people because they're fun to be around.
Just stop. You sound fucking pathetic. That's why you have no friends. It's not how you look or what you wear, it's that you sound monstrously autistic.
>But... what if reading books about making friends won't help me to make friends? How will I go on?
If you go to the gym, clothing stores, classes, work, etc. you'll start to see the same people and they'll start to see you. A comment here and there; "Hey", "How's it?", "What's going on today?" as you become a regular sight to them begins to build rapport and then you can escalate these comments into more specifics - interests, current events, etc. Stranger -> That one guy I see sometimes -> acquaintance -> friend -> girlfriend/boyfriend?
/adv/ will have you believe that by going to a library and walking up to a girl and saying "Hi, I'm anon and I like books" will somehow get you a soulmate.
It's not a science.
>>17253107
the point of all this self improvement shit is to be able to put off a persona that people like
>>17253123
>that entire gym thing
well yeah that's already happening, but I don't think its going to be enough
>>17253138
>the point of all this self improvement shit is to be able to put off a persona that people like
Changing your appearance doesn't mean shit if your personality is just as pathetic as it was before. Don't be surprised if people don't magically like you because you now work out and have a new hair cut, life doesn't work that way
Improving yourself will help substantially in acquiring friends, don't listen to these people. Nobody wants to associate with a loser.
The good thing about the modern world is there are so many options for socializing. If the frat fags don't gel with you, try to make friends elsewhere.
>>17253142
first off cut the vicious attitude, I can feel the contempt coming off of you
secondly, your totally ignoring how valuable all these books are to helping me finally get how to interact with people and get them to like me, instead of acting like an autistic spaz
So its the physical looks stuff combined with the social stuff
Dude, you're being ridiculous. Just chill, you'll be fine.
I was a virgin until I was 24. It's been about 7yrs since then and I've now slept with near 30 women (lost track around 17ish), 90% of whom I found legitimately quite attractive and would date.
Also, after you figure out what you're really into, you may find women with whom you share great sexual chemistry with, but only find them to be averagely attractive.
Anyways, point is - chill out, relax, don't worry about it. The more you worry about something, the less likely you are to get it.
>>17253138
>well yeah that's already happening, but I don't think its going to be enough
So what's "enough?" What's your victory condition?
If it's just loss of virginity, get a hooker. If you're already doing everything I've explained, then just let it run its course. And stop being so overwhelmingly pathetic. I can practically smell it through my monitor. Imagine what it must be like for the people around you.
>>17253102
dude. dude. chill.
you just laid out a long fucking list and an entire life time change just to 'get laid'.
>>17253154
>I can feel the contempt coming off of you
I'm sorry you're too fragile for honest opinions
>your totally ignoring how valuable all these books are to helping me finally get how to interact with people and get them to like me, instead of acting like an autistic spaz
Reading books does not teach you how to interact with people. But hey, if you're so confident that reading books can fix all your social problems, then what are you worried about?
>>17253102
Holy crap. Get it together.
Self improvement is for yourself. You get better, healthier, smarter, more interesting. Then you have a reason to have self confidence, which is the biggest attraction to broads.
If you've done all of this to "get laid" you're an idiot. Doing all this, for yourself, will make you into someone whom others want to be around. Then you'll get laid, not because it's your direct goal but because you've become the kind of person who can get laid.
God. Please don't listen to these fucking losers.
There is -nothing- wrong with improving yourself.
If you keep trying, you'll eventually get it. I believe in you, good job, keep it up.
>>17253171
>There is -nothing- wrong with improving yourself.
No one's saying there is. We're saying that physically improving yourself isn't going to get OP his goal unless his appearance was the problem in the first place.
