What's the worst saga in all of Dragon Ball?
http://www.strawpoll.me/10058255
Your favorite
>>140727658
Gt, then Super.
>>140727658
>What's the worst saga in all of Dragon Ball?
Anything after the Namek saga is automatically shit.
>>140727841
GT doesn't count, retard.
Super, then GT.
>>140727658
Are you seriously taking the writing of Dragonball seriously?
>>140728213
Are you?
>>140727658
cell/android saga was the second best ark in the series
>one of the best villians and most threatening villians in the series
>trunks
>bringing back gero back was a nice touch making the connection to dragon ball made the series more complete
>>140728553
And this, folks, is a retard in their natural habitat.
>>140727658
Good taste
Cell saga more like asspull and retardation: the saga
>>140728391
No, because it's stupid, inconsistent, and not compelling at all. Even Toriyama doesn't know what the fuck he's doing.
>>140727658
OP getting BTFO in his shit poll
The General Blue saga is objectively the worst
>>140729289
Everything up through the Cell saga was pretty consistent and self contained despite being flimsy at times.
It's hard to like dragon ball after seeing Toriyama take a huge shit on it. DBM is better at this point.
I AM A POWERFUL MONSTER CREATED FROM THE GENETIC MATERIAL OF ALL THE STRONGEST FIGHTERS COME FROM A PARALLEL FUTURE
I HAVE DEPOPULATED ENTIRE CITIES BY SUCKING EVERY LAST PERSON DRY
I HAVE REACHED MY GENETIC DESTINATION OF BECOMING THE PERFECT LIFE FORM
NOW I WILL DO ABSOLUTELY FUCK-ALL FOR TEN DAYS WHILE YOU GUYS GET READY TO FIGHT ME FAIR AND SQUARE
>>140729674
Once he learned that there's a place where people could get strong quickly in a short span of time, he becomes curious and lets everyone train to become as strong as he can be. He has Goku's genes, he wants a good fight. And he never once considered that he might lose and as far as he knew the saiyans on earth were the strongest in the universe.
>>140729530
Every interview I've seen of Toriyama just makes me think he's not a very clever man.
It's not that he simply wanted the series to turn into a ridiculous uphill ride of escalating powelevels because he rolls that way, it's that he genuinely couldn't think of a way to introduce new enemies and new hope spots for the heroes than just simply making everyone stronger.... again.
>>140729530
What do you mean "at this point"? Dragon Ball ended 20 years ago.
Super is by far the worst drivel Toriyama has managed to come up with. Even the original Dragon Ball is better holy shit
I cant believe I got tricked into watching Super
>>140729939
here's your (you)
Anything Super. What kind of shitass biased poll is that anyway? You don't even list all sagas. It's either Cell or other.
agreed
>ruined the mystique of super saiyan by everyone becoming one
>not finding doctor gero 3 years earlier
>piccolo fusing with kami is somehow above super saiyan
>kami suddenly has an incredibly convenient time chamber which he never mentioned before
>androids somehow stronger in this timeline because of TIMELINE HIJINKS
>goku being almost useless or ill for half of the saga
>krillin not killing 18 because of muh feels
>vegeta being a pompous manlet fuckboy
>trunks not killing 18 or semi perfect cell cuz of muh dad
>18 not running away
>goku obliterates cell in half and others just watch instead of finishing him off
cell saga ruined DBZ and is objectively the worst just like its fans
>muh gohan
>muh kamehameha
kyscell is GOAT villain tho
>>140730545
don't forget
>senzu beans for everyone, even Cell
>Gohan watches Krillin die, Piccolo almost die, and thinks Goku dies in Frieza saga, can't go Super Saiyan, but sees Android 16 that wants to kill his father die, goes SS2
Super < Anything that's not in the manga < Cell < the rest
>>140727658
Resurrection F saga is monkey shiet tier
>>140730017
Look, let me explain. DBZ is dumb fun, which is why it's so good even though it doesn't make sense. Super is just dumb and makes you cringe. DB is neither dumb or fun making it about exciting to watch as some Charlie Chaplin mute film from 150 years ago
>>140730938
you must one dumb faggot hating on the original Dragon Ball.
>>140731052
I understand original DB was important for anime/weeb history or w/e but being important historically doesn't make something a masterpiece.
>>140731137
Piccolo was a good villain go fuck yourself.
>>140730545
>piccolo fusing with kami is somehow above super saiyan
It was stated during Namek that only a Super Saiyan could possibly have killed the nameless Namek if he hadn't split into two. Considering how Piccolo in the Cell Saga is that Nameless Namek + Nail, his power tier makes sense. The oddity is Piccolo surpassing Base Vegeta during the 3 years of training while no one else's gains seemingly changed their tier in a big way like that.
>goku obliterates cell in half and others just watch instead of finishing him off
Cell's ki didn't drop, which is why Goku knew that he had lost, so the others aside from Gohan wouldn't be able to do anything anyway.
What you should complain about is everyone just standing around when Cell dropped to his 2nd form. By that point he was basically trash to anyone besides the humans.
>>140727841
>asks for sagas
>names series
You sure are retarded.
>>140729242
>buu saga more like asspull and retardation:the saga
Fixed that for you.
>>140731195
You're free to think that way but you have to realize he wasn't memorable in any sort of way. Unlike DBZ villains which are the ones you see discussed whenever things matter. Obviously apart from DB hipsters but those are only a few who feel like they need to mention "muh DB" every opportunity they get when no one is even asking their opinion
>>140731463
>Unlike DBZ villains which are the ones you see discussed whenever things matter.
no the problem stems with Zfags that never have watched the original series.
Majunior vs Goku at the Tenkaichi Budokai was a great battle if you've seen it.
