Why couldn't Archer defeat Berserker twelve times?
>>134505116
Because that's his limit at fighting him head on while trying to stall him so the others escape. Berserker is actually a high tier heroic spirit that it's really hard to kill, and Emiya probably doesn't even have that many A ranked Noble Phantasms to replicate (and they get reduced a rank with projection) making it really an uphill battle.
Basically, there is a limit to what a jack of all trades can do in a battle like that.
>>134505116
Because he's a faggot
>>134505212
Nasu said that archer didn't use UBW though, and he still managed to remove quite some lives from berserker.
Wouldn't he have won with UBW? Which leads us to the real question: How is that at all consistent with what we otherwise know about their respective power gap?
>>134505212
If Shirou could kill a stronger berserker 9 times with unstable projection, Why can't Archer kill him 12 times?
>>134505116
He relies on preparation and cunning tactics
>>134505352
He need to use BP to bypass God Hand. UBW would be waste of mana.
He didn't have that much mana for that fight since saybah cut his neck earlier in the route and he had to use a lot of mana to heal. Rin was too big of a tsun to fuck him and give more mana
>>134505352
UBW was said lots of times to be only a bother against other Servants that aren't Gilgamesh.
>>134505361
The blackened Berserker was weaker actually, and we don't even know if God Hand was active or if Nine Lives actually killed him 9 times. Also, the whole scene is thematically written as Shirou doing what Archer couldn't and "surpassing" him, so probably Archer would have never thought of using the axe sword like that.
>>134505477
Wasn't the explanation that his "spirit core" was damaged by saber, and he could not acess his full capabillites because of that? Rin gave him all the mana she could, but his limits where capped.
We know that he could beat berserker easily if he where at 100% with Rin as his master.
>>134505361
Black Berserker was just a shadow of what normal Berserker was. He was blind and deaf and running without control.
And even so, Shirou only defeated him because Illya was there so Berserker stopped at the very last moment.
>>134505116
Bruh, shoulders day everyday.
>>134505582
There wasn't any explanation and the injury was actually said to be healed at that point. Emiya is not a super strong Servant, he is a swiss Army knife that has a lot of tools to deal with a lot of situations, but on the Servant power spectrum he is mid tier at best.
>>134505662
The injury was healed at the cost of mana, hence why Archer wasnt even able to UBW against him
>>134505662
Well, if Gilgamesh could kill Berserker, why can't Archer do it, too? Under the right circumstances of course.
Blame my bad japanese, if I got anything wrong.
>>134505722
Why would he use UBW in that situation? It would be a waste of mana. He doesn't need it to poject stuff.
>>134505732
Gil have A rank weapons, Archer doesn't unless he BP them.
>>134505790
To lower the cost of projection so he can spend the rest of his mana making BP?
>>134505116
Archer fought Berserker head on, he didn't try to kill Illya while fighting Berserker, like some other coward.
He still killed him 6 times. BASED SHIROU.
>>134505790
Isn't the entire point of UBW to make it so you can spam the shit out of projections for near zero cost?
>>134505864
UBW cost mana. Lots of mana. Shirou used everything Rin had to summon his
>>134505722
And UBW would be useless against Berserker or any other Servant not being Gil as the game and even the anime directly says. UBW is only a threat against Gilgamesh because numbers against numbers and Gil not having anything in GoB that can directly deal mean game over to Emiya (outside Ea, but Gil is a retard to use that against a faker).
>>134505732
Because the weapons in UBW are downgraded and not as varied as anything the whole GoB has. What makes the sword rain in GoB dangerous isn't the numbers but that each of these swords being genuine Noble Phantasms.
>>134505864
UBW costs far more to cast and mantain than single projections.
>>134505910
No, it's to have many weapons ready to be used. Something that is only useful fighting against someone who even if has better weapons, he is still a bit slower deploying them. Any other Servant who actually knows how to use his own weapons masterfully would just barrage through it and kill Emiya with them.
In other words, it worked against Gilgamesh because he is like Emiya, a jack of all trades.
>>134505910
It's only worth it, if you want to cast a great number of blades. And BP need a cast time, before he can shoot it. So it will need be "spammed". I guess, you would need to ask Nasu for the math on this. But my guess that it's only worth using UBW for a huge number of blades and not for 12 blades, that you shoot thourough the whole fight.
Emiya can't BBC with UBW that's why he lost.
Heracles can BBC with Nine Lives, that's why he won. And Gilgamesh won because he can also BBC with Enuma Elish.
