Let us talk about the recent flood and oversaturation of Isekai themed manga and anime with built in character stats and skills you usually see only in videogames.
What's your opinion on them?
>>143732890
They're shit, all of them.
>Inb4 "You should try ____________ it's actually pretty good"
Nope, it's also shit, and if you njoy reading that then you're either underage or retarded
>>143732979
You should tryNice subtle request, faggotit's actually pretty good.
Isekai is a deconstruction of all anime - they're just self insert wank fest for virgins who can't succeed in real life.
>>143732979
Kumo desu ga is pretty good.
>>143732890
How about we talk about oversaturation of school manga and anime?
>>143733039
Do not spoonfeed retards.
>>143733028
>deconstruction
Is this the new maymay word?!
>>143733077
It's gonna serve my agenda of continued scanlations if more people read it. I'm gonna be hurt the most when not enough people know about it and scanlations stop eventually.
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/interest/2016-06-30/short-story-contest-bans-traveling-to-an-alternate-world-fantasy/.103755
>One currently running Japanese short story contest, a collaboration between Bungaku Free Market and Shousetsuka ni Narou (...) has announced that it will not be accepting any submissions with plots about "traveling to alternate worlds" or "being reincarnated into other worlds."
>According to the contest website, any genre is allowed, including fantasy, horror, and drama, but only alternate worlds are banned.
>>143733173
Has such a thing ever happened before?
Like, no stories about High Schoolers and their Harems.
>>143732979
95% is shit, due to shit writing style, retarded superficial character interacion or plot progression, dumb copy-paste character inserts and overuse of tropes. Still there are a few rare series that are a good read despite all of that.
What do people think about Sevens?
Technically not an isekai story.
>>143733339
Have yet to start it, the whole little sister stealing MC's powers spoilers i have heard makes me rage.
>>143733008
I'm not even going to look at shit like >>143733039 because I know that if it's isekai, it's shit and below the fanfiction you can find on tumblr or whatever.
>>143732979
Well some do have good points. Should really have a list of Isekai worth checking out.
- Overlord
- Kono suba
- Kumo
- Slime
Thats all I can think off.
>>143733528
Its literally about a girl reborn as a spider. Its basically Itsy Bitsy as a manga.
>>143733339
>LN
Into the trash
>>143733539
> Overlord
Nope, it's bad, FOTM shit that caught on because MC was a skeleton. Newfags on /a/ latched into it and it's a typical wish fulfillement fantasy, your tastes are crap.
>Kono suba
Don't know, but it's shit
>Kumo
Don't know, but it's shit
>Slime
Don't know, but again, it's probably shit
Thanks for proving my point.
>>143733173
wew, if it was allowed I bet the isekai story would win 100%.
>>143732890
remember when isekais where fun?
We need one with a female protagonist. No, the slime one doesn't count.
If Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear got a manga or anime I'd be indescribably happy.
Zero no Tsukaima did it before it was cool and now it gets lumped in with the tripe it's become.
Frankly, I blame Sword Art. It was the poison pill that got dropped into the Visit Other Worlds well and turned the Wish Fulfillment part of the genre up to the point of absurdity.
>>143733710
Yeah, isekais back then weren't MC who were losers going to a different world as a 2nd chance.
>>143732890
They are amazing wish we got more.
>>143733735
Too bad the writer hardly thinks ahead when making the story. Lots of wasted potential with this one.
>>143733759
They were also often full of likable and focused on fun rather than really dark neurosis and revenge fantasy.
The current era is our fault for always asking for protagonists who don't dick around and just fuck the girls and indulge in their harems instead of endlessly teasing up. WE DID THIS!
Isekai with Paladin going around righting wrongs when.
>>143733735
But there's atleast two with female protagonist, Kumo desu ga and the other with OL being reborn as a nobleman's daugther in an otome game or something.
Isekai stories have made me start to hate Chessmaster type characters, and that bums me out.
>>143733850
What I like about older Isekai like Elves, Escaflowne etc is that there's actually a sense of adventure and exploration to it. Modern isekai focus too much on giving MC super special powers and tend to neglect the wonder of ending up in a different realm.
>>143733608
B-but it isnt wishfulfilment. I just want to see someone acting badass without morals holding him down and see where it takes him. Like hell I would want that to be my life.
>>143733844
Lolis are being collected, all is right with the world.
>>143733862
>OL being reborn as a nobleman's daugther in an otome game or something.
Link?
>>143733608
>he doesn't know konosuba
>even though it's been on the frontpage every day for the past 3 months.
nice bait
Beside Konosuba, most Isekais are shit though as you you said.
>>143733436
Wut? Goddamn Celes, what a cunt. And thanks for spoiling this.Cunt.
>>143733971
>乙女ゲームの破滅フラグしかない悪役令嬢に転生してしまった…
I think this is the one.
>>143733925
Even Inuyasha did this better than most modern stuff. As I said in a previous post, I lay the blame at Sword Art's feet. It poisoned so much of the current industry.
>>143734033
>Bakarina
Oh god pls no
The problem with Isekai is nothing would change in the story if you removed the part where MC dies or gets transported to another world.
>>143734033
is anyone translating it?
>>143734134
This is true.
>>143732890
>built in character stats and skills you usually see only in videogames.
The reason why Nips do this is because it cuts down on world building and makes things easier to write. They also throw in some other tropes. This is why you always got a Demon King for some fucking reason in Isekai's.
>>143734201
Did Fate start the RPG stats trend? If so its sad because the people aping it totally missed the point of it in Fate. Or does it predate that?
>>143734134
What are you saying?? All the troubles the other world has would continue if it wasnt for MC-kun!Why is every Isekai world filled with people with an IQ of a 10 year old, according to Japan.
It's shit but who cares
>>143734167
It a short story that is already completely translated for some time now. It is about a tomboy girl which causes a lot of giggles while reading it.
>>143734167
I suppose, according Mangaupdates last update was 139 days ago but who knows how accurate that is.
>>143733093
>new
>>143734263
>Did Fate start the RPG stats trend?
No, RPG stats have been around for a long time.
This is what I got to say about Isekai that uses RPG Stats. It only should be legitimately used under two conditions:
1) The story is based off of DnD/Any other equivalent in which a Stat/RPG System is used and is important to Characters and Story/It is fully detailed and not half-assed about.
2) The story is set in an actual game setting like VRMMO/MMO/and those type of worlds coming true etc.
You have no reason to use RPG Stats and what not in actual Fantasy/Sci-Fi Setting.
I recently had a discussion about this genre with someone irl who claims to read many translated Chinese novels and doesn't mind the genre because something about how only the first few chapters are usually the same in the stories.
I don't partake upon the isekai genre myself but this sounds like bullshit.
