What is so disappointing about Dragon Ball Super for you?
the continued existence of the dragon ball franchise, for starters
Shit animation + everything being XD GAGs with no stakes.
Yes, the weebs here say "but muh DB was a comedy manga!", but the parts 99% of people like best are Piccolo - Buu saga, when it wasn't a gag series.
I remember people saying that the universe 6 tournament arc would be another cell games and Champa could actually be threatening. Well, lol.
>>139263768
minimal amounts of best girl
>>139263768
Everything.
It's existence itself.
DB Super should've never been a thing, but I guess you need to keep coming up with ways to put bacon on the table. Maybe if Super was made by a different studio I would've tolerated it more.
Piccolo dying in one hit to Frieza is the worst to me. He shrugged off being totally shattered during the Buu Saga, but he died to a little hole in his chest. There's lots of other terrible things but I think that's the worst.
Universe 6 being a bunch of low tier shits
It may be because I watched the dub as a kid, but Goku being really really dumb
most whiny fanbase i've ever seen
>>139263768
the low quality animation.
If only they had a chance to replicate Toyotaro's work we'd be golden.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtmFcc0unGM
>best ed
>>139265874
I used to skip this song but now it like brings me to tears every time.
>>139264414
Goku has always been kind of stupid, but he did get a littler smarter in Z. Mostly because the plot required him to be since it got more serious. But now he's reverted back to how he was as a kid.
>>139266222
Z Goku and Super Goku is like the same IQ. Name one dumb thing he's done that would degrade his intelligence level your eyes.
>>139265874
Funny, sounds better than the original
>>139264246
Oh yeah I forgot that happened
>>139263857
This actually. Also the fucking powerlevels kep rising.
>>139263768
The lack of epic action being watered down, slow.
The color palet swaps for new ssj transformations instead of badass looking forms.
The human characters being tossed to the side again.
Piccolo not accepting training from whis.....
The enemy designs. The tone of dbs, wish it was a little more serious and edgy.
No tension. Oh, the fights suck and its why i tune in every week to hope they crank the fights up.
>>139263768
The animation more than anything else
Everything looks so stiff
>>139263768
shit animation
>>139263768
Animation
Campy
Horrible character designs
Worthless new characters
Deviantart tier art
My biggest gripe is how starkly it contracts with Z. Z got serious and Super went back to being a campy "feel good" show as the weebs like to call it
It's just fucking cancer on literally all levels.
>>139266852
Nope. Cell games goku shit on everyone in terms of strategy in training. He usually plays ignorant until he has analyzed an opponent then dismantles them. Vegita always rushed in and got the shit beat out of him.
Super plays hard on character cliches and goku is reverting in every way possible..............
You know how bad it is? Legend of Korra had better art, animation, characters, plot and fighting scenes and it's a fucking Korean animated Nickelodeon cartoon.
The lack of detail and impact in action and the speed is so slow in the fights.
>>139268278
Considering jm animation helped it would look good.
Korea does lots of animation they are godlike
everything
>>139268435
Weebs will always swear by weeb studios tho
>>139268278
Korras plot and characters were complete shit.
>>139263768
The animation quality was fluctuating pretty wildly for a while, but to me it seems like it's starting to normalize.
I'm annoyed Piccolo contributed so little in the tournament, but maybe I should just be thankful he got to do anything at all.
I wanted Vegeta to humiliate Frost for a bit longer, but whatever. I'm enjoying all the spotlight Vegeta's getting right now.
Looking forward to the Cabba fight. Vegeta and Cabba are giving me a sort of sempai/kouhai vibe.
It's nice to see characters who aren't Goku getting to do stuffthough I'm pretty sure Goku's going to re-enter and be the one to finish the tournament.
>>139268278
s2 animation was garbage
>>139268519
Still better than Super
>>139268517
It was nowhere near as terrible as people make it out to be.
As a matter of fact, didn't jm do boondocks season 3 or was it madhouse?
>>139268570
>Season 2 had the worst animation
>it was the only season with Japanese studio animation
I'm noticing a trend.
>>139268643
Lol true. Its never the show, its the people in charge of handling the series that need to be replaced.
>>139268537
I think the tournament will be disrupted by a major event.
>>139268081
>Worthless new characters
Has there ever been any reference to Bulma's sister before? Or did she just pop into existence out of the blue?
>>139268265
you're a fucking dumbass that's creating head cannon up.
Goku suffered just as much from his usual flaws in the Cell saga. The fact he gave Cell a senzu bean cuz of his pride and then getting owned by Cell Jr before he even had the chance to eat a bean himself goes to show he hasn't changed much throughout the whole series. You hyping him up as a master strategist is incorrect, he's always been a good fighter and simultaneously careless throughout the series.
>>139268837
Lol not until jaco galactic patrolman manga and fnf arc. Which was all in 2015. Before then no trace of her existence is mentioned.
>>139263768
The animation, I don't know, is it really that hard? And if it is why they are doing it?
>>139268934
To be fair, EVERYONE went full retard during the Android/Cell arc.
>>139268934
Thats more of a saiyajin flaw than anything. Vegita basically let cell evolve into final form because of his pride as a saiyajin warrior. Goku figured out first that trunks and vegitas new form would not defeat cell and they had hit their wall at the time.