>>140730938
Yeah, I like Z just for the funny episodes and nice interactions we got. Icarus and Gohan was a nice thing from Toei, as well as Piccolo&Goku learning how to drive, humans moving their asses to find the dragon balls and fixing Vegeta's shit, Krillin being a brave man and facing Super Buu even though he was well aware at best he was going to last a few seconds just to protect his family.
Super tried that, but failed miserably, the best thing that came from Super is Gohan and Mr. Satan playing with Pan and Goku and Vegeta with beards. That's it.
>>140731636
I watched original DB and I prefer Z, not because of the fights, but the characters and their interactions.
Daily reminder that if you've seen the anime but haven't read the manga your opinion doesn't mean anything because you don't know what you're talking about.
>>140729024
You're basically telling me that /v/ is full of retards, whcih I guess is true.
>>140730545
>>androids somehow stronger in this timeline because of TIMELINE HIJINKS
Except they weren't though. If you read the chapter about his past(future?) Gohan's last battle with the androids has them say that they never used half their power even once, and once Trunks thinks he's at Gohan's level he thinks he can beat them. When he fails is when he accepts going into the past, they were never actually weaker than their present counterparts; Trunks just vastly overestimates himself. He thought he could wipeout the entire lab in one blast, he thought he surpassed Vegeta in the time chamber, he thought he could beat Cell.
freezer saga
>>140731636
The Demon King Piccolo saga was when Dragon Ball shifted from "journey to the west" parody to shounen.
>>140727658
Android was pretty good. Cell was awful.
>>140731983
doesn't change the fact that it was good.
>>140727658
Tien saga is objectively the best
Buu saga was fucking atrocious even if it gave us Vegeto.
https://uptobox.com/4vvh99gpkds6
dbz recaps toonami 54-162
>>140728553
>cell """ark"""
>bringing gero back
>implying gero had ever appeared before android arc
pleb
>>140729674
Actually it makes perfect sense. Cell is prideful as fuck and obsessed with being perfect and being better than everyone.
He wanted to test his new perfect form against the strongest fighters in the world to prove he was perfect.
And he was right in doing so he got even more perfect from doing so but lost his life for it.
Also Sayian DNA,Sayian pride and shit.
>>140733936
Think he means red ribbon army even if it was only mentioned and had some red ribbons tacked on in a few places.
>>140731137
>>140731463
Personally, I think Dragon Ball is good but only if watched as a prequel to DBZ (like most people in the West did), instead of reading them in the order Toriyama intended. There's something a lot more satisfying about Dragon Ball when you already know their future in DBZ - it's more about how they get there.
I can imagine that as a standalone Dragon Ball might not hold up to scrutiny, but it becomes much more compelling when you see the introduction of Oozaru, Gohan, energy beams, Piccolo etc. which all just kind of get handwaved away as 'normal' in DBZ. Seeing how Goku becomes friends with staple characters like Yamcha, Tien, Bulma and Roshi is just comfy as fuck tbqh
>>140727658
all of super in its entirety
>>140734300
Are you on drugs? Dragon Ball is great as a stand alone and has held up very well, fuck DBZ that is when it started to go down hill.
Dragon Ball is about adventure, friendship, fighting for fun and comedy plus every character is relevant and not overshadow by Goku, hell even Yajorbe a giant fat joke in DBZ was stronger than Goku at one stage.
Dragon Ball was fun incarnate. Dragon ball z was aliens, power level and super serial guys here a dick joke.
I feel sorry for people who did not watch Dragon Ball before Z.
Dragonball should have ended with Freiza but everyone knows that by this point.
There were some good things about the Cell saga but the main issue is that as soon as the androids stop being a threat the saga becomes completely fucking boring because it's just a bunch of people slowly chipping away at a character who's basically Freiza without motivation or history.
The Cell games were boring shit.
Wait, are there people who unironically think anything made by Toriyama was actually good?
>>140734604
(you)
>>140734530
Agreed. Post Freeza has a lot great moments but the end of the Freeza saga seemed to be a fitting end to the series.
Goku the hero attains the legendary Super Sayian status, defeats the most evil and power monster in the universe but pays with his life.
But wait Freeza is alive and cyborg and a super sayian comes from the future to kill
But wait some scientist in the boonies made some cyborgs and a dna monster that dwarf freeza
But wait turns out freeza was not the ultimate evil some blob sealed away was
Oh and super sayian thats old new, anyone can become a super sayian now it is all about the super sayian 3 model.
But wait turns out there these guys who are gods of destruction can toss boo around like a basket ball
Super sayian 3? pff we gods now
But wait turns out freeza is alive again and stronger after a couple of week training
But wait turns out there is multiple universes full of stronger people
>>140734300
The only arc of the original Dragon Ball that doesn't really hold up is the Pilaf arc, and that's mostly because it's a toned down version of his Dr. Slump humor.
The rest of it is one of the best action adventure fantasy series' out there and it's totally worth seeing Goku's growth from start to finish.
Should've made a real straw poll
>>140727658
One of the first ones.
I would say early Red Ribbon.
I completely forgot all about super (besides the dragons, Pan and SSJ4), why do people hate it s much?
>>140734856
Yeah doubting Dragon Ball is a really dumb thing to do, it was one of the most iconic and influential series even before Z.
Fair enough in the west but Japan, the manga and anime industry would be a different place without it.
>>140734300
>There's something a lot more satisfying about Dragon Ball when you already know their future in DBZ
Yeah like the way they all turned into cannon fodder or worse were completely forgotten and replaced by banana hair monkeys. Such a sweet smooth progression.
>>140734938
The Red Ribbon Army arc is honestly one of my favorites. It's just so full of fun moments and memorable set pieces between muscle tower, the pirate hideout and General Blue, Korin's Tower and Tao Pai Pai, reuniting with Grandpa Gohan and the Dr. Slump crossover.