>>143734263
nope
>>143734474
Yes it is basically just a gimmick to be able to associate yourself better with the MC, a well as explain the stupid ideologies of MC we have in our world regarding slavery, racism, sexism etc.
>>143733743
He wasn't reincarnated though, he was just summoned. And the world doesn't revolve around RPG mechanics or game logic
ZnT is just normal fantasy LN which there is alot of.
>>143734474
Nearly all Isekai's go the same route in how the MC arrives in the other world.
>>143733608
>I don't know shit
>but I'm right because I said so
>thanks for proving me right
You're welcome anon.
>>143733743
ZnT is pretty wish fullfillment desu.
It's Isekai, harem and school setting, all at the same time.
>>143734590
oh shit my bad, dragon pink isn't an isekai
>>143734471
>>143734590
I meant as a serious storytelling device. Obviously a ton of older shows used RPG tropes as a gag or a reference, but I don't remember a serious fantasy story using them to describe character stats and abilities until Fate.
>>143734824
Yeah, but ZnT is, you know, good and fun instead of profoundly disturbing.
>>143735017
That it is.
>>143735017
How disturbing?
>>143733925
This. isekai stories back then really felt like adventures, most isekai stories today just focus on the daily life of the mc impressing everyone he meets with the special power that was granted to him.
I guess part of it was because characters back then actually want to go back home, so they do stuff like searching for clues and completing the "story quests". With stuff today, the original world elements (like modern knowledge) are only there so that MC can be super special right from the start.
>>143733608
>Don't know, but it's shit
>Don't know, but it's shit
>Don't know, but again, it's probably shit
>probably
Spot the crossboarder
>>143735385
>He actually defends isekai garbage
That's pretty pathetic senpai. I've read one and I cans afely say that I wouldn't want any of that shit on my shelves if it was given away for free.
>>143732890
>with built in character stats and skills you usually see only in videogames
I wouldn't mind these if it were set in a Sci-Fi isekai world, but every isekai setting is the same medieval european shit with sword and magic. Like seriously it so samey, that I wouldn't be surprised if all authors said that every series is actually set in the same world.
I really should properly check my post before posting.
>>143735445
The problem with isekai in a futuristic world is that the MC wouldn't have any useful future knowledge or insight to contribute and it would be no different than him being just a regular person of that world.
It's sad an entire genre of fiction managed to grow out of roughly what amounts to /tg/ "Elf slave wat do," threads.
I just don't know how people can stand to read stories where the heroes face no adversity. I get the desire of a harem of willing women, really, I can let that slide, but the way the MC's in these plots just effortlessly dominate everything that stands in their way just feels so damn empty.
And don't get me started on the glorification of amorality. The average High School Harem Rom-Com protagonist has more redeeming qualities than Isekai "heroes," and the number one complaint about that genre for a decade plus has been "there is no reason for all these girls to be attracted to them." I mean, at least most Harem MC's have "Is Nice," going for them.
>>143735522
Basically: >>143735445 Beat me to it.
Sci-Fi Isekai be interesting considering the Mc would be useless in using that technology; depending on how advance it is in the future.
>>143735648
There is a novel where MC is reincarnated 100 years in future and because misunderstandings gets considered the smartest genius of the world who managed to advance the technology level of the world 50 years.
Shitty plot but fun to read.
![357283[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/R9YFCEK.png "357283[1].png")
>>143735782
>>143735522
This is the crux of why the Isekai genre has fallen into the gutter. Its become entirely dependent on this concept of "The MC has knowledge from the future and this allows him to automatically win everything."
Back in the day future knowledge just gave the Main Character a different perspective from the locals, a different way of thinking, a more modern and familiar sensibility or sense of morality. It was rarely if EVER a "Power."
Not to mention that modern Isekai heroes have NO morality generally because these days the genre is about revenge fantasy rather than escapism.
>>143735808
http://www.novelupdates.com/series/i-got-reincarnated-and-mistaken-as-a-genius/
>>143733735
There's already many of them in shoujo manga. Isekai and reincarnation stories have been a thing in them since the 80s~90s.
>>143735522
That's a good thing. The only use to reincarnation/summoning/what fucking ever as a plot device is as an excuse to explain the setting to the readers like making the MC an amnesiac.
>>143735430
>I've read one
>it's shit
>that means all are shit
Wew
You might as well say all anime is shit then. Oh wait, I almost forgot where I am.
>>143735912
Yeah but those are all fujoshit. I want a modern isekai, complete with retarded harem antics, just swapping the gender of the MC.
>>143735810
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that MC having future knowledge for automatic win is a good thing, it's just such a common aspect of isekai stories now that I don't think any writer is going to deviate from it.
>Back in the day future knowledge just gave the Main Character a different perspective from the locals, a different way of thinking, a more modern and familiar sensibility or sense of morality.
This would be cool. I'd love to see this in a sci-fi setting too, the MC having to deal with all the changes in value and technologies.
>>143735895
Thanks man.
>>143735912
Fuushigi Yuugi was the shit. What a neat manga.
>>143735937
>Mc is an amnesiac
I miss that plot excuse. Sometimes it was cool, sometimes it wasn't.
>>143733735
Have pic related mate.
The Mc was a guy but got reincarnated as a girl. Who is fighting in not WWI for Not German Empire in Not Europe.
Look, its stories on a amateur writing site.
Most of them are copying each other and most of them aren't very well thought out and just pure wish-fulfillment.
Don't complain without naming a title or two, because anyone can tell you what the problems are with a specific title, no one can discuss a just 'in-general' genre because that inevitably points to a the most annoying terrible isekai story you read maybe two chapters of and dropped.
The writers know its old hat. Thats why stuff that gets serious translations that is isekai are like Katahane no Riku and Tsuki ga Michibiku Isekai Douchuu.
They still have OP as fuck MCs, its just they do well giving the story conflict and making it interesting. Thats the real curse of isekai, that it ends up like hentai doujin where its fun for about ten minutes or so then its forgettable.
>>143736027
Genderbent reincarnations always seem a bit odd to me. Tilea's Worries was the one I understood the least. The guy is still a creepy otaku on the inside and the only difference is that he gets away with molesting his sister and an elf because he's a girl now.
>>143735627
These sort of stories are very old, Mark Twain's "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court" was basically about an industrialist remaking Arthurian England. It was so popular that it inspired a whole slew of similar novels about a modern man traveling to another time/place and using their superior knowledge to dominate. To be fair there was a chapter when the MC futilely tried to explain to a smugly ignorant peasant about cost of living and quality of life.
There were lots of books in the 80's about modern protagonists dropped into fantasy worlds, Rick Cook's Wizardry series (Long-hair programmer creates a code based magic system), L.E. Modesitt Jr's Soprano Sorceress series (University music professor uses the local music based magic to enforce her will as she builds roads, infrastructure, and introduces gender equality and double entry accounting), and Eric Flint's Ring of Fire series (small town USA gets dropped into sword and pike era Europe and they use modern firearms, tools, and knowledge base to establish themselves as a superpower.) Harry Turtledove does alot of alternate fiction like "Guns of the South" where time travelers go to the Civil War and give Robert E. Lee and his troops AK-47s.