Just because you lack formal education doesnt make you a dumbass. Goku giving even his enemies chances is his flaw but that could be something for super to change.
Not hyping him up. A widely conceived notion of being an idiot works in gokus advantage was what im trying to say which is eclipsed by his overconfidence.
Now im thinking people just like downplaying main characters especially goku because of this new generation.
>>139267985
>enemy designs
This.
>freeza goons (none of them is even remotely a threat)
>garlic jr? come the fuck on.
>more freeza shit
>stupid cat god
>stupid cat god's fat twin
>vados (can we at least get a little fan service?)
>dumb bear
>parallel universe freeza shit
>wtf is this stupid robot? boring as fuck
>not impressed by the remaining two either, at this point
>>139263768
A majority of my complaints are that Toei can't even pretend to give a shit anymore.
>>139269116
And it was glorious lol
>>139269187
go back to the main point, what makes you think he's any different now than he was in DBZ? There's literally nothing changed regards to his IQ.
>>139269324
Somebody sees my point.
>>139269187
>could change
So far he's worse than ever.
All of his flaws have been exaggerated, especially considering the number of times his overconfidence has burned him.
Ethically wise, he's a shit person.
If it weren't for the dragon balls and some time travel shenanigans he'd have let everyone die multiple times because he was fucking around.
Including himself on many occasions.
>>139269116
What about Piccolo?
>>139269397
>point
I'd call it a blunt instrument that Toriyama has been beating us to death with.
>>139263768
>What is so disappointing about Dragon Ball Super for you?
It's a TV series instead of a series of movies & OVAs
>>139263894
But a decent amount of worst girlShe's my favorite.I want a cute, martial artist, hick chinese princess waifu.
>>139268934
You're making it a white and black thing for not reasson. Goku got more serious than he was when he was a child, his relationship with Gohan turns more in a father-son thing than it was in the begining and he has the capacity to focus when a fight has big stakes. No one wants him to be a master strategist, no one said he ever was. More serious doesn't mean completely serious, he's a little bit more mature and it gives a sense of progression instead of everything being on the same level as filler.
>>139263768
I;m enjoying the shit out of it I don't give a fuck
>>139269384
Im saying in super they even go as far as taking away what made goku a genious fighter and play on cliches to the extreme with not just goku but every character.
The other part of it is bad writing (getting shot in the chest).
In regards to his iq, he does rash things but every character does. When he fought kid buu he wasnt messing around at all. He just didnt have the stamina.
In super it seems like goku has reverted and hasnt took his battle knowledge with him from buu to super.
Then again, there have been no real threats imo.
>>139269577
>>139269606
Also as a child, goku didnt think twice about killing an enemy until his training with kami.
I think under the right circumstances goku could be more ruthless than vegita if you piss him off enough.
>>139269606
The master strategist and genious warrior was a trait that goku had that isnt showing in super though. Everyone is taking an l. Piccolo is the only one imo who wasn't affected so much.
But then they gave piccolo the shaft and said no training with whis, no power up for you.....
>>139263768
Nothing really. The shit animation was to be expected and it's improving every week.
>>139263768
The only competent fighters are Goku and Vegeta still. Also, SSJ God is stupid. It's literally no different than any of the other forms minus some lore bullshit and the colors. If Piccolo didn't exist, I would've never watched it anyway.
>>139269423
I cant argue with that but everyone in the series has this flaw to some extent.
Its only more severe with goku because in the back of his mind he can back it all up with his fists.
The only time he has shown his fighting capabilities is when he told beerus the same move won't work on him twice which used to hold true to some extent because goku is a fast learner in combat.
In later episodes all that shit goes out of the window.
Also, the reason they made that excuse as to why they arent wrecking everything (ki control) when they transform and fight is bs.
Its to save the shitty animators from producing action way above their ability.....
>>139270101
>Also, the reason they made that excuse as to why they arent wrecking everything (ki control) when they transform and fight is bs.
reserving your stamina has been a theme since Resurrection of Frieza's arc.
>>139270038
Lol vegita is the star right now. Goku is taking ls like no tommorrow.
Ssjg is, void because we know shit about it....... Ssj4 and etc would of been better if you ask me.
Its not that super is shit. Its that toei put shit animators on dragonball because pretty cure is too important to take a hit............. They dont give a shit until they get super canceled just like toriko.
Toriko got pulled because they showed it when literally nobody was home watching tv...... Thanks toei.
>>139263768
Bad choreography, awful music. No tension due to time travel and 3 sets of dragonballs. The entire cast is being carried along by Goku and Vegeta and it just doesn't work.
I mean just listen to this shit that played during Vegeta's Galick Gun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRMOSbSUN3A
Are you fucking kidding me?
>>139270249
It's stupid because it was a big deal in the 23rd Budokai that Goku basically never got tired.
>>139270254
Nice bullshit /v/.
>>139263768
Not even Piccolo could save the show from its terrible animation, cringy story line and inconsistent power levels.
Toei fucked up in their attempts at trying to milk this franchise dry.
>>139270249
Not the fact of reserving stamina, but collateral damage. There are no heavy impacts with hits causing damage to surrounding areas. In namek/furiza saga i saw more powerful battles.