I remember hating the anime adaption of it when I watched it though. Was it slower paced or filler reliant?
>>140735087
>Korin
I never understood why they translated it to that instead of just Karin.
>>140734945
shit, I meant GT
>>140735087
The anime stretches everything out and makes everything a million times worse, but it hurts the General Blue and Baba arcs the worst because those were already boring as hell in the manga.
>>140734993
That's precisely what I mean. Dragon Ball works better when watched after DBZ because you get to see seemingly unimportant elements turn into actual plot relevance rather than seeing the same in reverse, which is much less satisfying
Im high as shit but basically what im saying is that if you have to watch both, I enjoy watching DBZ then DB, rather than DB then DBZ. To say nothing about how much I rank either of them individually
>>140735435
Funimation fucked with a lot of named for seemingly no reason, like Tenshinhan and Chaozu.
>>140727841
Neither is canon but GT was better than Z and Super is the worst
>>140735627
I was right you were on drugs no wonder you had such shitty opinions on the most iconic anime and manga series every.
Dragon Ball has cult status in Japan.
Why the fuck does everytime i have an opinion of something, /a/ disagrees with it?
Cell>Friezer>Vegita>buu>raditz
>taking the buu arc seriously
Lmao these retarded manchildren ITT.
>>140731825
Are you me?
Seriously though, I'll admit that the original DB has objectively better fights, but I so much prefer the cast of DBZ. I didn't really give two fucks about most of the main characters in DB other than Goku and Krillin.
Dragon Ball >>>>>> Goku Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Kaioken x10 saga > Beerus backhand Bulma Saga > Mr. Popo rapes Bulma in a Magic Carpet saga >>>>>>> rest > GT
>>140736146
I'm not
>>140730938
>>140731137
I think Dragon Ball is fucking great, I'm just explaining my opinion as a westfag watching DB after DBZ
Question. Wh do DBZfags call it a Saga when you it's just an Arc?
>>140737125
Are you one of those fags who call YowaPeda rides "episodes"?
>>140737002
Not that guy but while I find Z's characters more interesting by themselves, and really like Vegeta's relationship wth Goku, I prefer the lightheartedness of DB cast. I also don't really like any of the child Saiyans that much, including Gohan, so their prominence in the post-Freeza stuff is kind of frustrating.
The characters that really come to mind when I think of Dragon Ball's cast are Goku, Bulma, Krillin, Roshi, Tenshinhan, Piccolo, Vegeta and Mr. Satan. I think the series hurt itself by trying to keep every side character like Oolong, Chaozu or Trunks as part of the gang instead of narrowing in on its core cast.
>>140737168
Never watch YowaPeda. No. Seriously, why?
>>140737233
There's this custom where mangakas/studios call their chapters/episodes a thing related to the subject of the anime, instead of the traditional name.
For instance, the best anime in this season, Pan de Peace!, have their episodes called "slices" because it is a show about bread.
>>140737316
Then why call DBZ arcs "saga" then?
>>140737125
It's what they were called on the VHS/DVDs and probably Toonami. It's not something the fanbase made up, it got pushed on us by official content
>>140737200
Toriyama really does seem to have an issue with saying goodbye to characters he likes. Between wishing people back to life, Goku befriending every villain and the re-occurrence of literal who characters like Oolong, the only characters I can think of who officially left the cast are Lunch and major villains like Cell/Freeza (and even he never stays down for long)
>>140737200
I'm the opposite, I guess. I liked Z's shift into more serious territory, and I like Gohan and Future Trunks. Goten and Present Trunks are just kinda there for me, though.
I guess that's why I was never really bothered by most of the DB cast getting the shaft. In my eyes, they were just replaced by infinitely more interesting and likable characters for the most part, even if they weren't as comedic in nature.
>>140737402
>Toriyama really does seem to have an issue with saying goodbye to characters he likes.
I blame this for the lack of development for anyone but Goku and Vegeta too.
When you have 20-30 "friends" to keep track of it becomes easy to just toss all of them together in one pile. Even Krillin and Bulma, some of the series' most important characters, fell into this treatment by the end of Z because it was easier than finding something else for them to do during the Buu drama, because he already had to use that cop-out for the million other nobodies like Puar and Videl.
>>140737401
Because it was originally a parody of Journey to the West, which is a saga.
Honestly, the entirety of GT and what we've gotten from Super are far better than the Cell saga.
Hell, even Evolution had more high points than the Cell Saga.
>>140735435
pretty sure it's Karin in the viz translation
Friendly reminder that there is no difference between DB and Z. It was always about fighting. Yamcha was never cool. Krillin was a much more important character after Raditz than before. The fights never got less creative.
>>140738803
>Friendly reminder that there is no difference between DB and Z.
Not as dramatic as people say but there is.
The latter has a greater focus on the saiyans, the fights in general have much less straight forward martial arts, although the sci-fi elements were always there it really starts to embrace them, the animal people kind of stop appearing and Earth becomes more normal in the Cell saga.
There's also a natural escalation in seriousness from Piccolo to Cell, though it never gets as heavy as the original Demon King Piccolo arc and tones it down in Buu.
>Yamcha was never cool
This is true. He's like a fighting Oolong.
>Krillin was a much more important character after Raditz than before.
Krillin is pretty consistently important from his introduction till the end of Cell.
He only drops off in Buu, where everyone who wasn't one of the Saiyans or Kais is forgotten.
>The fights never got less creative.
They became more reliant on transformations than gimmick powers which is either more interesting or more boring depending on who you ask.
>>140727658
http://www.strawpoll.me/10015054
http://www.strawpoll.me/10047988
>>140739374
That's cool and all but what are you trying to achieve with this?
>>140734300
There's something a lot less satisfying about literally everything in Z if you have no understanding of the context surrounding everything.