>>143736271
Hey don't miss the point here, none of those is anime or has anime girls in it.
>/a/ proves it doesn't know shit about writing genres and thinks LN cliches are a recent thing
>>143736365
Technically none of the web novels had anime girls in them either. My point isn't, "Hey go read these books". My point is even if it comes from a different literary context people have independently come up with this same genre before.
tl;dr Every repost is a repost of a repost.
>>143736405
>Talking out your ass without understanding what people are talking about ITT
Skills and stats and RPG elements in general are useful from a writer's perspective, as they allow a quick and easy classification of characters, their strengths, weaknesses, affinities and help avoid the "as strong as the plot needs them to be" pitfall and give characters roles, which allow the writer to avoid saturating his work by a specific kind of characters at the expense of the rest. It also makes it easier to build in advance reasons for the villains to lose, since their weaknesses are done from the beginning and you only need to introduce the chevkov gun a couple dozen of chapters ahead.
It also gives an easy progression for the MC, he has skills, these skills have ratings, the logical step is to max them. It's a lot easier than actually designing the evolution of a character, and the message behind your work, and way less risky. Skills allow a simple hedonistic character to work, as his progression will be represented by his skills rising, even though his behaviour doesn't change.
Basically, these stories are quick and easy, which is why they are tempting to many aspiring authors. While it does mean that many, many works are going to suck balls, it doesn't stop some works from shining. Though these tend to be older and not part of the new wave.
>>143733173
So it's time to submit a fantasy highschool harem battle LN?
Oh I fucking hate game mechanics in a fantasy story. Just that one, and I'd tolerate this isekaishit.
>>143736271
You can't compare Connecticut Yankee to modern Isekai fiction. Twain wrote a story that attacked a very prominent and popular image of the world because he recognized the danger that kind of white-washing history and romanticism presented when too deeply revered by society. The current era of Isekai fiction doesn't challenge these worlds, it revels in them, indulges in them to sate the most base of desires for treasure and women and fame and a need to get violent revenge against the perceived injustices and demons they suffered in their modern lives.
The type of fiction you're citing, alternate histories and time travel tales in which the modern clashes with the past, that's not what Isekai has become. Those stories focused on one of two things: The struggles of the lost character to find their place in the new world without the safety nets of the world they knew, or the ripples through the ancient world that the modern invasion causes. Isekai fiction isn't about world building or character struggle and growth, they're about a blank slate carving their way to the things they want and getting them without any real challenge.
I mean hell, look at something that's pretty trashy and pulpy like Gate: Thus the JSDF Went There. It fits into the genre you're talking about, and 75% of the roflstomp slaughter-the-dumb-barbarians-effortlessly shit happens off-screen or in single battle scenes. In the average Isekai story those battles of mechanized infantry vs phalanx swordsmen IS THE ENTIRE PLOT, not counting the gratuitous asides for graphic sex orgies with the harem the MC has collected/purchased
>>143733925
>Escaflowne
I think that and elves are a good cross-section of the previous generation of Isekai. No emphasis on class based video game systems, character interactions and compelling motivations, and for Escaflowne a strong sense of drama and thematic imagery. Elves I have less experience with but it was fun ecchi with interesting locations and characters. Kind of reminds me of Trigun at times.
Current generation is very much derived from .Hack and SAO. So we get fantastical settings but they are all based on video game logic which, given how it's used, makes characters far more 2-dimensional. You also have the the idea that the MC has to be some broken mess of a character with a "cheat" ability given to them to even out their initial positions. It's so common that some stories even acknowledge the cheat ability in the title.
And for the series that aren't blatantly in a video game I can't help but feel like they would be better if they just skipped the reincarnation bit and just told the story from the characters fantasy land perspective. The series Shiro no Koukoku Monogatari is an example of this. If you just changed the initial setup from "guy is reincarnated to be a king" to "guy who lived out in the boonies discovers his birthright" nothing changes in the story.
It's a crutch right now for authors.
>>143736681
>>143737309
I like your posts Anon.
>>143736180
>Thats why stuff that gets serious translations that is isekai are like Katahane no Riku
>Katahane no Riku
>serious translations
I feel like Grimgar is at least somewhat different, but that might be my blatant bias speaking, honestly.
>>143733925
Honestly, the easiest way around this would be a universe where nobody is inherently magical or supernaturally powerful, but they can use alchemy or some such to make magic items.
It makes the story more about normal people with cool gadgets and gimmicks rather than powerlevel lazerbeam wankery.
>>143737309
Magic Knights Rayearth and Fushigi Yuugi are also good examples from that era of the genre really being explored properly and producing great stories.
Spirited Away is also a fantastic example of course.
>>143732890
>recent
Fucking newfags
>>143735522
>>143735648
So like this one?
>>143733925
We are never getting those type of adventures back Anon. You need to move on or write them yourself.
It's kind of sad really most good Isekai's are buried under the bad one's and are pretty hard to find.
>>143737461
Not the same anon, but thanks.
>>143736027
>>143735937
>Mc is an amnesiac
Huh like Ochitekita.
>>143738091
The irony is that Mushoku Tensei which helped to create this trend definitely had a strong sense of exploration at least in the first half.
>>143735522
>>143735966
Reminder that Muv-Luv is sci-fi isekai
>>143732890
>Isekai
You mean SAO, right?
>>143737929
>Fucking newfags
Fuck off, there are clear fads in what gets mass produced and right now we're balls deep in "going to fantasy land".
>>143732890
So is there a list of current manga with the same theme? I was reading a few, but my bookmarks got wiped and I don't remember much except stuff like World Customize Creator and Re:Monster.
>>143738638
>sense of exploration at least in the first half
I especially felt that too in the early parts. The desert trip was nice as well.
>>143739285
World Customize Creator is okay. Mc has good taste going after children.
>>143738675
Thanks for partly ruining ML for me, man.
Though, to an extent, ML is different, because while it starts with the standard tropes (AND I WILL USE MY KNOWLEDGE OF GAMING TO HELP CREATE A NEW PILOTING OS) it quickly turns from power fantasy fellating the main character into having the entire universe shit on him.
But that's more of a VN thing instead of a LN thing.
What are the actual chances of survival for a person if they sent to high fantasy world with the nearest shit next to them?
What price could a laptop/cellphone actually fetch?
>>143732890
>recent
>Didn't complain about all the harem/battle harem adaptions
Reincarnation is popular in 2014, fuck off newfag
>>143736027
Is there a show where everybody has amnesia?
