Guide (Start here):
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1G5C7fCe07CDzYalZYZObzxv_fhw7RUNsLHiMAY-t7FA/edit
Reading List (Add what you read here):
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0Agk2IH0ZXhn7dDNmSW1BVFU5dVgyOHkzWjU4b2l2dkE
Resources:
http://pastebin.com/w0gRFM0c
Previous thread:
https://archive.foolz.us/a/thread/111787674/
?????????????????????????
You can't learn Japanese.
>>111831791
???????????
How long would it take me if I started to learn japanese at a rate of an hour every two day?
Recommendations for grammar? Is Genki ok? I've read Tae Kim but I feel it skips over or has bad explanations for too much stuff. (Which I later looked up on TDoJG and it made perfect sense.)
Also, is there any good way of mining context along with words with Rikaisama?
>>111831892
I did that, and it took me 2-3 weeks to get basically all the basic hiragana down. Mind you, I'm a postgraduate programmer who also likes to read philosophy.
I just started diving into remembering the kana, but the author has all these weird names for each type of line like "dagger" and "boomerang" and i don't know anyone finds this useful.
My reccomendation, go to this site: http://www.yosida.com/en/hiragana.html
and click on the letters, it shows you with an animation how to learn the writing
>>111831892
How long until what? The learning doesn't stop until you die
>>111831928
I read genki, it's pretty good but it can be slow at times.
>>111831928
I think Genki should be read even if you've read Tae Kim already. They complement each other well
>>111831892
How long until what? There's a huge difference between being fluent, and just barely managing to read something with a text hooker. The former would take 5+ years, the latter maybe a few months.
>>111832013
I'm not still learning English.
>>111832077
>>111832013
Well until I can understand japanese enough to watch anime without subs and read manga.
>>111832265
You don't realize it but you are.
>>111832265
If anything, I seem to be getting worse. (Fucking typos, typos everywhere. And I misspell definitly every time.)
>>111831998
Thanks, I'm not sure if I will always have the motivation but it'd be really nice to be able to understand japanese and read it.
>>111832293
I don't count looking up a long word I don't know once a month and then forgetting it 10 minutes later because I'll never see it again "learning".
>>111832395
You have a long way to go. You need to know hiragana in its entirety, at least before you bother learning anything.
djt suggests knowing hiragana and katakana. I've got the basic hiragana down currently
Hi. I want to learn Japanese, but I really cannot be assed to learn all these characters, the hiragana and katagana and what else. Are there any manga or visual novels with romanji only?
>>111832669
Yes, there's a shitload. And they're even in English so you won't have to learn the language at all!
>>111832669
>Hi. I want to learn Japanese, but I don't want to learn it.
>>111832669
haha ha haha wo haru
>>111832669
>>111832669
>yknow, i wanna learn.. but nooo... nvm...
What's the name of that fixed up 2k deck? I'm trying to find it on ankiweb.
>>111832669
>Are there any manga or visual novels with romanji only?
You are gonna hate that. trust me.
>>111832420
Then you don't read enough (real books) or you are a scholar.
OP, you FUCKED up and forgot to add "DJT" and the number. Jesus. Why did no one else say anything? This is thread 787.
>>111833399
>A real book is something that has words you don't understand
Please, if your argument that you never stop learning something is correct then it can be applied to everything. That's one of Aristotle's 28 lines. It doesn't apply to everything, therefore it's not correct. Saying that learning a new word in your native language means you're still learning that language is utter stupidity. I've been taking showers all my life. If I figure out that the water feels better if I move the nozzle a tiny bit to the left, am I still learning how to take showers? If I figure out a way to breathe that helps me breathe in more air when my nose is stuffy, am I still learning how to fucking breathe after all this time alive? The answer is no, I know how to take a fucking shower and I know how to fucking breathe. Seeing something new, even LEARNING something new, doesn't mean you're still learning the entire fucking thing. If you want to say that it is then you're literally learning everything at every moment of your life until you die. It's fine if you want to think that, but then you've made it so general that it means literally nothing anymore, and in that sense you still aren't learning Japanese at that point anymore than you're learning how to breathe. The end. Period.
What is ????? Is this some made up dokidoki yuri word? It has something to do with the state of kaori's pajamas. Is she just saying new in english with ? in front?
??????????????????????????
I thought it was new because she asked if her pajamas were ??? earlier. This "word" doesn't exist in any dictionary. But this sentence makes me question that initial interpretation. She's saying they?are now different from "???”
>>111832289
Maybe 500 hours just to get listening comprehension down. To read Shounen comfortably, maybe 1000 hours, but that's just the basics.