>>140734856
If anything, the Journey to the West arc is the best way to ease someone into the series who thinks it's 100% "angry buff guys fighting"
>>140739438
literal curiosity
>>140727841
GT is better than Super. Fact.
>>140727658
The whole thing shoulda just ended after refrigerator got dead
>>140728553
Trunks was one of the worst shonen characters ever.
It's thanks to him we have those faggots like the uchiha and half the cast from Bleach.
>>140739470
They're both equally mediocre with fun moments sprinkled on top
t. someone who actually watched GT subbed recently, instead of just bandwagon meming
>>140739467
I gladly answered it and somehow my preferences are similar to the most people's, although even if it is for curiosity, I'd value much more individual's opinions than hivemind behaviour. I like Frieza's Saga because the characters play tag with the Dragon Balls and face diplomacy issues before all the big bullshit fights, while I could guess most people just liked the SSJ transformation, the struggles Goku faced and all that stuff.
>>140739501
If you don't think that Trunks killing Mecha Freeza with a sword is the most awesome thing ever, you are not Dragon Ball's target audience.
>>140739444
I think the first Budokai and RRA do a better job setting the tone for the early series
There's elements of the Pilaf arc I like but a lot of it comes down to jokes about Bulma's body and Oolong pooping. It's less universal than the later arcs, I always get the impression I'm reading something specifically for children in those first chapters.
>>140739601
I wish Trunks was a little more direct to the point. If I could rewrite the whole thing, I'd have Trunks arrive after Frieza and King Cold arrived, and it goes like this:
>someone is dealing with them both
>spaceship arrives
>trunks get out of it
>angrily walks toward both frieza and father
>in the middle of the way, turns super saiyan
>unsheathe sword
>kill them both
>blow their pieces
>sheathe sword
>then - and only then -, start speaking
>>140739601
Only dumb fangirls and idiots thought that was any good
How can men like Trunks? I can see dumb women liking him but men? i bet you think Hitsyugaya is the epitome of good characters
>>140739671
That's because dragonball is something aimed at children, everything with the name dragonball including z, gt, even super is aimed at kids.
>>140739755
What are you reading battle shonen for if not for moments like this?
>>140739943
Too bad Super will never have any moments like this
>>140739671
The Hunt arc is crucial to show who Goku is, who Bulma is, why they're even friends, etc.
It also nicely sets up and demonstrates how the series experiences a consistent gradual tonal shift from beginning to (pretty much) the end. Starts off super silly with Hunt, then becomes slightly less so with 21st, and so on.
>>140740007
Retard pls
>>140740119
Garbage.
>>140740166
Yes I already know your taste is garbage.
>>140740261
Goku looks like a fucking Icee. How can anyone enjoy this?
>>140740321
I like badass icee monkeys
>>140740119
Monaka one punching Hit was better.
>>140727658
I say either Super 17 or some of Super's retellings.
>>140737853
why no one taking my bait?
>>140734300
>like most people in the West did
You are aware only America ran DB after Z? I can't speak for Canada but Europe and Latin American had DB first than DBZ.
Worst dragon ball saga: red ribbon army
Worst dragon ball z saga: kid buu
Worst gt saga: Dragonball search
Worst super saga: Resurrection F
>>140730938
>Shitting on Charlie Chaplin films
This is where you fucked up.
>Implying the objectively best saga wasn't the Driving Lessons Saga
>>140742349
>Goku and Piccolo will never wear those clothes again
People who group Android and Cell together need to kill themselves. The Android is the worst and Cell is easily the best
>>140742462
Cell is fun until he turns Perfect and proceeds to become boring as fuck.
>>140742462
2 arc parts of the same saga really.
>>140741527
No way, in USA DBZ came before than DB? why?
>>140744213
Because it appeals better to younger kids?
>>140744213
There's numerous reasons, it'd take too long to explain it all.
>Best villain
>defeated by Yamcha 2.0
Cellfags are funny
>Read entire thread.
>No mentions on Garlic Jr. Saga
I knew you would agree.You didn't forget about it, r-right?
>>140745019
>Watching the anime
>>140739943
God, the irony. People say SSB+Kaioken is an asspull but then a scene where another super saiyan from the future kills Freeza with a shitty sword is "epic"?
>>140737853
140737853 (You)
>>140727658
Was there any reason why the choices are too limited?
>>140745096
SSB+Kaioken is probably one of the most justified powerups in the series.
The whole concept is based on things we already know and using techniques that were pre-established. Nothing about it was an ass pull.
>>140727658
dunno if you count filler shit but Garlic Jr if you do. If you don't then the android saga.
Super is better than GT if only cause Whis & Beerus. It's kind of like jarring to see how much better whis and Beerus are than every character introduced in super so far (both in design and personality). Like you could tell they had so much more thought put into them than Winnie the Pooh, or Champa, or genderbent Whis, or the shitty new omni king who's a terrible attempt at hearkening back to characters like Korrine or King Kai. Waiting for either to go all out desu.
>>140747225
Because the choice is obvious.
>>140737565
he doesn't like vegeta
>>140727658
Super
>>140748026
and piccolo is apparently his favorite character.
You'd think he hates piccolo and loves vegeta going by super now.
>>140747340
>ssb
>established
>>140748072
What?
We're talking about the merging of the two techniques that happened last week. Super Saiyan Blue was revealed a year ago.
If we want to argue about the God Ki shit being an asspull that's a different conversation. But Kaioken being usable with the God forms and not base Super Saiyan fits the descriptions of those two power ups.