Just like when vegita punched golden furiza in the face and he bounced off tge ground. At that point furiza should have come out the other side of the planet and flew right through the moon breaking that shit.
The sound effects are weak. The fights are slow. Everything looks stiff.
>>139270403
I wish frank miller would write a dbz story with toriyama and madhouse could produce it
>>139263857
This. God damn, THIS.
![frankmiller-asbar-love-01[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/ZEdlhCc.jpg "frankmiller-asbar-love-01[1].jpg")
>>139270517
>I love being the goddamn Super Saiyan God.
Glorious.
>>139270329
I don't see the problem. It sounds and looks like modern day anime to me. If you're looking for serious edgy shit then go back to /v/. Anime isn't like that anymore and thank God.
They cannot let it go.
As in the universe could really keep going with logical power level people as main characters and the Z figthers as ERA OF MYTHS tier.
For a anime of the "Moral" age of animu they cannot seem to embrace the "we fight for next generations so they can live in peace ( and learn how to fight too so when we are gone they take care).
They gave some shots at it with Future Trunks and Gohan and they end up jobbing so goku comes and cleans the mess.
Fucking pissed, TOEI and JEWS are ruining great source materials.
I could totally picture an overaged but borderline inmortal Krillin teaching, young humans with saying blood going arround, Goku overseeing shit from heaven (Gohan and goten rekt broly), Buu human reencarnation needing guidance arc with a beautifull Tournament arc with a new set off Z figthers. Space integrated earth and earthlings having to fight.
New freezers, Mecha-humanoids shit again-, Vegeta is actually a space elder somewhere training while goku is dead. The truth about dragonballs, the space race for dragonballs, Evil clans awakening in the whole galaxy, Saiyan female for feminists and gurls.
All of this with lower power level tiers like SSJ1.
Piccollo oversees earth and has sporadic conversations with goku about old times and gives wisdom to shitters.
>>139270656
sounds like shitty Naruto inspired fanfic.
>>139270629
Obviously the words of a sjw..... And never saw a dbz fight in his life.......
This aint yugioh or fagamon.
>>139270629
No wonder I hate almost all of modern day anime.
>>139270803
Lol right? That proves this generation is soft.
Imagine if Dragon Ball Z/Goku's story ended with the Cell Saga?
It would've been the best way to close the series out.
No shitty Buu arc that ruined Gohan's character. No horrible GT trying to milk the franchise. No BoG bullshit making money off nostalgia fags.
No Super.
>>139270772
>>139270803
Look nostalgiafags, some African dude on YouTube makes amateur DBZ spinoffs called "Absalon" or something, that would fit your taste more. Just be sure to watch them with Linkin Park in the backdrop too.
>>139270900
>no Videl;_:
>>139263768
I like Dragon Ball Super and am having a great time watching it every week
>>139263768
everything about it is irritating
i stopped watching around episode 20, whenever ginyu showed up.
>>139270914
Way ahead of you big boy ;)
>>139270656
Up until the about the end of the Frieza saga, I always thought the series would with Krillin becoming immortal from the dragon balls and becoming the new Roshi. I thought Gohan was going to become the new Kami after Piccolo trained him and then died. I also thought Goku would die and stay dead in the battle against Frieza and that Vegeta would be the new Piccolo, acting as a gruff mentor that helped Gohan achieve Super Saiyan by dying in some redemptive savior fashion kinda like Piccolo. I was very wrong.
>>139263768
The new art style.
The lack of originality. Literally rehashing 2 movies into shit quality arcs. The general shit quality of the animation. A fucking tourney arc with uninspired/rehashed character designs for the antagonists. Toei's continued trademark label of milking a product for all it's while barely putting in the bare minimum of effort.
>>139270947
same even with the shitty animation. I just use my imagination and think it's like Toyotaro manga quality.
>>139268679
wasn't it the nardo and bleach studio? I'm not surprised.
>>139270914
Lol, if he could actually draw and the whole thing didnt look like shit. The fights are linear but more creative i will say that.
The story is non existent they seem to just do shit.
I mean something along the quality and detail to action in one punch man.
Like when saitama fought the subterraneans and they punched him through the bridge. You could literally see the shockwave and the amount of detail as hes going through every layer with heavy hitting sound effects behind it to give it visual power.
Super lacks that and dbz had all of it.
>>139271251
the only way we're getting quality animation is if they want to make a new movie and milk us in the cinema.
>>139263768
People in /a/ watching it. They're milking your nostalgia hard. Super is a big pile of shit and Toei doesn't give a damn.
>>139271079
Yup.
>sloppy art/animation
>awful music
>U6 fighters are really badly designed
>retelling of the first 2 movies were pointless and very drawn out
>god forms are just stupid
>Goku doesn't use ssj3 anymore
>frieza's first form was way too powerful. I don't care how weak gohan is now, frieza shouldn't have beaten him so easily
>Vegeta trying to convince whis to train him was so out of character
>Nameks didn't create the dragon balls
>stealing the tournament idea from dragon ball multiverse
>Goku and vegeta still aren't stronger than beerus after 3 years in the time chamber
>bulma is constantly beating up jaco for no reason. the joke got old very quickly.
in a nutshell, everything
>>139271310
Lol true. They could give us quality if they wanted to. But wouldn't hold my breathe on it.