>>143740442
You might get some coin for artsy microchips and the plastic might be more valuable.
And being sent to a fantasy world without any knowledge you probably would end up killed (late medieval English feared the seas as source of unknown things) or enslaved. Enjoy not knowing a word of what they say.
>>143740720
All My Circuits, starring Calculon.
I started reading Shield Bro and the first chapters were pretty interesting, and the MC's gimmick looked perfect to avoid the usual route this genre takes, plus forcing other characters into relevancy.
...Then he adopted a qt racoon girl and I knew where this was heading
Then, as expected, a fucking chocobo loli joined the group...
Then a qt princess...
I'm still reading it but I lost almost all respect for it I had at the beginning.
>>143732890
Trash.
Japan, please fucking stop.
Pretty much the fucking worst shit.
>>143733539
>- Overlord
Promising start and that's it.
>- Kono suba
I didn't like it. Comedy didn't work, MC is hugely fucking annoying. HUGELY fucking annoying, still attracts a cute girl. I almost admire it for trying to be subversive, but I have big problems with it.
>- Kumo
Looks interesting but I wonder about it.
>- Slime
Similar to Overlord (not surprising)
Most of this "genre" is wholly terrible.
>>143741105
Nips have a copy habit of the most successful thing with tiny twists added on.
It takes awhile for the good ones to shine.
Pic: Heavily related
>>143741302
yeah I know
I just wish it was at least entertaining, rather than stinking particularly much of things I've seen countless times before/things I don't fucking like
>>143732890
Honestly, I don't think there is over saturation, isekai is pretty common in fantasy anime, its just we had 3-4 pretty close but there has been lot of them since for ever.
>>143734474
It is in fact bullshit.
They all just about amount t the same thing.
>>143741395
Pending to add Zesteria
>>143741395
Remove Sword Art from this list of almost all average-to-great animes.
>>143741469
I'm fucking glad Rokka no Yuusha is on this fucking list.
>>143741501
SAO is not even worst shit there. At least 10 more anime that need to be removed.
Not a problem they could just write the same thing they wanted to write in the beginning, just replace MC from other world with a MC from that world who is a dumb farmer in a remote village and doesn't know nothing about the world. Absolutely nothing would change if you do that in most isekai.
>>143733625
I guess they don't trust the voters that would probably pick them only because they are in fashion...which is a bit sad. I mean, imagine how bad and dumb the readers are considered that management has to ban a theme just because they know its popular these days.
>>143741629
Yeah, but most of the other shit ones didn't ruin any entire premises or genres for years to come.
>>143741629
As a person who watched most of the things on that list, I have to agree.
SAO is bad, but compared with things like Shining Tears x Wind, Tales of eternia or Arad senki...
Personally I think Prism ark is the bottom low of the list.
>>143735964
>Fujoshit
>In a Shoujo manga
The boys are going to be all over the girl, retard, not each other with the girl barely being relevant.
>>143734471
I think their use should be strictly limited to gags and even then sparingly. Numerical power levels and such are the prime tools of hacks who are incapable of writing scenes in a way where relative differences between characters' capabilities become apparent in a fairly realistic manner.
>>143742003
> Numerical power levels and such are the prime tools of hacks who are incapable of writing scenes in a way where relative differences between characters' capabilities become apparent in a fairly realistic manner.
I hope you're ready for all those crappy Isekai's with this becoming anime next year. Because that's what you're in for.
>>143733093
It's been the meme word since at least Madoka.
>>143742310
You need like one paragraph of text or 2-3 panels in comic to express that A is better than B in a swordfight or something similar. I blame Dragonball for making this popular in a non-written format.
>>143742446
Things happen Anon.
>>143742446
Not to mention that doesn't make to senes to go with numerical power level because later the author doesn't apply them anyway.
I mean, if there is something worse than an asspull in a clash between a characters with different power levels is an asspull in a clash between characters with numerical power levels. If the MC wins because nakama to someone lot stronger is bullshit, but acceptable, if MC numbers are low and wins anyway is even more bullshit.
>>143741075Even though i'm a sucker for shieldbro, i really do understand how you feel. With what Naofumi's situation getting exponetially better after getting raphtalia and firo. You following the WN or are you reading the LN?
>>143742860
Numerical power is always bullshit. No matter how strong you are; you can be defeated by someone weaker via their own power which somehow surpassed yours.
To be honest that's kind of bad writing unless numerical powers don't count towards fighting off poison/keikaku assassinations using arrow/bullets from behind that can kill the person.
>>143743166In shieldbro you can't use fucking guns without bullets being affected by your own stats. And guns can be set off by magic which is all the more inconvenient, so people just use magic or the good ole bow & arrow
>>143732890
I have no problem with the device per se. It's only bad when it overlaps with otaku self-inserting or MC getting wanked by the world like a bad LN.
>>143740635
But people were literally complaining about it, this happens literally every season when generic shitty battle harems/harem anime pop up.
>calling others newfag while showing of you are the actual newfag
Every story that uses videogame logic is pure shit!
Videogames should try to hide the fact they are games and emulate actual logic as far as possible.
Stories shouldnt use their shortcomings as a plot tool.
Fuck whoever came up with it and made fantasy in anime synonymous with "MMORPG-world".
MMOS are the genre who needs to move away from video-game logic the most because they are horrible tedious number-crunching experiences void of any magic, atmosphere or immersion these days. WHY THE FUCK would you use these sterile experiences as a setting for a story?
This Kumo is cute as fuck.
>>143744099
Japs love their grinding
>>143744099
It works when its done properly. Hack for example the series had other issues like pace but was fine aplying video game logics into the plot, characters behaved as people playing a game and mechanics were aplied properly too.
The problem with all those mmorpg worlds is that they write a fantasy story then wrape it with game gimicks and that just doesn't work.
But if you do them properly, writting an actual stroy about a game and not a fantasy story disguised as a game it could work perfectly.
>>143744432
This birb is rad as fuck.
>>143744099
>Every story that uses videogame logic pure shit.
To counter pic related. This WN turned LN turn Manga set in a VRMMO world is pretty nice considering its comfy sol, and the world building is occurring every update/expansion the Mc takes part in.
I still haven't seen anything top Aura Battler Dunbine in terms of using the isekai device to its fullest potential.
>>143733173
Watch as everyone writes "time travel" stories where magic conveniently exists in the past.
>>143744926
You mean like asura's wrath where it was some weird soul power stuff powering machines?
>>143744926
>Watch as everyone writes "time travel" stories where magic conveniently exists in the past.
That's not a bad idea. So long as it Christians/X-Anti Magic Church who purges the heresy known as Magic and everything fantasy from existence.
Sword Art Online isn't really isekai.
Although the Alicization arc comes close.
>>143745618
What's that arc about?