>>140727658
>expects us to pick android/cell as worse
>not knowing that frieza saga is the worst
Super Saiyan reveal was cool, but the majority of that trash saga was them flying around on the blandest planet in existence, they could of trimmed the story to 30 episodes without sacrificing the plot
>>140734300
dragonball > dragonball z
everyone with taste can't deny. Dragonball had character and humility, with DBZ I feel like it's an animated version of body builders grunting at the gym. I'm the strongest fighter in the universe, I will destroy everything. Oh no, know I must become even stronger. No I'm the strongest fighter in the universe. Oh no, know I must become even stronger...etc.
>>140748568
>animefag
>Horrible taste
>>140727658
Anyone that doesn't answer Garlic. Jr or Resurrection of Freezer is just trolling.
>>140748821
It was boring the manga too lad
>>140742462
I think the Android 17 and 18 saga is the worst, but the Mecha Freeza saga and King Cold saga are solid. The Dr. Gero saga is alright as an inbetween I guess.
>>140727658
Cell arc
>Shit romance - Bulma/Vegeta, 18/Krilli
>Shit fan fic character Trunks
>Bland as fuck villains
>Fagot Gohan gets too much screentime
>>140749482
>Garlic Jr
Filler, but still suck.
>Resurrection of Freezer
But i'm not trolling,i unironically liked it
>>140727658
Fake Namek
>>140748654
In the manga though:
22nd TB - Namek > Hunt - RR Army > Cell - Buu
>>140744213
DB failed to catch on, due likely to a poor timeslot where hardly anyone even saw it.
I guess they thought that it meant that nobody cared about DB, without considering all of the relevant information.
Buu Saga haters are just dumb Saiyan/Frieza/Android babies
>>140727658
God damn when will Krillin get with the big guys. I don't care about fucking Saiyans. I want a human up there with the gods kicking ass.
>>140749680
>Bulma practically naked
No.
>>140748061
He also really likes Gohan.
But if there's one thing the man knows how to do, it's cater.
Hence at least in power Gohan was relevant in Buu, even if he did dick all.
Super is literally the Goku and Vegeta show.
>>140748191
I thought Super Sayian Blue is just normal SS plus god powers. So shouldn't the Kaioken still not work?
Also they never told us it doesn't work with SS, not directly in the show. They just stopped using it with SS so we assume it doesnt.
Also why the fuck didnt King Kai/Kaioshen teach the humans any god damn techniques? Kaioken could've kept them relevant a little longer...
>>140750530
God Ki isn't as stressful as normal ki. It requires a calm, focused mind to use, not anger like normal SS transformations need.
Goku said he couldn't use it with the old forms because it'd destroy his body. With the way SSG and SSB work its manageable, though risky.
>>140750407
>Super is literally the Goku and Vegeta show.
Only retards think this
Toriyama remembers things, the series
Liked cell, gohan sucked since the very beginning.
>>140750407
>Super
>Goku's wins: 1
>Goku's loses: 5
Yeah, fucking Goku and Vegeta show
Gohan has a better win/lose ratio in Super than Goku
>>140727658
Super.
>>140727658
>the options
K E K
E
K
>>140727658
Cell. It's the only arc where every single relevant character aside maybe Bulma does the most retarded action possible at all times in order to keep Cell as a relevant threat; because he otherwise gets power-crept every five fucking minutes.
>>140740119
The fight with fucking Recoome had more weight to it than this, you've just grown too used to the taste of shit toei has been shoving down your throat.
>>140740119
>literaly posting the second episode Yamamuro was animation supervisor for in the entire super series
Super looks like shit and like shit too, get over it. Even episode 39 suffered from the one piece syndrome, hits have no impact and the sound effects are literaly the sound effects from one piece.
It's funny because when luffy first learned Gear second and started moving with "le 2 fast 2 see" speedlines the sound effects they were using were DBZs, they changed that later with something new and original for gear 2nd and now DB super is using that everytime goku moves with speedlines.
>>140752961
and feels like shit too**
>>140727658
The one where it started.
>>140752961
to further back the "one piece syndrome" claim, and prove that One Piece is affecting DB super in a bad way.
One piece and super share a few animator supervisors.
Undeniably most of the time supers art looks like complete amatuer shit and the only episodes super had good animation were when Naoki Tate was the animation supervisor.
Naoki Tate intentionaly sacrifices the art quality for fluid animation (complete opposite of tadayoshi yamamuro)
something like webm related completely fits One piece because one piece is very cartoonish so even when animating off model it looks good.
>>140752961
>>140753117
but when you do the same thing for Dragonball, well... it turns out like this.
>>140753145
Looking at super just makes me sad.
>>140753179
IT PISSES ME OFF
>>140753179
>>140752874
>>140740119
the best scene from super is less exciting than a random scene from Z
>>140753318
>the best scene from super is less exciting than a random scene from Z
Post an example then
>>140753380
I'm glad Vegeta's back to being a jobber. I was worried that this would turn into a show that would do something as crazy as having 2 equally powered heroes.
>>140753416
>jobber
>tfw anon doesn't know what words mean but want to use them anyway
Use google dumbass
>>140753396
>Posts this in a sea of scenes more exciting than his
>>140753396
lmao and thats the 1st episode Yamamuro supervised. You're just proving that the only competent man doing work in Super is the one that made the best scenes in Z.
and yet the only things your webm has in its favor is not bad/average animation and on model art, the choreography is still boring and the hits still lack impact and weight.
Webm related has good animation, good on model art, impact and weight.
Keep liking shit.
>>140753465
Beating other jobbers doesn't mean you're not a jobber yourself.
>>140753492
>>140753396
>>140753465
Please refer to >>140753506
>>140753318
Surely you see the problem with your logic though?
The animators had 153 episodes worth of experience with Dragonball prior to Z's first episode.
You then have to consider that the hand drawn animation of DB and Z were using the manga as a reference where Super doesn't have that privilege.
Then you have the shit schedule that Super had, and that they only recently starting hiring more supervisors and whatever else to stop the rot.