Im just waiting to see what anime will toei fuck up next.
>>139270900
It was fine up until supreme faggot showed up. As soon as he appeared the entire arc went into the dumpster.
>>139271315
>Nameks didn't create the dragon balls
Seriously?
Awful art style and lack of fight choreography mostly, there's no oomph behind hits, hardly any enviromental destruction, super slow movements when they were around supersonic speed in their childhood, got more complains but those are the ones that stick out the most for me
>>139263768
>terrible animation
>reused villains
>awful new character designs
>alternate universes
Super is like a text book example of lazy cash ins.
>>139271315
The ssj3 thing wouldn't be an issue if the new forms were badass and above and beyond what damage was caused in the old dbz. They shouldnt even be able to fight on planets at this point. Solar systems should be crumbling just by being present lol. Yet we get 2 timid bitch transformations that dont do shit.
>>139271444
they took a fraction of the Super Dragon balls and made their own.
>>139271500
Well to be fair they did try to hype up God form by making the Universe crumble when Goku and Beerus clashed fists.
>>139271063
>removing Piccolo
why?
There is no power behind their attacks, just look at boros vs saitama where every attack and even movements feel more powerful even though they aren't fighting at universum buster strenght
>>139271542
But god form is just Super Saiyan with blue hair.
I just recently watched Fusion Reborn. That movie had the sickest super saiyan transformation ever.
>>139271560
Literally the best character in the whole franchise, what in the actual fuck is this.
>>139271622
I was referring to Red haired SSJ God form fyi.
>>139271455
Exactly. Someone with some superior action/fighting taste.
I think new anime fans are soft and accept this bitch ass blanket soft shit super calls action. Even naruto had better fights which hurts me to say to the core......... Bleach as well. Wtf happwned to dbz.
The action in one punch man is what i expected out of super but to an even more intense degree. Dragonball was never super gory but the battles were edgy and very intense and powerful.
Now they are slow, lackluster, weak, it might as well turn into beyblade which sadly also has better animation.
>>139271670
There are more than one?
>>139263857
this
influencing the resurface of manchildren and nostalgiafags
>>139271692
Super Saiyan God has red hair. Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan (yes they actually fucking called it that) has blue hair
>>139271675
I don't even need DB fights to be huge. Some of my favorite few moments in recent Dragonball fights (the movies mostly) have been the moments where they actually show off some Martial arts, taken to the extreme. Goku's 1-inch punch is still more memorable than almost anything in Super.
>>139271730
Well, thank you for reaffirming me in the decision not to watch this shit atleast.
>>139271776
of all the things to hate on SSJ Blue is not one of them.
did anyone else notice that when vegeta was fighting magetta, the closeup on his forehead vein was basically traced from when he goes super saiyan for android 19?
>>139271730
Didn't they rename it SSJ Blue?
>>139271851
Its still just a Super Saiyan reskin.
>>139271883
Only in the manga I believe.
>>139271895
what's your point?
>>139271912
its lazy and unoriginal
>>139271952
what did you expect?
>>139271952
Not like Super Saiyan 2, when your hair spikes up slightly and you get cool lightning effects. That was inspired.
>>139271542
They did which was cool, but retarded at the same time. Dragonball just got around to solar system or multi around bog. Then in super goes right to universal.
If they had gradually done it solar system, multi solar, galaxy, multi galaxy, universal (cosmic), multiversal, omniverse, gradually it wouldnt have been so confusing.
Thap particular episode (episode 12) didn't really have exciting visuals either like we would expect. I expected something hyper than asuras wrath, gurren lagaan, one punch man combined in terms of action and stars and planets getting blown to smitherines, them being tackled through planets breaking them fighting in cores of planets and more stuff with cool looking forms and new techniques.
Like they need to step it up but gradually powerscale up and show more feats during battle but go back to the roots of what made the fights look powerful while taking into consideration how powerful these characters should be.
Also boost their damn durability. They are ssjg afterall. Idc if your gaurd is down. If you get shot through the chest you aint no damn ssjg lol.
Super feels like fan-fiction.
>>139271978
I'm sorry, I could've sworn this thread was asking what I found disappointing.
I guess I was wrong.
Nothing, I've never watched it.
>>139272047
nah no one asked your opinion since you don't even watch it.
>>139263878
>Buu Saga
>serious
>>139271751
That one move is a legendary one but it had alot of kick behind it due to the sound efx and the visuals. (one inch punch)
Idk, its been a while. They teased us with the kai openings, the budokai game animations, they can do it but they dont want dbz to be the best it can be. It can have better action than opm or anything out there if you put the right people on.
We just have to be greatful we got a new series i guess.
If they do decide to make a series after this, they better fire this team and not rush.
>>139272082
Faggot, the first reply to the thread is someone saying they don't like that Super even exists and three replies to that agreeing.
Fuck off.
>>139272141
what's your point? Baby gonna cry now because you've been invalidated? There's a difference between being dissatisfied from watching DBS and a poser like you that just runs his mouth without watching it.
>>139272177
Something wrong, buddy? Misplace your favorite hot wheel?
>>139272029
Yeah lol. They got a series in store for the hardcore action fans that want a more serious db, but super has to run its course.