How does one improve the Isekai genre and stop it from becoming stale repeats?
>>143746141
by banning it
>>143746141
By giving up on it and actually being creative, using a completely different (and ideally original) idea
Or, at the very least, get rid of generic self-insert fantasies targeted toward gamers
>>143745778
This is going to take some explaining.
Part 1: Background
>Japanese Defense Ministry eyes the USAF's drone fleet with envy
>decides to build AI-piloted drones
>but these aren't going to be just any AI, they're going to be the bestest AI of all
>invent a machine for interfacing with the human soul, a technique for cloning the human soul, and a medium for storing the human soul
>let's just clone some human souls and call them AIs
>can't clone adult human souls because the clone believes itself to be the original person and goes insane from being inside a machine
>let's clone souls of newborn babies and raise them inside machines instead
>they set up a server farm on an oil rig in the middle of the ocean, build a VR world using the free SAO source code, and populate it with cloned human souls
>basically these souls living in a fantasy Matrix, complete with videogame mechanics because devs got lazy and just left most of the SAO code untouched.
>so in-game when a new human is born the server dumps a new clone into the system, when someone dies the server deletes the soul
>since the soul interface allows for time dilation like in Accel World, the devs leave the system running on like x1000 speed as a full-fledged society forms within the Matrix and basically play Civilization to test the parameters of the behavior of these human souls
Part 2: More Background
>so back when the Japanese were building the machine to interface with the human soul, they needed people to test the machine
>they got Kirito to test it because Kikuoka who's in charge of the project happens to know him and because they need someone used to VR (the machine creates a VR that works via the soul instead of physical senses)
>anyway after all is said and done Kirito gets stabbed by the last Death Gun accomplice, who escaped back at the end of Phantom Bullet
>because of hypoxic brain injury or whatever they stick him inside a soul machine as part of his recuperation (???)
The vast majority of isekai these days are some variation on
>a DQ JRPG world
>with unusually combat-oriented magic system
>cast using verbose incantations that contain Engrish
>where adventurer guilds manage the nonsensical profession of adventurer
>by acting as the middleman for job postings and ranking them from A to F
>and providing a convenient magic membership card that works like a smartphone
>where adulthood is reached at age 15
>where 1 yen is roughly equivalent to 1 copper coin
>where the demons are just hot demihumans and the war with the humans can stop if we just all UNDERSTANDING and sign a peace treaty
>which the war faction doesn't want signed and the peace faction has to try to overcome their transparent sabotage and false flag operations
>where demihumans are considered subhuman and sold as slaves
>which is not unusual because in the end, the logic of another world society is different from Japan, huh?
>where the protagonist has to buy a slave so he buys a cute demihuman who immediately wants his D
>in fact, everyone wants the protagonist's D because he acts like a Japanese which is so different from how these peoples society behave that it's a turn on
>also he has a cheat power that has no story purpose like being the chosen one or connected to him being from another world so the supernatural phenomena of this world reject him or something, he's just cheating
Not even that long ago we had LNs like Kino no Tabi, Boogiepop, Slayers, Spice and Wolf, Full Metal Panic, The Twelve Kingdoms, Jinrui wa Suitai Shimashita, Zaregoto, Banner of the Stars and the cool one with the panther-head guy and the little twins, which in turn produced good manga/anime adaptions too.
Now it's all chuuni isekai narou crap.
Sword Art Online, Re: Zero, Mondaiji-tachi, Maou no Hajimekata, Konosuba, GATE, Himekishi no Classmate, Mushoku Tensei, Isekai Maou to Shoukan Shoujo no Dorei Majutsu, Arifureta Shokugyou de Sekai Saikyou, No Game No Life, Tensei shitara Slime Datta Ken, Overlord, Kumo Desu ga Nani ka?, Hagure Yuusha no Aesthetica, Tate no Yuusha no Nariagari, Log Horizon, World Customize Creator, Tsuyokute New Saga, The New Gate, Yuusha Party, Hero BBS, Spirit Migration, Ore to Kawazu-san no Isekai Hourouki, Death March kara Hajimaru Isekai Kyousoukyoku, Isekai Tensei Soudouki, Konjiki no Moji Tsukai, Shisen no Shoukanshi, Toaru Ossan no VRMMO Katsudouki, Chihou Kishi Hans no Junan, Hai to Gensou no Grimgar, Kenja no Mago, Kuro no Iyashi, Koushaku Reijou no Tashinami, Tsuki ga Michibiku Isekai Douchuu, Gun-Ota, Sayounara Ryuusei Konnichiwa Jinsei, Re:Monster, Kouritsu Kuriya Madoushi, even Maybe joined the isekai bandwagon with Kekkon Yubiwa Monogatari.
Look at all this GARBAGE pile of series with identical premises and tropes. If anything, the standards are getting worse. The only really good ongoing isekai is Drifters.
>>143746530
>>143746141
Part 3: Even More Background
>back when Kirito was a tester for the machine they plugged him into their Clone Soul Matrix to see what would happen
>his memories were suppressed, he entered the world as a baby, and his soul spent many years there growing up as an ordinary villager with his friends Eugeo and Alice, then one day Alice was taken away by the Integrity Knights for breaking one of the unbreakable laws
>should explain that the cloned human souls have basically the Ten Commandments hardwired into their minds and they are incapable of breaking them or their eyes explode or whatever, except when someone does break them they are taken away by the Integrity Knights to the capital (more on them later)
>then when he was unplugged from the machine his memories of being in there were suppressed
Part 4: The Beginning
>back to the present, after nearly dying from being stabbed with a needle, Kirito wakes up in the Matrix
>meets Eugeo who doesn't remember him
>Kirito doesn't remember him either
>skipping over a load of shit, they kill some goblins, retrieve a magic sword, cut down a tree, and go on a journey to the capital to fight in a tournament to become Integrity Knights
Part 5: In Summary
>the capital sucks
>half the people there are assholes
>everyone's swordsmanship sucks
>the various schools of swordsmanships' ultimate secret moves are just basic SAO sword skills because devs got lazy again
>of course this means Kirito is a sword god because he knows all the skills
Part 6: More Summary
>the Integrity Knight system is a scam
>basically if you are strong or if you are aberrant enough to break the Commandments the world dictator wipes your memories and makes you believe she summoned you from heaven to fight for her and you are now her loyal knight
>Alice is now an Integrity Knight
>Eugeo becomes an Integrity Knight
>Charlotte ;_;
>>143746858
>full metal panic
>good
>>143746530
>>143747042
Nobody here cares that much about Shit Art Online and if you do you don't belong here.
tl/dr
>MAL
>GAIA
>r/anime
>>143746792
>where adulthood is reached at age 15
This was true though.
>where adventurer guilds manage the nonsensical profession of adventurer
This is common as shit.
I do not see a complaint with these two things.
