>Demons aren't actually evil creatures
Why does anime do this all the time? I'd understand it if it happened once or twice, as a breaking of an old trope, but at this point it's so common that it's a trope in its own right. Why does Japan keep doing this? Does "(aku)ma" actually mean "guardian spirit" or something?
The west does it at least as often, and it goes back a long time.
Gap moe.
>>124616605
I can't really think of any Western media where demons are depicted as either good, or at least as good as humans. Only people who use demonic powers without actually being demons themselves, like Spawn.
>>124616653
Sounds legit, although Maou is just moe.
her b00bs are demonic. its evil how big they are get it
Yeah, also angels tend to be lewd or violent so often that you'd expect that from anime.
That's just an excuse to provide fanservice. You need likable demons and most people like good characters.
>>124616713
No it is heavenly how big her boobs are
>>124616694
Hellboy?
>>124616694
you don't know much western media then
just look at the bible for starters
>there will never be more economics
>>124616411
>>124616694
>>124616748
>anime designs
shit
>>124616868
I actually prefer the anime/LN design over the manga one.
>>124616411
>Why does Japan keep doing this?
Buddhism & Shinto don't particularly have the concept of "pure evil" the way the Abrahamic faiths do. The terrifying beings who punish the wicked in the afterlife are just doing a job and might even be described as on the side of good.
>>124617034
I never bothered going past the first episode because it made Maou look like a complete idiot with the added gags. I skimmed over the first chapter of the LN and there wasn't any dumb daiki joke.
>>124617092
>2015
>Breaking the 3 episode rule
>>124617164
If the first episode is a worse version of something I've already read in other mediums, why would I expect it to get better?
Fuck off mate, it had a great plot.
Anime was so bad that some people and scanlators dropped the manga too.
>>124617056
That actually makes a lot of sense. Thanks anon.
>>124616411
This is neither new nor specific to anime or Japan.
People have been making Heaven/Angels villains and Hell/Devils heroes for so long that at this point it's more surprising if someone goes for the conventional roles.
>>124617056
It actually doesn't make any sense in the western "mithology". If someone is a sinner, then why would god hand over that soul to the evil side, essentially making it stronger? Also why would the evil beings torture the other evil beings? Do they have a contract with heaven or what?
>>124617288
>Get into the series for this PLOT
>It's the only chapter where there is actual fanservice
Still mad.
![anime_shrug[2].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/EP1mx9X.jpg "anime_shrug[2].jpg")
>>124617562
Extremely off topic butin orthodox (with a small o, not with a big O per se) Christian doctrine Gehenna is pretty much isolation from God. You reject God and God rejects you in turn. This is considered painful and humiliating, and thus described as being like fire, and like the gnashing of teeth. Medieval depictions often dropped the "like the gnashing of teeth" part and turned it into a fiery place where demons poke you.
>>124617326
Was it that bad? I never read the manga (beyond the anime. and it wasn't that different) but i enjoyed it and lear a few things about economics
>>124616411
By todays standards, most people wouldn't count classical demons as evil either, considering that the evil thing they did is daring to go against the church or even tell others that they don't need to follow the their teachings.
>>124617562
>mithology
>>124619092
And depending on your sources, demons are active agents of God that exist to better mankind by allowing it to overcome temptation. Remember, "Satan" literally just means "adversary."
I came to this thread for my favourite se- er, demon lord. God she is cute.
>>124617587
>>124617326
But the anime wasn't bad at all.
>>124616694
there are plenty of examples in western media but discussing examples belongs in /co/ so i wont mention any
S2 never, why even live?
>>124619672
You still have the manga.
>>124619558
It wasn't bad, i'm just saying that i was kind of tricked into watch it for tits and she never put them in my face again.
She's my favorite demon girl too.
God is a shy girl.
>>124619820
True, I've been tricked into series by PLOT quite a few times as well, and this is one of the few cases where it really got better instead of the same, or worse. But then again, I'm really a sucker for cute romance. And economics.
>>124619782
> Like 4 different mangas
> Seems that every one take another path
What should i pick that follows the LN?
The idea of a sentient, intelligent race of creatures being intrinsically devoted to a particular philosophy is pretty passé regardless whether it's in the east or the west.
>>124620154
The one by Ishida.
>>124620154
Only one of them has scanlations, the one by Ishida.
>>124620113
I would do retarded things to those titties.
>>124616694
>Can't think of anywhere where demons are good
Really?
Hellboy
Ghostrider
Several things in Constantine
Spawn
Sort of in Pan's Labyrinth
One thirteenth of the stuff in Doctor Who
Anything considered creepy or supernatural in the Discworld series.