>>139272228
>resorting to shitposting
we're done here.
>>139271883
in the manga, yes. still dumb, though
>>139271851
I hate it for a few reasons. first of all, saiyans are not gods. they're mortals and nowhere in their DNA should there be anything about holding hands with other saiyans to become a god. say what you want about GT, but at least SSJ4 was based on saiyan biology and made the Oozaru form relevant again.
Secondly, super saiyan god is not a super saiyan. Goku still had his regular hair and so super should not be in the name. Super saiyan god super saiyan (seriously who thought that name was a good idea?) should have been called super saiyan god and the red hair should just be saiyan god.
Third, why do they only go SSJ1 when using their god energy? If you're having a hard time against frieza that go fucking super saiyan 3 or at least super saiyan 2. "but those forms burn up too much energy." No, only super saiyan 3 does. No one's ever had a problem using super saiyan 2 in DBZ, but suddenly in super they decide not to use it. And am I honestly supposed to believe that Goku would spend 3 years in the time chamber and not even consider mastering ssj3 like he did with SSJ right before the cell games? No, because that's stupid
I think that about covers my hatred towards SSJ Gods
>>139271063
Eh, even the fucking cloud looks soulless.
>>139272243
Whatever you say, friend.
>>139272251
I hate it because ssjg (red) looks like kaioken. Ssjgssj( ssjblue) looks like ssj1 with blue hair.
Red can regenerate, survive the vaccum of space, absorb different energies.
Blue struggled in water, and ssjblue vegita died from a supernouva explosion............... Oh and goku ssjblue got shot through the heart.
Beerus literally impaled goku in the heart with his hand and goku (red) regenerated...... And blue is stronger than red how again? Oh because the story said so........
Im gonna admit. When i saw goku go ssj1 in the universe 6 against botamo i almost dropped the show completely.
>>139272478
it's mostly a mystery but it's speculated that they have different properties because 1 is pretty much a one time ritual form, and another is a transformation based on a remaining spark of God essence.
It's mostly just a convenient plot device without much explanation to be honest though.
>>139272593
Lol yeah. No exposition for blue whatsoever.
So it seems red has mystical attributes because of the ritual.
Blue is the normal ki infused with god ki residue?
So basically having god ki means you can merge and partition these types of ki at will?
>>139272753
Yep pretty much
>>139272251
SSJ burns energy, it got stablished in the cell saga and too much power at once blocks your body, still, training is meant to compensate for that (was Goku and Gohan spending a month permanently supersaiyan 100% filler or was it mentioned in the manga?). SSJ3 was only possible in the spirit realm because you don't have human limitations, so when he used it on earth it took out of the time he had there, but that should had been compensated with training on earth if it had been possible.
You know the real reasson is because no one likes how SSJ3 looks like and it's hard to distinguish 2 from 1 when it's simplified for animation.
>>139272819
>was Goku and Gohan spending a month permanently supersaiyan
More like just the week between exit Time chamber to Cell games. It was indeed in the manga.
>>139272593
Still really confused about how vegita reached blue and if he ever achieved red.
My interpretation was training at beerus planet with whis must have rubbed off on vegita allowing him to absorb the essence of god ki floating around there.
Then when he punched fists with goku, activated the god ki and learned how to harness it through training in that room whis sent them to.
Still bs but there was no explanation.
They say there is a toriyama x toyotaro interview coming with volume 1 for dbs tankonbon release (will have chapters 1-9). So i hope these things are explained then.
Toei, ever a old man studio with a reputation for bottom of the barrel cost cutting (revolutionary in the field of cheap shit tbqh fampais) actually puts out shit even worse than their cel era QUALITY.
>>139272916
>So i hope these things are explained then.
I'm extremely excited for that, I really respect Toyotaro, something I can't really say for Toei as much at the moment.
>>139270329
>using long forgotten nostalgia bait gun instead of the objectively in universe superior final flash
>>139263878
dragon ball was actually funny AND had some of the best fights in the series
this has nothing
Not even nostalgia speaking since I first watched dragon ball in 2012
>>139273005
he does both in the episode.
>>139272980
Im about to get future plot summaries for super but have to wait till this weekend as my contact is busy working on shows. If anyone has questions about super ask and ill make them apart of my questions. If not well ill get my questions answered.
You know they started a bebi janemba db heroes special 3 years ago and just put it on the backburner. Kinda had me thinking toei was going to try to make heroes a show but jumped at super instead.
>>139273706
I wish dbs took the tone of street fighter and the whole warriors path. Except dbz style.
>>139263768
I grew up.
It started off retelling BotG and RoF with really bad animation and a bunch of changes that contradict what little consistency Dragon Ball Z had.
>>139263768
Not enough Gohan jobbing.
>>139268278
It had a lot of big time Japanese key animators actually. Some of the credited names are crom early naruto and shit
>people call it American animation
>>139263857
this
I was playing Chrono Trigger DS by naming my characters based on DB characters, which made me think: How badly would Toei fuck up a CT anime series more than DB Super?
>>139274727
I thought they already made an OVA for Chrono Trigger.