Should Super be better than what it is, yes, but with time it should improve. Just like Dragonball and Z did.
>>140753555
>>140753492
>posting Buu saga, which is over 400 episodes into Dragonball.
![[SOFCJ-Raws] Dragon Ball Super - 037 (THK 1280x720 x264 AAC).webm](https://i.imgur.com/7AhZFRy.jpg "[SOFCJ-Raws] Dragon Ball Super - 037 (THK 1280x720 x264 AAC).webm")
>>140753489
>Posts this in a sea of scenes more exciting than his
Are you blind? or just retarded?
>>140753492
>You're just proving that the only competent man doing work in Super is the one that made the best scenes in Z.
Pic related
>the choreography is still boring
Still better than anything you posted
>hits still lack impact and weight.
Ok now I know you baiting or retarded.
>>140753587
i've already posted examples in this thread that are much earlier into the series.
Also what you're saying is bullshit, Super has a lot of tallent working on it, what it doesn't have is budget. Experience doesn't matter because they already worked on ONE PIECE and many of them on DBZ 20 years ago.
Excuses aside it doesn't matter that it looks like shit, you can ejoy it for what it is.
But memes like "dbz always looked like shit" and "super looks better than Z" have to die at some point.
Webm related is also not hand drawn and not based on manga but its still better than anything on Super.
>>140753640
>Still better than anything you posted
>Ok now I know you baiting or retarded.
Both the goku vs beerus scene and the scene you just posted have zero choreography. You have shit taste my friend.
>>140753699
Both the Vegeta vs Buu scene and the scene you just posted have zero choreography. You have shit taste my friend.
>>140753640
this is what you consider a good fight scene. This is literaly the same with what you're posting minus the on model art and flashy particles.
>>140753640
>using a fight scene that requires punches that create light beams to show impact
Fucking lol. Hurry up and get dressed or you'll be late to homeroom.
>>140753764
>lol.
Go back to the youtube comment section faggot
>>140753742
enjoy your shitty show kid
>>140753699
>dat webm
>random smoke shit
>moving around a still image
>rapid punch shit with zero fight choreography
Hypocrite much? Get your eyes checked dumbass.
>>140753804
I'm sure Youtube commenters have better opinions than your shit opinions, at least.
>>140753840
Stay mad faggot and work on your baiting.
>>140753699
>Also what you're saying is bullshit, Super has a lot of tallent working on it, what it doesn't have is budget
It does have a lot of talent working on it, they weren't all there from episode one but granted most were. It also has the budget, what it doesn't have as I had already stated is a good schedule. They don't have enough time to have good animation and keep it on-model.
>But memes like "dbz always looked like shit" and "super looks better than Z" have to die at some point.
Literally who says the latter, as for the former, you can't pretend that Z always had good animation. There are vast amounts of episodes where it is shit, but currently Z is better animated than Super. In time we can only hope that won't be the case.
>posts a webm from an OVA where animation is significantly better than a weekly anime with a shit schedule
Come on anon. Of all things you could post.
>>140753871
Still better than a retard like you, who doesn't even understand DB of all things.
>>140753865
>Hypocrite much? Get your eyes checked dumbass
maybe you should read before you shitpost. I never said the scene was good, just better than the shit Super offers. Much better.
You can have a scene made without spending a 100 million chinese dollars in animation and still make it exciting.
>>140753916
>>140753916
it's funny because i already commented on naoki tates work on Super and it is painfuly obvious that it doesn't fit the dragonball universe.
>>140753117
>>140753145
His habit of sacrificing the artwork for fluid movement kills it. You can have fluid movement and good artwork like webm related.
>>140754023
>I never said the scene was good
Retard pls
>>140727658
mangastream, ch. 11 is out
>>140753918
>It does have a lot of talent working on it, they weren't all there from episode one but granted most were. It also has the budget, what it doesn't have as I had already stated is a good schedule. They don't have enough time to have good animation and keep it on-model.
And so they decide to sacrifice both 90% of the time? because aside from when naoki tate, ishikawa and yamamuro are supervising, which is not very often, everything moves and looks like complete shit.
>Literally who says the latter, as for the former, you can't pretend that Z always had good animation. There are vast amounts of episodes where it is shit, but currently Z is better animated than Super. In time we can only hope that won't be the case.
Of course a 300 episodes series will have lots of episodes with questionable animation, but DBZs lowest is way better than Supers lowest. You can't have a series made in 2015 and with the name Dragonball slapped on it look like a fan made animation.
Believe it or not lots of people on /a/ believe that Super looks better and is more exciting that DBZ.
>posts a webm from an OVA where animation is significantly better than a weekly anime
I posted that particular scene exactly because it doesn't look that impressive, it is a very good, fairly exciting scene that feels a lot like dragonball yet is not that hard and or expensive to replicate in Super. Yet we have seen little to no fight scenes reminding of the good old Dragonball fight scenes.
>>140754107
>back pedaling
you're just retarded, get out.
>>140732890
thanks.
>>140754187
Since you're too retarded to do so yourself
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=back+pedaling
>>140753492
>Vegeta zooms in and readies a punch, only to feint, showing the full wind up of the kick, while being consistently on model.
>cut to Buu receiving boot in the face, accurate to what was shown previously.
>Using the momentum from the kick, Vegeta rotates his full body in order to chain it into an elbow drop, everyone is still on model.
>cut to Buu recovering from the boot, only to get elbowed, knocking him backwards, landing on his upper back, still stunned.
>probably the only lazy part in the clip, Vegeta takes a second to recover from the drop as he slides across the scene Trigger style.
>cut to Vegeta landing, using both his legs and right arm to catch his fall so he can spring back, left leg coiled for a knee attack
>cut to Buu, still stunned, Vegeta rushes in very fast.
>Close up of knee making impact
>Buu slides away, tumbling along as he goes.