>>17253159
victory condition is being able to get laid independently without having to rely on other people to help me or having to use hookers
its one of those "learn to fish eat forever have someone give you a fish eat for a day" type things
plus I dont have the money needed for hookers forever
Best case scenario is I get a girlfriend she goes on pills and the end, infinite bareback sex for free
>>17253160
>you just laid out a long fucking list and an entire life time change just to 'get laid'.
well not being "normal" is what's caused me to be a virgin up to this point, I have to blend in and get the approval of everyone around me or I get cast out and cut off from everything including sex
>>17253164
these books teach stuff like never criticise or complain, give compliments, ask follow up questions, get them to talk about themselves as much as possible, remember people's names, make eye contact in the little space in between their two eyes (where to look), never cross your arms or legs, smile, match their handshake grip, and a whole bunch of other shit, I have pages of notes saaved on my pc
>>17253169
No getting laid is the reason for all of this, I finally realized a while back that I had 0 chance of it ever happening unless everyone around me viewed me as being "normal" like them and actually liked being around me and wanted me to be around them
>>17253102
This kind of self-improvement is very worrisome to me. Its a dangerous "fix-all" perpetuated here on 4chan that completely ignores the deeper implications of social interaction and acceptance.
Molding yourself into someone you think everyone likes might attract people who are attracted to fit people in nice clothes but they won't be attracted to you. In the bigger picture its an entirely empty, symbolic social gesture that, ultimately, won't help you make friends. Not really friends, anyway.
Nice clothes and a hair cut aren't a personality. Reading books on how to manipulate people into liking you is not friendship.
Do you want a tip? The kind of people that will only interact and be friends with you because of your clothes and your muscles are really shitty, toxic people that shouldn't be in your life for any reason.
I know you feel like you don't belong anywhere but I'm here to tell you from experience that the sparkly golden upper echelon of people you so desperately want to infiltrate is, in reality, a very empty, lonely place to be.
>>17253179
>these books teach stuff like never criticise or complain, give compliments, ask follow up questions, get them to talk about themselves as much as possible, remember people's names, make eye contact in the little space in between their two eyes (where to look), never cross your arms or legs, smile, match their handshake grip, and a whole bunch of other shit, I have pages of notes saaved on my pc
That's nice, but that alone isn't going to help. I can read books on brain surgery and make as many notes as I want to, but that doesn't mean I'll know how to actually do it.
>>17253180
your missing the point, I want to stop being a virgin and if this is what I have to do to achieve it then its worth it
>>17253175
You don't think losing weight will make him more attractive to females? You don't think being a fatty turns some people away from being your friend?
>>17253183
My family thinks its just so great all these changes I'm making and my parents seem to be practically beaming over it and even my brother who for a while has hated me seems to like me now and is acting buddy buddy with me
I can hold normal conversations now and get gym chads to laugh and smile and give me tips
Girls seem to have 0 problem interacting with me and even helped me with proper form on gym equipment touching my shoulders and arms
I still feel so doubtful, I feel like if I get optimistic I'm just gonna get slapped down again, I don't see how any of this is anything like "oh great going woooo" when all of this is supposed to just be the default and nothing special
>>17253188
If the only problem was that he's unattractive, then sure, improving his physical appearance is a great idea. I'm not disagreeing that making yourself more attractive is a bad thing. But that's not his only problem - his personality and social skills are too.
>>17253189
>I still feel so doubtful, I feel like if I get optimistic I'm just gonna get slapped down again
Well, that's probably because you've built up what 'success' is going to be like. You have expectations of what's going to happen, but the fact is, no one knows what's going to happen. If things don't go the way you want them to, you're setting yourself up for major disappointment, mostly because you didn't do this stuff for yourself, you did it for the approval of others.
>>17253179
>victory condition is being able to get laid independently without having to rely on other people to help me or having to use hookers
The thing is, you're there right now. You may have trouble, but there's nothing actually preventing you from getting laid. There's someone for everyone as long as you're relatively normal. Normal as in not totally disfigured or I-wash-myself-with-a-rag-on-a-stick level obese.
You don't need to get a Captain America body. You don't need to dress like an Abercrombie model. These things will help, sure, but aren't necessary. How many people can fit this description anyway? You just need not to be a creepy sperg, and not feel entitled to getting laid by Victoria's Secret models.
You don't have to completely conform your personality to be a normie either, but don't be a school-shooter square peg in the round hole of society type of weirdo that threatens to off themselves on /adv/ if they can't get laid.