>>139274888
it wasn't really featuring the main characters though, it was just two random monsters stealing the show but it was nice to Johnny and Gato/Gonzales in it.
latest episode was nice as well
good fanservice
>adding new stories between the 10 year gap of a story that ended in 90s instead of adding new stuff after that ending
>Gohan gets weaker as shit(I can still transform into a super saiyan..I think...)
>Goku gets way too stupid to a point he doesnt take things seriously anymore
>Vegeta and Beerus get mad because of that. But Vegeta can have a hard time with Robo because he was a super saiyan and not SSJ Blue
>Goku is friends with someone who destroys planets because food
>Freeza vs Goku wasn't good like the original one
>anime kills off Piccolo for a 5 minutes for no reason
>anime is currently Vegeta the show(garikuuu gun, finaaarru frashu, ratatatata tata)
>digital era of toei, animation is terrible, direction is terrible, fighting is terrible, no choreography at all
Toei can't do it anymore, they don't even know how to handle fights. That's why Piccolo vs Frost or Vegeta vs Robo are just "scream, teleporting everywhere, scream, ki blasts, scream, teleports, scream louder, scream trademark blast for nostalgia"
The manga is more enjoyable though.
>>139266222
Goku was never this stupid. He was usually naive as a kid until Piccolo Jr and few times over confident through the series specially when new transformation. But now is every damn fight. They are really trying hard for Vegeta to be the man and for Goku to step his game for some reason, instead of Goku and Vegeta being on the same level with Goku being naive a few times and Vegeta with his saiyan pride.
>>139274462
Isn't the last few seasons actually done together with Pierrot?
>>139263857
Not even a Gohanfag but
>Gohan in the OP
>relevance 0
This quakes my autism. Just remove him and pop in Beerus or some shit.
>>139275051
might as well remove Pilaf, Shu and Mai since they are even less relevant.
>>139275051
Goten is also there and doesn't do shit.
But hey! They remembered Yajirobi in the last ending for a small frame.
>>139275128
I'm specifically talking about that scene when Vegeta, Goku, and him are beating up those mooks. What purpose is there to him being there?
>>139275004
>adding new stories between the 10 year gap of a story that ended in 90s instead of adding new stuff after that ending
Yes because seeing the Z fighters in the time of peace would be so interesting and hey while were at it Toriyama should have included the 7 year time skip after Gohan killed Cell.
>>Gohan gets weaker as shit
What did you expect? He became a scholar and started a family. There were no threats harassing Earth and so he needed to make a new living for his family. Something his father has no idea about.
>Goku gets way too stupid to a point he doesnt take things seriously anymore
Goku is always stupid.
>Vegeta and Beerus get mad because of that. But Vegeta can have a hard time with Robo because he was a super saiyan and not SSJ Blue
SSJ Blue is only needed when serious and nothing else. Why would they go into their final forms if they didn't think the enemy was worth it?
>Goku is friends with someone who destroys planets because food
He isn't friends with him, he is using good food to be on his good side.
>Freeza vs Goku wasn't good like the original one
Oh yes because the old fight wasn't long, melodramatic and had many ass pulls.
>anime kills off Piccolo for a 5 minutes for no reason
Right because killing off Goku in the first arc where he trains in the afterlife is so much better.
>anime is currently Vegeta the show
As opposed to Goku's show for 90% of the series.
>digital era of toei, animation is terrible, direction is terrible, fighting is terrible, no choreography at all
Nonsensical babbling
>The manga is more enjoyable though.
The manga is more enjoyable huh? This is probably the worst thing in the entire post.
What a joke of a post.
>>139263878
>Cell Games
>good
Mr. Satan filler
Goku fights Cell for a couple chapters/episodes
Turns out "They were just warming up", all basically filler
Goku blows off Cell's upper half, yet he's able to regenerate because of the "nuclei in his brain"
Cell removes the arena rule
Goku gives up despite still being in pretty good condition
Goku says he couldn't have gotten stronger no matter how much he trained in the Room of Spirit and Time, which contradicts him getting stronger later in the series through training
Gohan's up to fight, but Gohan does nothing because he's suddenly a super pacifist who won't even throw a punch, despite going nuts on Raditz, Nappa, Vegeta, Dodoria, Freeza, and whoever else.
Cell Jrs. "as strong as Cell himself", yet Gohan kills all of them in single attacks, which says what about Cell?
Side characters (and even Goku) being complete jobbers, except they've at least put up decent fights before. Here they're just standing around getting beat up.
Gohan dicks around for the next several episodes until Cell just blows himself and Goku up
Gohan loses the use of his arm because Vegeta
Gohan beats Cell in one attack with one arm
Goku won't come back, and despite being able to communicate with his family and friends, completely drops all contact with them for 7 years, despite having just knocked up his wife before dying.
And let's not count Kuririn destroying the remote that could blow up #18 because he had a boner, and letting Cell achieve perfection.
Or Vegeta allowing Cell to reach perfect.
Or the androids deciding to take a road trip to Goku's house which gives plenty of time for the characters to just screw around
Or the sudden introduction of a room where a year's worth of training can be done in a single day that was apparently always there but never mentioned
Or Cell waiting 10 days doing nothing before the Cell Games
Or Toriyama's editors forcing him to change the main villains constantly (#19/#20 > #16/#17/#18 > Cell+transformations)
>>139276047
>Or the sudden introduction of a room where a year's worth of training can be done in a single day that was apparently always there but never mentioned
But that was important in Buu saga.