>did I mention everything is on model?
>>140753555
>Buu is running, steaming with anger, widen the camera to see Vegeta flying in
>Cut to close up of Vegeta's face, giving way, however, to the right fist that has all of the momentum of his flying.
>Cut to Buu, getting punched in the face, showing visible discomfort. The screen shakes to give the punch a sense of impact, but the animation still continues for a second rather than staying a still frame, also still keeping everything on model. Vegeta retracts his right arm, winding up the left.
>Cut to Buu taking the left fist in the chin
>Cut to Vegeta, retracting the left fist, winding up his body for what appears to be another left punch, but is a kick, which rushes into the camera.
>The kick hits Buu in the back of the head, although Vegeta was never shown getting behind Buu, one of two shortcomings of this scene, but it can be explained if we imply Vegeta repositioned in the previous cut.
>Buu is shown flying as the force of the impact causes dust to fly past the both of them, both move in opposite directions trigger style.
Cont.
Frieza?
>this thread
Nostalgia is one hell of a drug.
>>140754325
yes it's a me Frieza.
>>140754187
>...sacrifice both 90% of the time? because aside from when naoki tate, ishikawa and yamamuro are supervising,...,everything moves and looks like complete shit.
The Universe 6/7 tournament has seen a significant improvement over the RoF recap, there are far fewer off-model animations of which you assume those will be corrected in the blu-rays.
The RoF re-cap appears to have been the sacrifice to get half decent animation now.
BoG for the most part had ok animation, there are some parts that I personally really enjoyed, and others that were poor.
The flashback in episode 40 depitcing Goku punching Botama seems to have been somewhat corrected in that scene yet looked like dogshit in the actual episode.
>Of course a 300 episodes series...
I personally pair Dragonball and Z together, since there is no break between the two series (and the manga is just Dragonball). It's 450+ episodes, of which many are or include loads of filler
>DBZs lowest is way better than Supers lowest
Correct.
>Believe it or not lots of people on /a/ believe that Super looks better and is more exciting that DB
I don't recall ever seeing that but I'll take your word that there are retards on /a/, no surprises there.
>...it is a very good, fairly exciting scene that feels a lot like dragonball yet is not that hard and or expensive to replicate in Super.
It has nothing to do with money, most of the animation issues are time-related. When Toei fix their scheduling the quality should improve.
>>140754264
go on
Continued from >>140754264
>>140753555
>Cut to Buu, flying faster than he was in previous cut, falling and grinding along the ground.
Also interesting to note is the impact from Vegeta's right punch, his strongest, is still visible on Buu throughout the whole scene.
Now for Super.
>Close up of Cabba's eyes. His eyes glow in order to show anger rather than actually animate his face to do so.
>Cut to Cabba's lazily computer drawn aura powering up, with a camera angle too far for the animators to show any detail. Vegeta has no face, and the aura muddies Cabba. Cabba zips across the screen in 1 frame.
>Cut to angle behind Vegeta's right ear, Cabba's shadow appears before he does, and Cabba is blurred by the animators to hide the fact that he is off model in at least 4 frames here. Cabba winds up a punch, but hesitates, then winds up the same punch. The animators decide to give him some angry facial expression, but it is blurred.
>Interesting to note in this cut: Vegeta does ot move or react at all. He is a still frame throughout the second and a half Cabba gives for him to react.
>Cut to Vegeta catching the punch. To give the illusion of animation, the screen pans up and the image is blurred.
>Cut to wide shot of Vegeta catching the punch. There is a fancy light show behind his back, but the rest of the image is still-frame.
>Cut to far zoom of the light show. Several light sets appear one after the other, then Vegeta slides back Trigger style.Nothing is animated other than the lights, and both characters are too far to see any detail.
>Cut to an off model Vegeta sliding back in what appears to be only 10 frames of animation where he just zooms out. We get a close up of Cabba's back, as he rushes forward and jumps with his left foot, rotating his body slightly to the right.
>Cut to Cabba closing in on a slightly off model Vegeta, Trigger style.
>Cut to close up of Cabba's face, where we just barely see him ready what looks to be a strong left uppercut. Lights.
Cont.
Continued from>>140754509
>>140754579
>Rather than the money shot we expected for some reason, cut to a wide shot of a bunch of nothing punches from Cabba. The punches are really blurred, and pausing can reveal up to 10 separate blurry grey blobs. The screen shakes rigorously hard, much harder than anything from the buu fights, and work in conjunction with the lightshow in order to try and mask the fact that there are only 4 frames of animation here.
>Cut to close up of Vegeta's chest, where all of Cabba's punches are blurred and so are Vegeta's blocks. The screen slowly pans while rigorously shaking to reveal a slightly off model Vegeta struggling. This is trying to conceal about 5 more frames of "animation".
>Cut to Vegeta's knees buckling under the pressure, even if they wouldn't really be considering Cabba is attacking at an upward angle. He takes a step back.
>Cut to Cabba throwing several punches at an extremely strange angle. The background suggests we're above him looking down, but the angle of the punches suggest that he's above us punching downwards. Anyways, the punches rotate through about 7 frames of animation, with more blur punches and lights and screen shaking.
>Cut back to weak knees looping 2 or 3 frames for a second.
>Cut to wide shot of Cabba throwing more blur punches at Vegeta, about 4 frames here. Zoom out to reveal smoke coming out of the center. Also, Vegeta's posture is nigh perfect, contrary to the buckling knees we've been seeing.
>Cut to Vegeta blocking face punches. Only 2 frames here, and Vegeta's nose is weird but I don't know if it's off model or the animator's style.