>>143747042
>>143746530
>>143746141
Part 7: Kubo jelly of all this background
>so about that world dictator
>basically the magic system of this world is just dev console commands because devs got lazy again
>level of user privileges is tied to character level because devs got lazy again, nothing could possibly go wrong because they don't level up that fast anyway
>one day a noble called Quinella who figured out how to cheese the system to grind levels infinitely
>reverse engineered dev console commands that nobody should know by extrapolating from known commands
>installed Cardinal code into her own brain and became a game admin
Part 8: Why this is more like an isekai than the other SAO arcs
>1. The MC gets stabbed, passes out, and is transported into another world
>2. This world has many videogame elements similar to a game the MC is familiar with, which the inhabitants consider to be magic.
>3. Using his knowledge of this game, the MC cheats his way to superiority
>4. It's not just a transportation but also a reincarnation story, since there was the part where he lived out a second childhood in another world, during which he picked up two kawaii childhood friends who are added to his harem
>5. insert some nonsense here about gods
>>143747099
>Lookit me anon, do I fit in yet?
>>143746858
I'm tasting some abnormal levels of salt in this post. I think you need to take it back and make something else.
>>143746858
>Kino no Tabi, Boogiepop, Full Metal Panic
These 3 are bad, and while i like S&W it is nothing special. Jinrui seems nice from the spoilers i have heard and Guin Saga is probably the only masterpiece amongst the ones you mentioned.
>>143747363
Man, that sounds like a fucking mess.
Thanks for the rundown though.
>>143732890
>oversaturation of isekai themed manga and anime
What? They're like less than a percent of either of those.
Re-using genres isn't the problem
Writers being incompetent is
Original does not equal good
>>143747566
That's okay anon, it's not like I sacrificed a few brain cells to write it all up or anything (and I didn't even get to the part about the NSA secret agents or the joint Chinese-Korean invasion of the server)
>>143747552
Your taste is fucking awful. Also, we're talking about anime and manga, not the LNs themselves, and the Guin Saga anime is shit.
Thrown into a fantasy world? Fine.
Everything runs on video game mechanics? No, 99% of the time that's just the author being lazy and is being used for writing convenience.
Using video game mechanics right down to "holographic" status windows and skill trees with points earned on level up? That's just disgustingly lazy and used as a cop out for actually showing character growth.
>>143747661
He watches three anime a season and picks up ten new manga a year, so he wouldn't know that.
>>143747755
You say that as if there were any seasons post-2010 which had more than 3 legitimately good anime.
Protip: there weren't
>>143747708
>talking about anime
Cause all the WN shit you linked has anime. Stop backpedaling faggot. It is your taste that is awful .
>>143747849
>you
I'm not him, but you're right, I didn't read his second list, so I fucked up. Anyway, not liking Kino, S&W, Boogiepop, and FMP is still shit taste.
>>143747832
>>>/v/
>>143733173
Makes sense. Isekai shouldn't even be considered a theme or genre at all. It's simply lazy writing, so why should a story contest bother with this kind of crap?
MC being from another dimension is just an excuse to have a white paper MC who's going to "learn about the world with the spectator", instead of doing actual writing and come up with some decent world building.
RPG mechanics is another cheap way to introduce magic and power levels without having to actually think about a believable and coherent magic/PL system for your story.
Not to mention some of these writers are probably just trying to turn their MMORPG experience into a story, which often leads to some awful fanfiction-tier story.
Sure there are some good alternate worlds stories, but they are good DESPITE being alternate world stories with RPG mechanics.
>>143746792
>where adventurer guilds manage the nonsensical profession of adventurer
This is the only thing that actually triggers me on my fantasy anime.
>>143748362
But isekai is as old as world, even in western fantasy. And there is some really good things with that theme.
All that you say about japanese LN is true, I give that, but don't blame the theme, blame japanese lazy writters.
>>143740720
>>143746792
I'd actually be fine with Adventuring guilds in isekai if they were actually a central plot point as opposed to something treated as a given
Like I'd enjoy a series about transportees trying to form an adventuring guild because they are asspained over the world not having one and having to deal with nobility and pre-existing mercenary groups
>>143744926
>Watch as everyone writes "time travel" stories where magic conveniently exists in the past.
Inuyasha?
>>143748682
>>143748410
I never understood why Adventure Guilds seem like a problem. I always thought Adventure Guilds were independent organization funded by the state and private interests group who also run the administrations of the Guild along with powerful members from it.
People register to become semi-independent groups under the jurisdiction of the Adventure Guild and follow their rules and regulations; in exchange they get neat passports allowing them access to certain restricted parts of the fantasy world, access to materials and discounts, and the ability to handle missions (Which are actually commissions) which gives them pay that is divided between the party members and the Guild up keep.
That's just me.
>>143732890
What about the one with the guy who has to kill his team members to get levelups?
>>143748919
Mostly the fact that adventurers always seem to be the only "profession" for dealing with monsters when really mercenaries, royal knights, and personal guards to nobility/merchants would all do the same jobs better and with better funding.
>>143747363
>>143746530
>>143747042
original asker anon here, i'm sorry for the aneurysm this thing gave you while typing it. i appreciate your sacrifice
>>143749302
Yeah, why anyone would ever want to be indie instead of actual employee for nobles, state or whatever is beyond me. Even bottom of the barrel shitheads wouldn't go for something so hilariously risky.
>>143749091
I never heard of that one before, what's it called?
>>143749456
You get more freedom as an indie.
>>143748919
>monsters are a big enough nuisance to justify an incredibly popular profession dedicated to hunting them
>instead of sending organized military force dedicated to this task they let a private citizen's militia deal with them instead
>except it's not a militia, it's it's the bloody volunteer fire department/neighborhood watch/courier service/pet finder/toilet cleaner/hunter-gatherer/inane shit doer all rolled into one
>they also have magic membership cards that only they use even though the magic behind them has so many applications
>any random dumbfuck can walk off the streets and just sign up, from a ten year old child to a convicted serial killer on the run
>unlike literally every other profession's guild, the Adventurer Guild will provide you with no mentoring because there is no such thing as an adventurer apprenticeship.
>the jobs you are given are regulated from F rank up to A rank which means jobs where you kill goblins are lumped in with jobs where you put up shelves even though they demand totally different skillsets
>therefore as an average client who wants a hole in the roof fixed or a package to be delivered you have no way of guaranteeing that the adventurer who takes up your request can actually do it properly, unlike if you hired a professional
>also the Guild is a monopoly employer so you have no control over your commission and the cut they take of your commission
>so you have to pay membership fees to the guild using money paid to you by the client which the guild has already taken a cut of, for the privilege of being allowed to have the guild act as the middleman between you and the client
>and the guild has no obligation to provide adventurers with anything even resembling training, equipment, supplies, or insurance, so the membership fees are just going to pad the pockets of the management
>>143749465
Gesellschaft blume. Can't really recommend it, though. Takes itself way too serious for what it really is.