>>17253194
>im doing it for others
No I'm doing to impress others so that either a girl will like me enough to be willing to have sex with me or I will get friends that view me as enough of a "bro" to be willing to pull their strings and set me up
All this self improvement shit is just a means to the end of getting people to like me and thats just a means to the end of getting laid
sex is the end
>>17253184
Sure, man. Do what you want, just don't come to /adv/ and then complain when you aren't getting the advice you want. I got the point, I just disagree with you.
There's a difference between self improving to feel better about yourself and changing yourself to please other people. What you've described is the latter and in my opinion its an extremely dysfunctional way to think.
Everyone I've seen who thinks thats the solution to being unlikable or not good enough just commits themselves to spending even more time not discovering who they really are and loading themselves up with fake, material bullshit to distract people from the fact that they have absolutely no confidence or self identity.
Becoming just another carbon copy gym/clothes/car/haircut manipulative douche bag is a bad move. That's my opinion.
Take it or leave it, man.
>>17253201
You're proving my point: you're doing it for others, not yourself. And if you don't get sex, you're going to end up even more of a bitter fuck, because you don't realise that your improving your appearance doesn't make you any more bearable to be around.
>>17253197
whats preventing me from getting laid right now is I have little to no social life, I can't build up the kind of social life needed to get laid until 2 things happen
all the self improvement shit is done and the next semester starts
the self improvement shit will be done just in time for the next semester and then I have to put everything I've got into building up this social life
What worries me is that I wont be able to pull it off even with all this shit, that something will go wrong or I'll have left something out or I dont know
Ive never done any of this before its all theoretical and in theory everything is easy in practice but in practice theory doesn't know what its talking about half the time
>>17253208
End goal = sex
Impress others = sex
So I need to impress others
>>17253213
>I wont be able to pull it off even with all this shit
This is what will happen, because you fully believe that making yourself more attractive and reading books is all you need to do to get a social life. Don't come back here crying that your life didn't suddenly improve because you look better than you did three months ago.
>>17253197
I'm a like 6/10 with a decent paying job and shitty social skills.
What's step 2? If I hit 25 in a few months still being a virgin I might as well kill myself.
>>17253214
None of what you've done is going to impress people. Unless you've talking about the improvement over the break, which will only impress people if they were aware of your existence before the break, which it doesn't sound like it.
Also sex isn't just about impressing people
>>17253223
>>17253219
ok then what the hell do you two suggest I do to get laid?
and do not fucking say "stop worrying about it" or I'm not even going to respond
>>17253102
Let me offer my own perspective. I've always been fairly well liked; even in middle school people thought I was weird, I was fat and awkward and socially inept and bad at sports, but being liked by at least somebody was never my weak point because even the cool kids who despised me at least thought I was funny. Over recent years (after college, I'm 25 now), I've grown more outgoing and it's really made me feel like I'm blossoming as a person and kind of leveled up my social life.
In those same recent years, I got /fit/ and dressed better. That was what gave me the boost I needed in a lot of ways. I don't think there's a coincidence there. It won't solve your problems, but it will definitely improve people's first impressions of you and garner more respect. Moreover, you'll have more confidence by virtue of your own pride in your transformation.
I would encourage you to stop trying so hard to please others. Instead, try to be the best version of yourself you can imagine. Being liked is more about listening to and reading others' needs and emotions in the moment, being a good listener and maybe making the right references, than it is tailoring your life to please an imaginary audience.
Looking good gets people to smile at you and listen to you more. Having character is what makes you interesting and that you can only cultivate by living and learning.
>>17253233
Work on your social skills. Put those pages of notes you've taken from those books in action. You go to the gym - talk to people there as a start. Start a Tinder profile and get used to talking to girls as well.
And make your expectations more realistic. Get out of this mindset that your life is going to magically improve if all you do is lose weight and work out and read books about how to talk to people, because it won't.
And lastly: actually listen to what you've been told here. You asked for help, you're wasting everyone's time, but most importantly yours, if you don't.
Oh, and girls don't owe you sex. Don't fucking go apeshit if you're rejected.
If you stop sucking dicks, that's a good start.