Even if it is Japanese, SHADOW THE HEDGEHOG OF ALL THINGS does it.
It's not an original concept.
Besides, there's very little that can be considered pure evil in Buddhism or Shinto. Spirits redeem themselves, gods have fits of rage over stupid shit and murder fellow gods, monsters beg passerbys to kill them etc.
>>124616411
Well they don't think they did anything wrong during ww2. So that just goes to show you their mind set.
>>124620273
Is the one by Touno Mamare any good that you know?
>>124620348
Yep, same here. I'ddrown myself in them and die happy.
>>124619558
Maou is cute indeed. She's soft and hugable, sweet, intelligent, learned, wise and kind. A perfect leader and a perfect woman. Heruseless fleshhelps too.
>>124620534
>>124620273
Nevermind my brainfart there, that is the actual Ishida one. Downloading now.
>>124619558
It was an actual good show it was just that shit type cliffhanger ending it had that made it bad in my opinion
>>124620773
Yeah the cliffhanger was bad, especially with no second season in sight. Apparently the manga's beyond that so you could read up on it. I know I will.
but she is my favorite of the demon lords
>>124620877
Im reading the LN anon I will also check the Manga out since you recommended it
>>124616694
>what is european mythology and folklore
>>124621290
Head maid is a qt, but I bet she's just jelly.
>>124621290
Nothing to be ashamed of anon
>>124616807
>just look at the bible for starters
Not sure if bait.
Your middle eastern fantasy novel about a jewish zombie wizard descended from "god" is about as western as the qu'ran. He was just a rebel to the authorities who had a better PR team than the other rebellious priests at the time.
>>124621290
>MFW this was code for "when are you two goinnna fuck?"
>>124616694
And what about Devil May Cry ?
>>124621464
In at least one of the Mangas they explicitly have sex.
I wonder how strong the rivalry between these two are I don't stick to the fandom enough to know about it
>>124621595
Dat hill ending.
I almost got tears all over my boner.
>>124619092
>>124619390
>>124616411
Devils are the actual evil spirit.
Demons are servants, more neutral if anything.
>>124620773
>>124620877
That's the point of anime. Unless the BD sales are great it's supposed to make you feel blueballed so that LN/manga sales go up.
>>124621705
There isn't any actual rivalry, just dumb arguments that come up due to people equating them as the same thing just because both mention economics.
>>124621705
One of them trades in wheat, the other in potatoes. Considering the superiority of potatoes as a staple food, Maou has the potential to put Horo out of business. And she probably will, in the name of peace.
I like that MMY is a Dragon Quest game that goes off the rails when the Hero goes to fight the Final Boss.
>>124622547
Well Hero is based off the MC of Dragon Quest.
Dunno if it was DQ3...
>>124622335
Until the inevitable great potato famine occurs.
>>124622599
Yeah, and the "joining the Demon King" premise is a play on an option you get at the end of DQ1 to join the Dragonlord. Can't remember if the "half of the world" offer is a DQ thing though.
Pudgy demon is best demon
>>124622801
Cute, but canonically she has a flat tummy. Either that, or she has one hell of a corset.
>>124622801
I could agree more anon
>>124622850
couldn't please exuse that typo
here is more demon king to compensate
>>124617056
Right, they're using some Western demon imagery because it's foreign and therefore cool and sexy, but they're basically ignoring everything but the surface details. Demons as malevolent embodiments of spiritual evil? Completely out the window.
Instead they get recast more like oni or the other familiar Japanese folk tale creatures: a tribe of magic creatures who can sometimes be dangerous and sometimes be helpful. They're a lot close to faeries or giants in European folk tales than anything with religious meaning.
>>124622653
That wouldn't happen if multiple forms of potato were grown. The severity of the famine in Ireland was the result of economic issues brought on by the British rulers that forced the Irish to be dependent on a single strain of potato.
>>124623079
Conversely, western media just randomly insert cool Eastern imagery (shaolin monks doing crazy kung fu, yin yang symbols everywhere) without even touching upon the deeper meaning.
I guess both the West and the East do the same thing: borrow the surface of eachothers cultural icons without (always) digging for the deeper meaning.
>>124616694
Oh! Oh! I can answer this one!
Legend has it, that the Pope Sylvester II was helped in attaining that title by a succubus named Meridiana. But, since good ol' Pope Sylvester II fought against symony, broke down the blatant extortion in the name of religion, and fostered sciences and literature, the common folk assumed that Meridiana was quite the nice gal after all,
>>124623578
>Pope Sylvester II
But wasn't he the guy who summoned demons just to test whether or not he could resist them? Meridiana was a cunt, Pope Sylvester II just told her to get back to hell and make Satan a sandwich.