>>143749465
Yakushoku Distpiari Gesellshaft Blue
>>143749715
Anon do you want me to type out a complete fucking function of an Adventure Guild in a fantasy world or some shit to make you happy?
Cause I will fucking do it.
>>143749799
>>143749826
Well juding from this page it seems kind of edgy, and not in a good way, but what's the story?
>>143749899
>Cause I will fucking do it.
Not that anon, but do it.
>>143749302
>>143749456
>>143749608
Shieldbro has the country of Zeltburg, the country of mercenaries. Most Mercenary organizations have their base of operations there, selling their power to the highest bidder. The adventurer's guild also has deep ties here which makes a lot of weapon and medicine shops thrive there. There's also a shitton of coliseums that, depending on the union you visit, will have differing goods in trade such as slaves, monsters or contraband.
There's as much money as there is blood flowing there.
>>143749994
Alright mother fucker. I'm doing it.
>>143749899
Sure, and please also explain why the Guild is not effectively a supranational superpower unaccountable to nobody with the strength to topple national governments thanks to their control of large numbers of A and S rank adventurers i.e. walking nukes because lolpowerlevels. to threaten governments with and extract favorable treatment.
>>143749715
>unlike literally every other profession's guild, the Adventurer Guild will provide you with no mentoring because there is no such thing as an adventurer apprenticeship.
Well, that depends on the setting. Konosuba actually has some kind of classes that Kazuma and his party were sent to because they fuck up so often.
>>143750134
Because the S class adventurers are getting marriage offers from the nobility and retiring.
>>143750134
Adventurer's guild is silly because their function is basically just exterminating wild animals and barbarians which historically have been possible for mankind to deal with without fucking adventurers.
The whole premise of setting up a guild like that is that they're incapable of hunting whatever bugs them to extinction. Pagans, tribals, wolves, bears and shit were all hunted to zero across Europe. Fuck, there used to be lions in Southern Europe.
>>143748919
To me, like lot other things in this short of work of fiction is that Adventure Guilds are more an excuse to dump information to a clueless MC and make conection with quests easier than actually something that is justified and has meaning for the setting or the story.
So its something unnecessary, it provides absolutely nothing. If you actually bother explaining things you don't need a quest board to make the MC involved with the quest for example. But is more easy to have him get a quest then something takes a twist than actually explaining what lead him to get involved.
If the adventure guilds had some sort of in world justification (to coordinate mercenary groups for example) or was involved in the plot someway would at least make sense, but usually is not, in most case it doesn't even appear again, is just there to the MC to registrer and get a beginner guide.
>>143749937
Just read the synopsis on batoto or wherever.
>>143749937
It's only super edgy in the first chapters; it mellows out a bit afterwards.
Pretty much there is a big bad/final boss that shows up every few years wrecking shit and it has to be killed. Everyone in the world has different powers like in any RPG game. Subjugators only "levelup" when their team members die. Like kill you're level 20 friend, boom you get 20 levels.
I'm really shit at explaining it. it has a cute girl though.
>>143750134
>Sure, and please also explain why the Guild is not effectively a supranational superpower unaccountable to nobody with the strength to topple national governments thanks to their control of large numbers of A and S rank adventurers i.e. walking nukes because lolpowerlevels. to threaten governments with and extract favorable treatment.
Dude you know that can be easily countered by saying all national governments have stronger A-S Ranking soldiers who are even stronger nukes.
>>143750267
Then why aren't those assholes eliminating threats to their nation and populace?
>>143750238
>>>143750134
>Adventurer's guild is silly because their function is basically just exterminating wild animals and barbarians which historically have been possible for mankind to deal with without fucking adventurers.
You forgot gathering twenty Red Grasses, or finding a young girl's lost pet cat, or solving a burglary case at the governor's mansion, or delivering a love letter, or crafting two pairs of hiking boots.
>>143750308
It's not like they're getting besieged by opposing countries and monsters, literally clawing at their walls on a daily basis.
>>143750239
>If the adventure guilds had some sort of in world justification (to coordinate mercenary groups for example)
Wouldn't that simply make the Adventures Guild basically Private Military Companies? And allow for the creation of multiple of them across the country that could start business rivalry shit instead of one unified Adventure Guild with a monopoly?
>>143750267
For plot purposes, there tend to be anywhere from five to ten S rank adventurers in existence, whereas in the army there is only one or two, who is usually past their prime.
That's not mentioning the fact that at the cannon fodder level, the average soldier tends to be the equivalent of a E or D rank adventurer at best, with a few veterans who are around B rank. In contrast the Adventurers Guild has far greater numbers of D to B rank adventurers simply by virtue of being so large.
>>143741469
>overlord trapped in a game
but its not
>>143750458
Just1: The king is deliberately weakening the nobles because he doesn't trust them. He sets up the adventurers guild to maintain order because the nobles weren't doing it anyway.
>>143750525
>Average soldier tends to be the equivalent of E-D
I don't believe that. If we are talking about soldiers for a country and their rankings.
General = A - S
Officer = B - A
Sergeant = C - B
Normal Soldier = D - C
Recruits = E - F
>>143750458
>Wouldn't that simply make the Adventures Guild basically Private Military Companies?
No actual Private Military Company is going to waste its members time by sending them to do inane shit like >>143750385 which has nothing to do with their core service of providing the use of force. A blacksmith's guild isn't going to send its apprentices to find missing cats, and a tailor's guild isn't going to send its apprentices to gather boar hides.
>and allow for the creation of multiple of them across the country that could start business rivalry shit instead of one unified Adventure Guild with a monopoly?
If only this was ever the case in isekai fiction.
>>143750658
Trained Soldier: E
Veteran Soldier: D
Sergeant: C
Trained Officer: D (It's connections, not ability)
Seals: B
>>143750308
Also remember that they can't mobilize all their shit without a good reason.
>>143750852
Oh look it's nonsensical ranking that happens in every series time
Because obviously the trained and well armoured soldier is inferior to a 15 year old that kills goblins and the guys capable of bench pressing boulders can't rise in the ranks
>>143750308
Goblins are attacking a small ass town in the boonies which time to time receives a check up by the Army to see if everyone is alive.
S-Rank is stuck at the capital guarding it. You really want to deploy an S-Rank to leave the capital undefended to kill some Goblins in the boonies?
It's better and way cheaper to higher someone else to do it.
>>143750949
If you have an adventurer's guild then guys benchpressing boulders don't rise up in the ranks in the army - if they could, they'd be in the army and not the guild.
>>143750949
When it comes to plot, if you compare their ability by the level of monster threat that the adventurers are usually mobilized to deal with that the normal soldiers have trouble with, that's the ranking you get.