>>111833846
heh, i've recently finished reading hanahira. don't worry it's dokidoki yuri word.
>>111833797
Not that guy but...
I guarantee that if you read poetry and literature you'll be stumped by grammar and meaning, not just vocab. Try reading John Donne for instance. You may get a superficial understanding but truly getting it all will be very difficult, and require more English knowledge than you currently have.
Being an English native isn't enough to have a mastery of the language. That is why English degrees exist.
>>111833846
What I got from that was o+new, yes.
>>111833984
>don't worry it's dokidoki yuri word.
It's not
>>111833846
It is ????
She's not saying they're different from new; she's saying new is different (like "makes all the difference")
>>111834106
but anon, bastardized cutesified japanese is dokidoki yuri word.
>>111834155
Why would she add ? to that? How does that change the meaning?
>>111834242
she considers the change *important*.
>>111834319
So ? can signify importance as well as honor? Thank you.
>>111834242
It's mostly convention for that word. It would less be recognizable in that usage (referring to clothes bought new) used without ?
>when I don't know what the definition word means in english either
>>111834457
What are you referring to? That's only happened to me once, and that was "environs".
>>111833985
Ok, I understand, let's move back to "you're still learning Japanese because you're still learning even your native language". What's the meaning of each of these? Unless there's some serious miscommunication between us, it means that because you might get confused with some grammar and not know some words in your native language, you're still learning your native language even today. It also means that even if you're fluent in Japanese, because you have to look up a word or grammar rule every once in awhile, you're still learning Japanese. That's such a meaningless thing to say though. It's pretty obvious that when people say "learning Japanese" they mean actively learning new vocab and grammar every day because they still aren't fluent enough to be able to be at the level where they're only looking up stuff about the same (give or take since it isn't their native language) as their native language. Saying "oh, well you're still learning the language every day until you die because you'll never know EVERYTHING" has a strong scent of elitism to it, almost like "you'll never get to stop, kid, take it from me". You're over-blowing the notion of "learning". Having to look something up at the same degree as your native language isn't hard or difficult or even note worthy. Saying that that's "learning" might be technically correct, but it's so vague and meaningless that there's really no reason why people should be saying it at all. If somebody hypothetically said to me "I know English", and they were a native, I wouldn't say, "yeah well actually you're still learning it". Because it's a meaningless thing to say.
>>111834534
How young are you? You never "finish" learning anything, really.
>>111834534
It's not only learning new grammar or vocab or what have you but also improving your skill. Usually when people say "you never stop learning" it's because you're always improving. Like, spend some time in Japan and you'll hear concise ways of expressing difficult things, and those techniques you can learn. For example using a legendary triple particle or something (???). I don't know.
Read Shakespeare. His English is far above anything you or I could write. His technique is unparalleled. Despite knowing all the grammar and all the vocab, you will never be as skilled as Shakespeare. That's what we're talking about.
>>111834457
Yeah, ive also learned quite a few new English words.
>>111834457
That's great, new english word for free.
>>111834646
>>111834737
And his point is that's a meaningless thing to say unless you want to sound like an ass.
Though I think in this case it's too hard to define the "point" where you stop having to explicitly learn it.
>>111834534
Just state the level of fluency you wish to achieve and maybe somebody will be kind enough to tell you.
>>111834457
I had that with eloquence
>>111834922
English is my second language and I can't believe people don't know words like this.
>>111834646
I'll ignore asking how young I am because I honestly see that as a bit of an ad hominem. You also missed the point of what I was trying to say: You can say that you'll be learning forever, but it's meaningless to say because of how vague and worthless it becomes when you pair it with a native still learning their language.
>>111835015
>I'll ignore asking how young I am because I honestly see that as a bit of an ad hominem.
Confirmed for underage.
>>111834737
>Read Shakespeare. His English is far above anything you or I could write
Actually, I can read Shakespeare fine enough to say that his iambic pentameter isn't nearly the best thing about his works, it's just something he decided to add as extra spice.
>>111835060
Ok, now you're just trolling. Sorry that I think asking somebody how old they are in an argument is an ad hominem.
>>111834914
>>111834914
>>111835015
Ad Hominem or not, my point is it's not a meaningless thing to say. It's just him showing his immaturity as a student, or someone inexperienced with serious academia.
Even with the english language, I can guarantee you that he probably introduces parenthetic expressions in a sentence incorrectly, at times.
Or perhaps he confuses the word aggravate with irritate, or forgets that a participal phrase at the beginning of a sentence must refer to the grammatical subject.