The concept itself.
Dragon ball is overlyabused. Is like watching a rotten corpse tied to strings and used as a marionette. Just let it rest in peace.
>>139276137
>implying we're not all necrophiliacs
>>139276078
Yeah, Toriyama managed to salvage the idea. Post-Cell Games was written better than post-Freeza. Toriyama himself said that the whole arc was sort of a mess, and that he considered the moment where Goku goes Super Saiyan and stares down Freeza (which he said was trying to imitate Bruce Lee) to be the "peak" of the series, and that with Namek, he thought he had written his best and couldn't top it.
His new editor post-Cell was far more lenient and let Toriyama go back to his more comedic style.
This Universe 6 vs Universe 7 arc is not a complete mess filled with plot devices and plot holes like just about everything between Freeza and Buu, and it doesn't feel like fan fiction like GT either. However, it does feel more like an extension of Buu arc Toriyama in terms of writing style, along with his modern style. I am genuinely interested in seeing the series progress, even if the animation isn't that great (only later DBZ and GT attempted detailed animation).
>>139276047
>Or the sudden introduction of a room where a year's worth of training can be done in a single day that was apparently always there but never mentioned
wew lad
>>139276281
>it does feel more like an extension of Buu arc
You are insane.
>>139276281
if the manga came out first by Toyotaro and Toei managed to replicate those iconic panels and his art direction, the anime would actually be really good imo.
>>139276357
I don't mean in terms of plot, but it does feel like Toriyama's writing tone from back then, just without the big stakes since we know everything will be alright for the epilogue. It has the comedy and the wacky gimmicky villains instead of just being straight power level fights.
One thing I dislike about the Daizenshuus is the retroactive power levels. In really close matches, Goku will be equal to or just barely stronger than the opponents he fought like King Piccolo or Tenshinhan, when the whole point of power levels is that they don't matter. It's the skill of the fighter that matters and lets them overcome gaps between the measurements of raw strengths.
Piccolo was under Frost's level, but he was able to wear him down. Frost beat Goku and Piccolo through poisoning them, not physically beating the crap out of them. Goku beat Botamo not with pure strength, but with brains, and the same goes for Vegeta vs Magetta. Buu could turn people into candy and absorb them, Dabra's spit turned whatever it touched to stone, Babidi could use mind control, etc.
Post-Cell Toriyama is similar to pre-DBZ Toriyama where the villains' threat is their gimmick. Akuman had a beam that could kill anyone with even a little bit of evil in them. How does a fan reconcile that ability with an enemy like Freeza or Cell? It's an example of how much the tone of the series has changed. Now we have a giant alien bear that transfers damage to another dimension and robots with heavy defense filled with fire.
>>139263768
The fact that it's a cheap cash grab continuation of an anime targeted at small children and yet /a/ seriously loses its shit over it.
>I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY DID THIS TO SO-AND-SO CHARACTER WAAAH
>>139276591
>Akuman had a beam that could kill anyone with even a little bit of evil in them. How does a fan reconcile that ability with an enemy like Freeza or Cell?
Why not just alien ki or something?
>>139276303
Not sure why your noticing this only now, the entire buu saga was asspull after asspull.
>>139276770
Wouldn't you keep a room like that a secret if you had it?
Why didn't goku tell anyone about the time chamber in the future timeline via King Kai? Did he not give a shit?
>>139276852
Don't think about the future timeline. Its all just a nonsense headache.
>>139276630
What are you twelve?
>>139276770
on one hand it's justified saying that the conditions are so harsh that you'd need to be way beyond kamisama's level to train there. Since they never got a break after Vegeta's fight they never had a chance.
Also it appears in the cell arc.
>>139263768
>What is so disapointing about Dragon Ball Super for you?
Dragon Ball Super.
I kinda wish it never existed, like GT.
>>139277011
But GT was good.
>>139277026
Fuck off retard.
>>139277026
>>139277057
I'm downloading it right now so I can post screenshots from it in the future.
>>139277026
>Watching GT
I bet you also think super is good considering your shit taste.
>>139277258
No, Super is full of lazy reused concepts and alternate universes. Atleast GT had original ideas and good animation.
>>139277026
Oh boy you just cracked open a big can of squirmy wormies
>>139277281
if you really think about it there wasn't really anything original about GT. IF anything it's extreme fanservice based on pre existing favorites and archetypes.
>>139277359
That saiyan's stealing another planet because they destroyed their own and the native species seeking revenge by developing a living killing machine to hunt the saiyan's down and kill them isn't original?
The dragon balls changing due to bad karma involved in the wishes made with them isn't original?
>>139276801
Toriyama has outright stated across multiple interviews spanning decades that he writes by the seat of his pants. He rarely foreshadows. The one example I can think of where he admits outright foreshadowing is when Piccolo speaks Namekian at the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai. He decided that when he introduced "God", he wanted him to be an alien, and thought ahead enough that going to Namek was in his mind since he knew the series popularity wasn't showing any signs of going down.