>Cut to Vegeta flinging his arms out, which somehow also flings Cabba's arms out. Coud have used a short cut where Vegeta blocked perfectly or grabbed Cabba's arms but instead it just abruptly cuts. Vegeta slowly floats down trigger style, even though they were both standing on solid ground before. He turns toward his left. Vegeta is off model for several frames.
Cont.
>>140754509
I understand that Super had little to no pre-production because Toei is shit, but even without time on their hands i at least expected them to do better than a moe gag anime dbz parody https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRwZzQ23QS0
I honestly think that this parody fight scene looks and feels more like dragonball that most of dragonball super.
I don't like what they're trying to turn dragonball into, they reduced the muscle mass of the characters for a reason. They're aiming to draw a new audience since they know the old fans will buy dbs on nostalgia alone.
That they are using one piece visual effects and sound effects instead of DBZ visual/sound effects is alarming to me.
Continued from>>140754264
>>140754579
Also forgot to mention the super clip I'm using is
>>140753640
>Cut to Vegeta using his left arm as leverage for a kick to Cabba, who is apparently standing on solid ground again. Cabba does not fight back in the like 3 seconds Vegeta has to prepare this kick and gets flattened. Cabba lands on Vegeta's right arm, and his left arm falls on Vegeta's chest. Vegeta is terribly off model, or at least bent in inhuman ways.
>Cut to blurred close up of Cabba's face.
Here's where shit gets wierd:
>Cut back, Cabba rotates his body to the right, landing on his right foot, but somehow gets his left leg under Vegeta and transitions into a cartwheel, only to spring back onto his legs, then back to his arms as Vegeta turns to face him, floating probably 7 or 8 feet in the air, only to get Cabba's legs in his chest. Cabba's arms are still on the grond, meaning Cabba is about 7 or 8 feet tall about now. But hey, more flashy light lol XD. Cabba slowly floats onto his feet.
>Cut to blurred pan of a still frame showing Vegeta floating high up.
>Cut to Vegeta gasping for breath.
>Cut to shot underneath Vegeta's armpit, looking down on smoke.
>Cut to no-neck Vegeta looking surprised at something, only for Cabba to appear behind him. Vegeta does not react.
>Instead of showing Cabba punching him, cut to shot of the aftermath, with Vegeta crashing down into the arena (the arena breaking also lacks any sort of gradient or shading by the way) as we see Cabba in a still frame. the camera jiggles a little.
>>140753640
>>140753640
>>140753640
So why don't you try telling me that DBZ has shit choreography again you fucking underage faggot.
>>140755152
>So why don't you try telling me that DBZ has shit choreography again you fucking underage faggot.
Eh, too long, didn't read.
>>140755172
ill sum it up for you since you cant bother reading the guys analysis.
This webm has better choreography than the shit you posted.
Probably better art, animation and shading too.
>>140755358
I'll sum it up for you he's retarded and has too much spare time.
>>140755456
you're shitposting on a chinese cartoon image board, chances are you're the same.
>>140754872
Also I said continued from the wrong post sorry other guy
Be happy guys, Arale is coming back
>>140755548
oh yay.....
>>140755102
>comparing a 1 cour anime to a weekly anime
That video was funny, but comparing the animation between a single cour anime and a weekly anime is fallacious.
They changed the muscle mass for a reason, Toriyama (I presume) is not interested in that shit. He likes simple designs, it is most likely the same reason why Beerus is so slender as is Super Saiyan God.
Art styles change, it is no longer the 80's/90's anymore anon.
>using one piece visual effects and sound effects instead of DBZ visual/sound effects
Toei makes both One Piece and Dragonball, iirc they couldn't get the old Dragonball sfx because of OP. I am not sure of the validity of that statement however, so take it with a pinch of salt.
>>140755547
It's fine, if I had to say something though. You are comparing Super to the very last fights in the Z. Most of which were amazing. If Toei can fix their scheduling, I see no reason why we can't replicate or exceed the quality we had in the Buu saga for Super.
>>140755676
The slender designs, subjectively speaking, are much worse than the Z ones. Objectively speaking, they lead to shit like
>>140753179
>DB Super manga
>Piccolo has five (5) fingers
And you fags actually think this is canon
>>140756634
excuse me what
>>140756672
Manga Piccolo has 4 fingers per hand
>>140756708
>implying toriyama remembers how many fingers piccolo has
anon pls
>>140737125
garbage term made by north american licensees for home releases
>>140756931
>piccolo sr.
>visual gag panel
>has 4 fingers on the same page
Stop kidding around we all know the Wedding arc is the best one
>>140757093
the entire dbz anime is not canon by your logic.
>>140757141
It isn't
>>140757213
>dbz anime covers the same story as the manga
>but it isn't canon because 1 finger
My little anon can't be this retarded.
>>140757248
>All filler and changes from the manga
>= 1 finger
Kys
>>140757298
>All filler and changes from the manga
that doesn't make the entirety of the anime non-canon, both the anime and the manga tell the same story, nothing important is altered.
>Kys
hi neo/a/
>>140754325
Dr. Gero, I'm DBZ
>>140757354
>This is what secondaries actually believe
Cell is complete shit, I agree. It was the moment asspulls because Toriyama can't write became too hard to bear.
Goku has heart problems so everyone can stand being useless longer.
Friezza is revived stronger and some random punk we don't even know with an ugly as fuck design and gay hair kills him with no problem.
But the worst thing is that it had a complicated (for Dragon Ball) plot. And Dragon Ball can't do story for shit. It was like a joke comic trying to do a story arc about abortion. What the fuck.
Unfortunately, Boo is even worse.
>>140745096
The thing is that SSB+Kaioken is a combination never implied to be possible before since Goku never used Kaioken after going super saiyan. The convenience of another character easily dispatching one of the strongest villains at the time while being another super saiyan is to make you curious about who he is and what his purpose is. As it turns out, Trunks himself doesn't measure up to his own introduction.