>>143750949
Yes anon.
>>143732890
The legendary moonlight sculptor animu when ;_; tfw you'll never see a mc thats selfish as kazuma and wise as shiroe in a anime
>>143750647
>The king is deliberately weakening the nobles because he doesn't trust them. He sets up the adventurers guild to maintain order because the nobles weren't doing it anyway.
So instead he allowed the proliferation of armed and dangerous citizenry. Brilliant!
>>143751109
Fuck off.
>>143751150
You live in a world full of fucking Dragons and magic shit.
Shit doesn't matter in the first fucking place considering you got fucking Dragons and Immortal mages and shit.
>>143751150
>>143751213
Actually it makes sense for citizens to be armed considering the fantasy shit running around.
You would be a dumb ass if you weren't packing anything to defend yourself. Stop being butthurt over Adventure Guilds, Anon.
>>143751026
But why even let an adventurers guild be a thing when you could instead offer potential heroes cushy government jobs where they get treated as if they were entire divisions of the army.
These explanations are all stupid, but I'd let them pass if they were presented in the stories as a reason for an adventurers' guild to exist. But they're not.
An adventurers' guild is just a set up for a lame joke. "Ha Ha it's just like in a video game!"
>>143751266
Cause soldiers must be properly paid and training one plus gearing him takes money.While you want to have adventurers take on dangerous requests instead. If they die , no losses.
>>143751076
Army powerlevels in that game are weird, there's a massive gap between the average Royal Army soldier who is basically a useless scrub that gets beaten up by F rank bracers, and the Intelligence Division spec ops troops who can go toe to toe with senior bracers, and then there's Colonel Richard.
>>143751418
Calm down Anon. I'm giving you this (You) already; so stop spraying the salt everywhere.
>>143751266
In "The man who married a gorilla", it's because high level adventurers are too insane to control
>>143751450
>Cause soldiers must be properly paid and training one plus gearing him takes money.
That's just one way to do it. Hellenic states raised troops from Greek settlers who only got paid with their farm and had to serve for that farm. You could settle dangerous frontiers like this and have them rally to exterminate whatever monsters arise.
>>143751478
How so?
>>143750852
Can you explain these rankings? What separates them and what not?
I don't have a problem with the reincarnation bullshit, but I hate the video game shit. The only series I've read with video game stats that didn't turn me off is Konosuba, and I'm not sure why it doesn't there.
>>143751679
Each one achieved high rank by obsessing over something to the point that he would endure any hardship to achieve it. They are all fanatics, but each has their own niche.
>>143751801
Oh, yeah. I can see how that would be a problem if they got put in power.
>>143751007
That must be some serious threat if the S-rank always has to be present. Is there such a case in real life where the military has to stay?
>>143751680
From "The Man Picked up by the Gods", by memory:
G: You are a match for 1 goblin
F: you can fight several goblins
E: you can fight many common goblins
D: common goblins are no threat to you. You are a match for the goblin Knight.
C: The Goblin King in the field
B: The Goblin King in his castle.
>>143751993
>Is there such a case in real life where the military has to stay?
US Army garrisons in Germany throughout the Cold War in case the Russians invaded
US Navy stationed in Japan to ward off the Chinese
Et cetera
>>143733539
Most of those wouldn't be on it. Konosuba is good if you enjoy the comedy, that's about all it has going for it other then glorious explosions.
Overlord is wankfest wankfest just like most of the other crap. It's got a catchy start but once it gets into volumes and volumes of cock sucking and misunderstanding - fuck it.
Kumo is okay. I can actually buy into the video game shit because it has a good reason for existing, but the story stutters along and it seems like the author loosing track of it sometimes.
>Slime
There's a few of those, none of them are that good.
Mushoku Tensei is good if you can get past the harem, and manages to shit on wish fulfillment bullshit while still being said bullshit.
Ascendance of a Bookworm is my personal favorite and skips over all the fucking shitty video game shit tropes, focusing on living in a low tech world and making books.
Lazy Dungeon Master is fantastic even while embracing shitty tropes like slave girls and lucking into power.
Bringing The Farm To Live In Another World is surprisingly good, but by no means great, considering it's Chinese garbage where the protagonist's superpower is farmville.
Even Challenging the Demon Lord for My Daughter isn't bad if you just want to read someone gush over their adopted demon girl. I have a strong suspicion that it's going to go to crap and then Usagi Drop itself.
>>143751993
The DreadFul Labyrinth is in the Capital because the wealth extracted from it carries the kingdom.
>>143732890
They are all shit and its probably the most cancerous thing that has ever taken a hold of the manga/light novel industry. The only one I ever enjoyed was Mushoku Tensei. If I could erase them all from existence, I would.
>>143752064
>goblin goblin goblin goblin goblin
what a dull world
>>143735782
>>143735895
>i-got-reincarnated-and-mistaken-as-a-genius
I don't know what I expected.
>>143733539
>listing only the mainstream ones
Someone bring the WN expert in here.
>>143752130How about them shieldbros anon?
>>143752064
The Goblin King must be some super special goblin if this is the ranking.
>>143750646
I'm sure you mean "traped" in a game.
>>143750646
Do you honestly thing that the game becoming reality like in Overlord or LH is not the same than being in the game?
I can give you isn't exactly the same thing, but come on, between traditional high fantasy and game fantasy, Overlord or LH are certainly the later.
>>143734134
Because they have to make the MC a japanese male.
>>143752294
but the world of overlord didnt become real, the fortress the MC was in got transported to a real fantasy world from a game
>>143752294
>Do you honestly thing that the game becoming reality like in Overlord or LH is not the same than being in the game?
But the game didn't become a reality, the New World is different from Yggdrasil.
>>143752253
I dunno. It's definitely not for me.
It has all of the tropes I dislike, and then it feels like the story just goes way out of the way to shit on the main character. I gave up on it very early on.
The narrative just felt really hollow and cheap even though there are some pretty cool scene. In fact, it felt like the author came up with a list of cool scenes and then wrote the story around them.
>>143752203
The story is unusual in that the protagonist is a highly trained Ninja who can't find work in his own field but is incarnated (after dying) in another world with his ninja powers intact. HE spends the next several years recruiting and training his army of death slimes.
>>143752359
Though from some reason the magic from YGG carried over and fucked with the natural magic form NW which ran on souls.
>>143752359
But it's not a game is what he's saying. Some of the game became real and was transported to a, supposedly, real world.
Overlord takes place in a low tech real world that got bits of shitty MMO shat all over it throughout its history.
>>143752390
it's speculated that one of the earlier people to get transported used a world class item to literally rewrite the new worlds reality to include Yggdrassil magic
>>143752390
>Though from some reason the magic from YGG carried over
Ouroboros probably did that.