The Room of Spirit and Time was not mentioned anytime before Cell because Toriyama had never thought of it before Cell. It's as simple as that. He needed a way for all the major players (Goku, Gohan, Vegeta, Trunks, and Piccolo) to get stronger really quickly, but had no idea how to do that without creating a plot device, so that's what he did.
>>139276770
I wouldn't say the Buu arc had lots of asspulls. Goku only retroactively said that he could have beaten Buu at first as a Super Saiyan 3. Gohan having more hidden potential AGAIN was a bit of an asspull, but not a new one. Majin Vegeta could have been handled a bit better, but I wouldn't call it an asspull, just weak writing, though it acted as a good setup for the rest of the arc. I wouldn't say fusion was an asspull either, since Goku had learned it while being dead, and it's not like he could teach it to anyone prior to Buu (or had any need to, really).
Toriyama is primarily a gag writer. That's why you can have hilariously overpowered things like Akuman and the Senzus in a series. This idea that Goku is some heroic manly man fighting evil to uphold justice and being hardcore all the time is a complete misread of his character, and it's a very common one. Goku has always been a dimwitted hick with superhuman strength and a background in martial arts who likes to adventure and fight strong opponents to push his limits. He's not even that vengeful. He only kills when absolutely necessary.
>>139277543
>The Room of Spirit and Time was not mentioned anytime before Cell because Toriyama had never thought of it before Cell. It's as simple as that
But that doesn't mean that it isn't fine that nobody knew about it.
>>139277413
What is The plan to eradicate the Saiyans?
>>139277573
What about never mentioning it when the Saiyans attacked?
Or during the 3 year gap before the androids that would supposedly murder everyone show up?
>>139277625
Some shitty OVA pieced together by video game cut scenes.
>>139277543
There were much more than just that, all that bullshit with the z sword, old supreme faggot and all his Gohan power unleashing,Goku revival, Buu escaping the time chamber(The biggest asspull in the entire series), potara earrings and the fusion breaking off inside Buu's body was all just terrible.But as you said Toriyama is mostly a gag writer so i shouldn't have expected any high quality writing anyway.
>>139277413
>seeking revenge by developing a living killing machine
Dr.Myuu was a literal 1:1 clone of Dr. Gero.
Baby is a hybrid concept between a Cell clone and the relies on absorbing/attaching onto the Z fighters.
Dragon Balls having a negative consequence was decent but the execution of that arc was atrocious so who really cares?
>>139277849
That Z Sword and Gohan shit shouldn't have happened, I agree. They should've just dropped Gohan as a character when they fucked him up so much and put all their efforts into making Goten into what they wanted Gohan to be.
>>139277662
Before the saiyans attacked they were bellow Popo's level. They would had died there. Before the androids no one bothered to ask and they were pretty pumped thinking it would be so shit bellow vegeta levels.
Since you guys are recapping DBZ history, could anyone tell me why Gogeta was a thing when in the source material they said they have to be of the same height and powerlevel?
>>139278015
I don't remember height coming into it.
It was all about synchronicity.
>>139269577
This hairstyle is literally one of the worst things that ever happened in the series. Aside from the fact she's full of clothes when she was like a stripper when a kid. The way her character changed so much barely makes any sense. I wish she kept her tomboy side.
>>139277970
It was a huge asspull, that's all it was. Toriyama rarely ever looks back on his work, so there are inconsistencies as early as the second chapter.
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/manga/chp-002/
>When Goku goes to bed on the 11th page of the chapter, he is not wearing his wristbands (having been wearing them while out of bed on the previous page). But he is wearing them when he wakes up on page 12. They disappear again on page 13, remaining absent for the remainder of the chapter. From the context of the chapter itself, it is uncertain whether Toriyama intended for Goku to be wearing his wristbands or not at this point, so it is not clear which pages are the mistake, and which pages are as intended. (For what it’s worth, however, Episode 2 of the animated adaptation leaves his wristbands on for the entire length of this sequence.)
Trying to explain why the Room of Spirit and Time was never mentioned before Cell is like trying to explain how all the movies fit into the story in a way that makes sense.
>>139278066
They use it to explain why he couldn't fuse with Picoro right there. Height, weight and power level.
>>139278151
Hmm, seems like a mistake on their part. They could have just as easily said that they have to be the same species since the only fusions are between two Kais, two Saiyans and two Half-human Half-Saiyans.
I want off Mr Toriyama's wild ride
When the Battle of Gods movie came out, I was really jazzed about the Super Saiyan God form. I thought that keeping his original hair style but making it glow red and having him become more lean and young-looking were good design choices. It felt like there was more to being a GOD than ridiculous muscles or raw strength (sort of similar to discovering SSJ2 instead of bulking up). His appearance had this serenity, one that you would expect from a divine being.
And then they just made him Super Duper Super Saiyan, brought back his muscles and scowl. Watching him fight in his new form, it's literally no different from a blue-haired super saiyan.
But yeah, crap tier animation, mundane fights, useless characters, attacks and conundrums that they should be far too powerful to give a shit about... Z had elements of all of these, but they're more common and more pronounced in Super, and there's very little positive to balance it out.
It wasn't for me, I wanted it to be shit to laguh at the DBfags and I got what I wanted.
>>139265804
They didnt even animated bills vs champa