>>124623678
Really? The way I heard it, Meridiana was supposed to actually be good
>>124623421
Yeah, everyone does that. You borrow just enough to feel foreign, because foreign is exotic and exotic is cool, while keeping the substance familiar enough that your audience doesn't actually feel unsettled.
You want me to dig out some links to Mongolian rappers? They don't know a damned thing about the roots of the genre, but they know it sounds good and want to do that too. It's not new either, people have always done this sort of thing.
I was thinking of asking this question for the longest but since this is the latest maoyuu mao yuusha thread I've seen in a while now I have the chance to ask it. What is you guy's opinion on the demon king should she be revered as a seamen demon or the goddess type treatment ???
>>124623880
Yeah, just kidding. Sylverster did summon demons to test his purity IIRC, but there was also a folklore legend about Meridiana the kindhearted succubus aiding him.
>>124624257
She certainly isn't a semen demon. She's too cute, to pure and too kind for that. She's the kind of girl you want to sneak up on and surprise with a kiss while she's staying up way too late doing paperwork.
>>124624257
Seamen demon goddess.
>Hey, let's write a story about Demons being good
>Yeah, the real bad ones were the angels
>It's kinda like how Zeon is good and the Feddies are bad
>and kinda like how Japan was good and the US was bad...
That's why.
>>124616411
>The church is actually the bad guy
really... really??
>>124624551
A real Murrican hero right here guys
>>124624551
Zeon is never good though. They're always run by crazy loons and lose. Shit, even the guy who the nation was named after is a loon in Yas' eyes.
>>124624632
>implying I'm a seppo
>implying the rightist otakus don't see it that way
>>124624661
Zeon is misunderstood, and Feddie propaganda is strong.
As a fellow Satanist. I am ok with this.
I am more of a good guy than most people, i promise
>>124624620
Well if it's corrupt, it can be.
>>124624620
>>124624740
But you'll notice the emperor is never, ever, parodied or treated in the same way.
>>124624353
Yeah I was actually leaning more on the goddess type treatment since she isn't edgy as most female demon type characters and she is a qt that and the fact that the plot is just an amazing thing to see
>>124621438
I agree head maid might be jelly
>>124623079
I don't even see that much of "Western demon imagery" that got used by Japanese unless it's taken out of RPGs, which usually go back to the Western D&D that already changed their demons a lot compared to the classical sources. Can't really blame the Japanese for changing the classics when they only copied modern fantasy stuff to begin with.
>>124624827
The emperor is rarely shown at all.
>>124624661
Confirmed for not paying attention during 0078. The people at the top of Zeon are crazy, but the ground level troops are shown to be regular guys and some were even compassionate to air-drop supplies for random civilians they spotted while searching for Amuro and WB.
>>124624257
She is most definitely a goddess. Butshe can be your semen demon if she loves you. And you love her back.
>>124624620
Of course, this is fucking Japan. The entire Final Fantasy title thrives on corrupt churches and deicide. Of course the Church is evil.
>>124624990
>>124624990
Exactly. It's a bad faction with some good people. The difference is that the Feds are regular corrupt politicians while Zeon has Space Hitler, a pink-haired pedophile, and Char.
>>124625029
But the church is evil too in real life, damm
I don´t get why westerners get upset by it this much
>>124625029
There was a corrupt church in one of those FF games I didn't play?
>>124625111
There is no evil. There is only conflict of interest. Except Islam, it is definitely evil.
>>124616807
>the bible
Every demon is banned from taking a physical body, every human communicating with any demon is to be put to death, and at the end every demon is thrown into the lake of fire.
There aren't any good guy demon's in the bible. They're fucking demons.
>>124625111
>people being told what they're doing is wrong or bad
>I don´t get why westerners get upset by it this much
>>124625203
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLhiWw3pzQk
in b4
>Game Theory
That's not the point, the point is the numerous installments of Final Fantasy that feature corrupt churches.
>>124616411
>>124625291
The catholic church is evil, get over it
>>124625352
Believing in god and following the church is very different
>>124620403
Well to be fair hellboy may do good but he'll be the reason for the end of days eventually.
>>124616411
But if you knows demons real names they are would serve you.
>>124625387
The closest thing you have is FFX, which has a not so nice religion (might call it a church)
The rest has nothing to do with a corrupt church, even your stupid video doesn't claim that.
There are so many JRPGs where the church is actually portrayed as an evil organization it's funny you try to pick out the FF series where there usually isn't a church worth mentioning at all.
>>124625562
>Believing in god and following the church is very different
I know and I agree with your whole post.
Though, it's not surprising to see people get people angry over being told they're wrong, especially if it's something they've been doing most of their life.