Really, I get that his point is that "oh it's just vague elitism that we *never realllllyyyy finish learning" learning.
And that attitude, is wrong.
>>111835015
>ad hominem
No, that is age shaming, better learn how to use fallacies before using them in counter-arguments.
>>111834990
What? It's not a common word at all, why would you expect people to know it? It's synonyms are way more common.
>synonyms: fluency, articulateness, >expressiveness, silver tongue, persuasiveness, >forcefulness, power, potency, effectiveness; >oratory, rhetoric
>>111834990
I don't judge anybody's vocabulary anymore because I don't know the following words in Japanese:
Thread
Dance
Crumble
Fart
Elbow
>>111835096
His iambic pentameter is just one facet of his brilliance. If that's what you choose to focus on perhaps you should try educating yourself.
>>111834990
You want a fucking medal?
>>111835155
>>111835212
He clearly took 101 classes and thinks he's an expert in every field.
>>111835165
>articulateness
I have never seen that word being used in my life.
I'm not a native either and I think "eloquence" is a pretty standard word, and I learned my vocab playing computer games and reading porn.
I used to get the weirdest thing where people thought that I was trying to sound bigoted *on purpose* just because I used somewhat uncommon words. Does anyone have anything to say regarding that?
>>111835167
?
??
??
?
?
>>111835320
A lot of native speakers of english (british and americans) are poorly educated, and, not having learned the language to any special degree themselves, often do not know words that a foreigner might have picked up.
>>111835298
Yes please.
>>111835384
Too bad, suck my cock!
>>111835320
I do. Eloquence is a standard word in literature (books) and all that, very standard. I read it in elementary school / middle school books, and might have heard it on TV before then.
However, I NEVER hear anybody speak it. I guess you could say its the equivalent of chuunibyou. People just don't say stuff like eloquent unless they are being over dramatic.
>>111835155
It doesn't matter, the fact is he tried to point out what he thought my age was to win an argument. I don't care what it's called.
>>111835102
You have no idea what I mean, apparently. How can you honestly say that adding something new into the pool every once in awhile is the same as actively learning something? It isn't, trying to argue that is stupid. Are you saying that the amount of work you put in during your first year is the amount you'll put in even when you're fluent? The fact is that you won't be spending hours at that point. Yes, saying that you're still learning Japanese even after you're fluent, and saying that you're still learning English, is a meaningless thing to say. You can argue against that point all you want, but you'll never be right about it.
>>111835212
Holy fuck man, you're getting on my nerves. His words, grammar, etc., aren't what makes him a genius. Maybe you should actually read and understand some of his works, because it's the actual plot and story that make him a genius. End of story, I'm not arguing about Shakespeare here. Go make a thread on /lit/ any maybe I'll respond.
>>111835320
>somewhat uncommon words
For example?
>>111835373
Thank you, but it'll take more than a list like that to know the words. Otherwise I would just like out all of CorePLUS and know everything.
Unless you were proving your knowledge to yourself, in which case congratulations on being more knowledgable than me.
Can you tell me how shitty this attempt I made at Japanese is?
>????????????????????????????????????????
>????????……
>>111835373
????is better for fart
>>111835481
>because it's the actual plot and story that make him a genius.
Maybe YOU should actually read and understand his works. I lol'd at your post though, so nice job.
would people take their elegances and anemic centimeters to /lit/ please and stop killing the thread?
>>111835481
Except it isn't meaningless because you're still learning. Even when you're fluent. Sure the amount of effort you put in won't be as great. But that's how mastery works.
As you become better at something, it becomes easier to you, so you find challenges that are more suited to your skill (learning specialised subjects, for example, do you know how to translate many philosophical words into japanese?)
So once again, you're wrong
>>111835511
about 8 shits out of 10
>>111835455
Eloquence is eloquence. It's not used commonly because how often do you get a chance to use the word in the first place? It's not chuuni, there's no real alternative way to say it. fluency and articulateness are not really synonyms, there is no good replacement for the word, most people just substitute it with longer explanation of what makes someone eloquent because they never come across the word because they don't read and it's uncommon.
>>111835320
Non natives have the tendency of using rare words because of the reading materials. On the crazy world of Emily Bronte, bitch means female dog.
>>111835487
"iridescent" when talking about weird looking meat. People looked at me like I was a fucking alien even after I explained what it means. ("The thing where oil puddles have rainbows or change colors depending on how you look at them.")
>>111835567
?????
>>111835558
Last response you're getting from me, troll. Just responded to let you know that.
>>111835577
Ok, you're obviously not understanding anything about what I'm saying. I don't think you're even reading what I post.