Why the fuck isn't UBW Arts? What the fuck Delight Works?
>>134506536
What is BBC?
>>134505116
He held back from using the high yield Broken Phantasm since Ilya was in the immediate area.
>>134506574
Big black cock.
>>134506574
BIG BLACK COCK.Buster Brave Chain.
>>134506597
He had to use some because that's basically the only way he had to kill Berserker. Don't mix DEEN anime with this.
>>134506649
DEEN anime had him using Caladbolg
>>134505116
>Why couldn't Archer defeat Berserker twelve times?
Terrain disadvantage that forced him to fight mostly at close range against the most OP melee servant of the war, and Illya beingArcher's sisterwhich only allowed him to use attacks that would not inflict collateral damage on her.
>>134505116
How could Archer even kill Berserker 6 times?
He didn't have the time, range or space to snipe him with BPs, so HOW?
Did he use NLBW and got interrupted by the 6th strike? did he trace a degraded Excalibur and got killed because of the strain of using it?
>>134505960
How is UBW any different from GoB for other servants that aren't Berserker anyway? I don't get it.
>>134508185
It isn't, but since that would make Archer too OP Nasu just had to nerf it in the lamest way possible.
>>134505582
→we know
No we don't
>>134508185
Because they judge dodge/deflected the swords and/or kill Shirou immediately anyway. It's easy to imagine someone like Lancer for example having no trouble parrying all of the attacks while advancing on Shirou.
The ONLY reason it beats Gilgamesh is because it's so similar to GoB but slightly quicker, so it shuts down Gil's only method of attacking while putting Shirou in a constant state of advantage.
As you should know by now, Gil has nothing going for him in the physical department, at least for a servant, his only real advantage is being able to spam Noble Phantasms.
>>134509617
>It's easy to imagine someone like Lancer for example having no trouble parrying all of the attacks.
Because he has protection from arrows. But Saber, a top tier servant, struggled with sword rains before, and Lancelot, even with Knight of Honor would have lost to a rain of more than 30 NPs.
Someone must buy and distribute this for science and Tohsaka's anus
http://www.dlsite.com/home/work/=/product_id/RJ151242/?unique_op=af
>>134509864
Could Saitama Kill Beserk 12 times?
>>134509917
He would take his 12 lives in a single punch.
>>134509864
7.0307 US Dollar
>>134505361
A single shitty excaliblast can take all of Berserker's 12 lives. Black Berserker was not only excaliblasted the darkening weakened him by making him blind.
>>134505116
Berserk is one of the strongest servants of the war, the only one stronger is Gilgamesh (that's countere by EMIYA). Berserker could even easily defeat Saber and in the Fate route they took him out just by asspulls. The fact that a mid tier servant like Archer (that was defeated by almost everyone during the war) could kill him so many times is already a quite strange thing
>>134509617
Well, he's not particularly skilled but his stats are pretty damn high and I'm sure he's got trinkets in his storage that he could bring to bear if he wanted. There's also the armor.
He's not going to beat Saber or Kojirou in a swordfight but he's smart enough not to get bogged down in a straight up melee with them in the first place.
So he's got merits beside sword spam. He just didn't use any of them against Shirou.
>>134509838
The point is that these arne't legitimate NPs.
Even when they hit, the damage is superficial if the servant has any sort of armor, like Saber or Lancelot.
>>134505116
Because that wouldn't be convenient for the plot.
>>134510215
>The point is that these arne't legitimate NPs.
>Even when they hit, the damage is superficial if the servant has any sort of armor, like Saber or Lancelot.
This is all fanfiction.
UBW's NPs get their original rank reduced by one, but then they function as perfectly normal NPs.
If Invisible Air, a rank C NP or K&B, two shitty rank C- projections, can hurt and kill armored servants, then a B or C rank NP rain from UBW could definitely kill one. Don't even get me started on shit like Monohoshizao, that aren't even Noble Phantasms to begin with.
>>134505116
Basically this >>134510709
But give GARcher distance to actually shoot him with BP and mana( Rin fucking left him on his own and did not even boosted him with command seals) and he would do this.
Probably something among the lines of 6 times from the distance and 6 times close quarters.
>>134511353
Still unlikely. 9 or 10 kills would be a more reasonable assumption.
But if he were to use Gil's cheap strategy of aiming at Illya he could probably win.
>>134505929
Archer has more mana available than Shirou (B Rank), so even with UBW he should have some left to use BPs.