>>124620403
>SHADOW THE HEDGEHOG OF ALL THINGS does it
The fuck, there are demons in Sonic?
>>124616411
Well,i think evil in this series is actually metaphor of some tribes in the past like Mongol,Indian...(Even the"Grand clan conference,Kurultai" is a real thing from Mongol)
>>124625465
Hnnnng, I'm gonna look for an uncensored version of that before this thread becomes an all-out theocratic shit storm.
>>124616694
Malazan series. Daemons are just beings summoned from other worlds against their will.
>You will never raise a child together with a demon.
>>124620113
>useless meatI love it
>>124625562
Catholic church had done horrible things in the past and might have done terrible things these days. But I still have no idea why you call Catholic Church evil. What kind of standard are you using?
>>124617326
How abot this one
http://bato.to/comic/_/comics/maoyuu-maou-yuusha-be-mine-hero-i-refuse-r643
>>124625985
*about
>>124620113
Why was such a sweet girl cursed with so much useless meat?
>>124623079
>Instead they get recast more like oni or the other familiar Japanese folk tale creatures
Like Hades/any random pagan god of the dead being the devil?
Like Zeus being christian God Father?
Come on, you have no right to complain about this, it is an universal flaw. Barely anyone gets different mythological concepts right.
>>124625903
Dat denial.
>>124617562
Popular mythology =/= actual theology.
Satan never rules hell in the bible, he gets thrown into it after the Apocalypse. He never tortures sinners for a living, and the Satan in Revelation is oddly the only one opposing god (he was just another random angel before - the snake is not meant to be Satan). Note that Revelation was pretty much supposed to describe the fall of Rome and Nero to persecuted christians, some kind of "Hey, have hope!", with symbolism lost in time and translation. It most likely was never supposed to end up as an important writing of christian dogma (the bible once had two different Apocalypses, kinda going with the two different creations, and the Catholic Church at one point considred dropping both).
>>124616762
The MC being good doesn't make the race he is part of good.
...Unless there were Hellboy arcs that made it clear he was NORMAL by demon standards, this isn't a relevant example.
>>124621794
Says no one.
>>124626355
>had two different Apocalypses,
what was the other one?
>>124626170
I wasn't complaining, just stating a fact. I'm oldfag enough I remember the great ninja craze of the 80s. I know first hand how much everyone does it.
Creating stories that are completely new and unprecedented happens once a century or so, and tends to spawn an entirely new genre when it happens. Most of the time a good story is one part execution, one part putting existing pieces together in a new combination. Am I going to complain about all the sexy redheaded demon girls? My image folder says no.
>>124625465
Goddess M8
>>124625903
They're better than american baptists or mormons these days.
Goddamn the danbooru is filled with good MMY stuff.
>>124626355
I don't want to be overly pedantic, but really even the conception of Satan as being punished by God in hell largely stems from the Divine Comedy and not actual dogma originated by the church. There's an extremely large portion of Christian theology, especially relating to the afterlife and what powers if any oppose God and their nature, which isn't set out clearly in the bible and was largely formed through folk tradition among the laity as opposed to church decrees. For example, the Catholic church can't even make up its mind whether Limbo and Purgatory exist or not, and basically just says it's not something the church has an official position on, so think whatever you want. Also, what >>124617666 says about hell.
>>124626613
hey crabster
how was your day?
>>124626693
Good man, was king's day today. Played some Mass Effect. Not done much.
And you?
Why is the LN written like a stage play or a movie script? I just started V1.
And which is further along storywise, LN translations or manga translations?
>>124626885
Have you read an LN before? It varies, but some are very skewed towards dialogue and are basically a script that's begging to get turned into a manga or anime. That MMY started as something the author just posted on 2ch is probably a factor too.
>>124626885
I am pretty sure LN translations have gone further I got up to volume 4 chapter 1 any anon wishing to correct me please do LN translations only go as far as volume 4 chapter 4 and I really wish to finish this series
>>124626938
>That MMY started as something the author just posted on 2ch is probably a factor too.
seriously?
>>124627128
>Maoyū Maō Yūsha, also known as Maoyu, or Archenemy and Hero in English, is a Japanese light novel series by Mamare Touno that was initially posted in a play format on the textboard 2channel in 2009.
>>124626184
Anon had done terrible things in the past and might have done terrible things these days. Is anon evil?
>>124627190
yes
>>124626466
There's also the Book of Daniel, which is a piece of pre-Christian Jewish eschatology in the Old Testament.
>>124626580
>The "tsundere girl in front, guy in back" meme
>Maou isn't tsundere in the slightest
Why Maou is best girl!
>>124626184
You don't blame the religion. You blame the people.