>>17253239
>Being liked is more about listening to and reading others' needs and emotions in the moment, being a good listener and maybe making the right references
Thats basically what all the books are saying, they are just telling me exactly how to be able to do it no matter what the situation is
>>17253243
>Work on your social skills. Put those pages of notes you've taken from those books in action. You go to the gym - talk to people there as a start.
I literally already do that, didnt I already talk about that ITT?
>Get out of this mindset that your life is going to magically improve if all you do is lose weight and work out and read books about how to talk to people, because it won't.
Well of course not, I used to be 307 pounds and now I'm 215, I used to dress and act like an autist and now I don't, I used to have everyone laugh at me and hate me and now gym dude bro chads smile and enjoy talking with me and give me tips
I still feel dead inside
I need all of this to propel me to getting laid, I dont care about this shit on its own, its just a means to the most important end of all
>girls dont owe me sex
yeah and a guy with infinite water doesnt owe a dying guy water technically
>inb4 doesnt matter dont do it
I know, flipping out is what would be called "counter productive", I wont do it
>>17253258
You know, if all that matters is getting laid, why don't you go and fuck a hooker?
Also you didn't address what I said about talking to girls on Tinder.
>I still feel dead inside
This is an indication that your problem is not your looks or the fact that you're a virgin, and that there's something else going on.
>>17253102
Its a continuous effort. A lifestyle.
Don't worry about the time constraints. If you keep working at it you'll be fine, literate, and desirable.
All that your negativity is doing for you is undermining your effort.
Remember there is no end for you to slack off at. There's only everlasting moving onwards. Or some shit like that. Nothing waits, and nothing stops you.
(seriously, the no-thing stops you)
>>17253260
>why not a hooker
because the average hooker runs 100 bucks a session
thats a 1000 for 10
if I want on average 3 or 4 sessions a week thats 300-400 dollars a week
I cant afford that shit
and plus condoms are shit anyways if I can get a girlfriend on pills Im golden
>tinder
I dont think I look good enough yet and I dont want to feel the pain of only matching with morbidly obese girls
>something else
I really believe with all of my being that its the lack of sex in my life
I cant think of anything else I want
I'm 26 year old kissless virgin with a degree, a stable white collar job, and a mortgage on a home.
It's possible to live without a sex life. You'll feel the frustration of course, but remember that not everyone is meant to feel love and affection and sometimes it is just better that we live quietly alone.
>>17253276
fuck
that
if I ever get to where you are someone just fucking shoot me and end it
>>17253273
>if I want on average 3 or 4 sessions a week thats 300-400 dollars a week
You never said you wanted regular sex, but fair enough
>if I can get a girlfriend on pills Im golden
Use condoms until she's tested, and don't be surprised if she wants you tested despite you being a virgin for peace of mind. Also not all girls want to be on BC.
And how do you know that condoms are shit if you've never had sex anyway?
>I cant think of anything else I want
I didn't say it was something else you wanted. I said that there's something else going on. It might be a mood disorder or something.
>>17253281
I feel like you're going to be so underwhelmed when you finally have sex. It's not the be all and end all that you're painting it to be. I'm not surprised you think this way though, most frustrated virgins do
>>17253289
you talking about condom or no condom?
because i really dont care that much about it with a condom
>>17253286
getting tested is nothing compared to everything else I've already done and everything I'm going to do, whatever
>not all girls want bc
I don't see any reason why she would refuse short of having a medical incompatibility with it
and in that case I'd have to seriously consider getting a different girlfriend
>well how do you know
Everyone always says that
For one thing, because everyone else also says that sex with a condom is shit and is nothing compared to it raw
Secondly, I can go and put on rubber gloves and wash my hands, then take the gloves off and do the same thing, and there is a massive difference
Same concept
>>17253330
Either way, you're jumping the gun. You've got to get a girlfriend first, and there's no guarantees
>>17253336
its all about long term planning man
I gotta think multiple steps ahead like a chessmaster
I have a different question for everyone ITT:
Should I get drunk when I rush fraternities?
Part of me feels like it will help to calm my nervs and make it easier for me to make them like me, the other part of me says it will make me reveal that I'm only there to try to get them to like me to the point that they are willing to help me get laid and thus fuck everything up
>>17253310
lmao
that's the most virginal thing ever asked
>>17253388
how