>>111835511
shitty
Just a quick question on a particle
Do you pretty much always add ka (?) when you pose a question? What about their question mark? I mean I don't see it used very often.
>>111835665
I'm not trolling. Your eleventh-grade knowledge of Shakespeare compels me to laugh, which is very different from trolling.
???????????????????????????????
I don't really understand how ??? works here with ????????, I'm 99% sure it's not ???. Context is his sister just suddenly got up and hugged him.
>>111835703
>Do you pretty much always add ka (?) when you pose a question?
pretty much yes, if it's not obvious by context.
What about their question mark?
Japs don't like to use punctuation.
>>111835455
I kept getting comments on my eloquent speech when I was in elementary school. I stopped reading in middle school to waste my life on the Internet, though, so that doesn't happen anymore.
It's not chuunibyou to use a word you know that fits a situation, just socially unaware I guess.
>>111835819
? is the particle basically meaning "with"
I sometimes use uncommon synonyms for things for emphasis (e.g. sarcasm). Does that count as chuuni?
>>111835722
Ok, fine, you get one more chance. Why did the 5th Act of The Merchant of Venice exist when it was seemingly pointless? What's the meaning behind the title "Much Ado About Nothing"? List at least 3 comedy's that someone with an 11th grade knowledge of Shakespeare would think had a good ending but actually had an incredibly bad one, minus The Merchant of Venice since that was more of a problem play. If you can't answer these then I'm done even considering that you might be serious and not a troll. And no, I'm not answering for you. The fact that I even asked the question is proof enough that I know the answer.
>>111835928
No, that's more pretentious than anything.
>>111835819
It's ??. ? is particle.
>>111835960
These were the questions his teacher made him write an essay on when he was a babby
>>111835894
I kind of get it but, then again I don't really understand ?????, so basically he just felt really sentimental and then hugged her back?
I just bought a new laptop after having the same one for years. Why does the font in pic related look so pencil-y now? Maybe my old laptop had it wrong all this time and this is how it's supposed to look but it's really bothering me. Is there some sort of "setting" I can change somewhere?
>>111836024
Ok, thanks for confirming you're a troll for whoever sees it.
>>111835960
Why are you trying to prove your own knowledge by quizzing me? Are you trying to hide your ignorance by asking essay questions?
>>111836024
>>111836091
>jokes on him I was only pretending to be retarded
Now can you two fuck off to /lit/ and stop masturbating over glorious America-jin Shakespeare?
>>111836038
literally means "chest gets clogged". It's clearly a metaphor for an emotion. Either just go with the feel and guess, or look it up in a dictionary
>>111835960
Oh, yeah, and you revealed your own ignorance with a question like "What's the meaning behind the title "Much Ado About Nothing"?". I mean, c'mon dude, that requires precisely zero comprehension of Shakespeare and approximately 100 contemporary slang? Zero points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
>??????????????????????
???????????
>>111836220
??????? ???????? ??????????
>ITT: Plebeians babbling about Shakespeare
If you are going to argue about unrelated things, then do it over something that is not middle school literature-tier.
>>111836054
Looks normal to me, try Ctrl+0 to change zoom back to normal because that looks too big, otherwise try turning ClearType off (in Control Panel).
>>111836303
That's some ?????? man. Maybe if you add more ?s you'll become even more cool and smart.
oh you guys are fuckin energetic
>>111835703
? is fairly commonly not used. Tone of voice alone can make something a question, which is represented in text with a question mark.
Equally, they don't need to use question marks if something like ? indicates that it's a question anyway.
>>111836434
Are you flirting?
Is it just me or are ?-adjectives relatively uncommon? Most of the time it seems ?-adj nouns get used instead.
??????????????????????????????
What?
Sneaking in was fine but, I became tired right away and SOMETHING. No idea what ??????????????would be, other than the last being to do accidentally.
>>111836470
It's probably just simpler to use in common speech.
>>111836478
Did you try using a dictionary?
>>111836402
>??????????????????????????????????
>>111836478
It is a mistery.
>>111836478
>other than the last being to do accidentally.
Chau-form indicates unintentional/accidentally? I thought it meant "will happen in the future" or something of the sort. Like, "My X is becoming numb (in the future)"
>>111836478
?????? = falling asleep immediately
>>111836580
What fucking dictionary does Rikai-sama use, holy shit? On Chrome it does not show that, on Jisho it does not show that, nowhere does it show that but Rikaisama! Jesus, I have to have firefox open at all times now, just to use Rikaisama's engimatic dictionary.
>>111836693
>>111836580
please do not help the retards
>>111836591
It means things being done/completed. Which can be unintentional, if it's an uncontrollable action.
It usually corresponds to "have done/___" in english, but it can be in more than one tense. I guess it's kinda hard to explain, check out the explanation in TDoJG.
>>111836714
They pull the vast majority of their entries from EDICT. Also, you're embarassing yourself:
http://beta.jisho.org/search/%E3%81%B0%E3%81%9F%E3%82%93%E3%81%8D%E3%82%85%E3%83%BC
>>111836988
http://jisho.org/words?jap=%E3%81%B0%E3%81%9F%E3%82%93%E3%81%8D%E3%82%85%E3%83%BC&eng=&dict=edict
What kind of sound is ?????? I can't imagine that at all. Is there a reason for it to be written like that or is it just random "oh, a rolling peach must be ?????"?
>tfw you know the meaning of the kanji but not the kanji compounds
Oh fuck.
>>111837050
I guess the regular version has outdated dictionaries then. If you check WWWJDIC directly it's there.
What's the difference between ??????? and just ????
>>111836478
"Sneaking in was fine, but I became tired right away and unintentionally fell asleep in an instant."
>>111837175
??????? has ???? on it's front. It's like asking the difference between air and water.
>>111837126
I just bookmarked WWWJDIC, I'm surprised I hadn't already.
Hey DJT. Right now I'm trying to form sentences in Japanese, and I'm also posting on japanese imageboards but...
So far I'm trying to fix mistakes that give out redflags on how Japanese is not my mother language.
so far this is the sentence I was about to write
???????????????????XXX????????????????????
????????????????????????????????????????????
I'm trying to say that I have a friend that owns the online version of a game, and he's a big fan of the company who makes the game so he's also buying the offline version of said game. I'm also trying to say that they could make the online version offline through a patch/update, but since they want to sell the offline version too they most likely won't
From what I wrote, the main redflag would be the ??????????, which is just awkward, and I actually meant to use ??? (by the means of).
But besides that is there any other mistake that would scream "gaijin"?
>>111837332
>????
I just want you to know that this is phonetically equivalent to "butt love". Carry on.
>>111834457
I ran into ????? last night, weird choice of word given the rest of the conversation.
>>111837332
>I'm trying to fix mistakes that give out redflags on how Japanese is not my mother language
Why bother, would they eat you when they know that you're a gaijin?
>>111837332
I don't think it's that easy to sound like a non-gaijin.
Even if you type grammatically correct shit it probably won't be the same way a nip would say it. Just get over the fact that they'll find you out, post, and then see what they laugh at you for.
>>111837532
it isn't indeed, I just started lurking/posting. I'll get the hang of it with time I guess.
I hope someone can still help since this would work in polishing my grammar a little
>>111837097
Aren't compounds easier to learn than individual kanji? Usually you can derive the word from the meanings of each kanji (?? = much chance = probably), or the pronunciation of each kanji (??? = de / ki / ru).
I'm happy when I get a compound in Anki, especially if I already know the individual kanji, because it's kind of fun to try to figure it out.
I did it, woop, just wrote out all the basic hiragana and only forgot one: yo.
Now just to practice recognising the accented versions of them which are much easier, then katakana tiem
>>111837659
Why?
>>111837615
Who the fuck teaches ? as "chance"? The most common keyword is something like "part".
>>111836580
Does Rikaikun have a shortcut for extending the lookup length? I only get batan
>>111837717
I'm a beginner
>>111837738
http://jisho.org/kanji/details/%E5%88%86
It may not be usual, but I remember it better knowing that.
>>111837615
Some are yes, but many of the compounds have different meanings that is unrelated with kanji.
>>111837760
You're fucked. Either move to Firefox or get used to double checking with WWWJDIC/beta jisho.
>>111837760
>>111837833
Install gentoo.
But you could figure this one out: It's Batan + Kyuu. So like throwing yourself on the bed or falling down to the floor while yawning.
>>111837611
Which image board are you posting on out of curiosity?
>>111837611
???? sounds kinda weird.
>>111837812
In terms of meanings yes, but you can extrapolate if you know the readings of the kanji. Maybe not the first time you see the compound, but when you see it a few times it can be easier to remember (than individual kanji). At least that's how it is for me.
>>111837913
>falling down to the floor while yawning
Yeah man, it's like, totally obvious.
Is there anyone here that's taken N1? How fast should you do the reading questions?
Which premade anki decks should I download? Theres so fucking many...
>>111839022
There is only two worthwhile pre-made vocabulary decks, Core2k/6k optimized and Core10k optimized. The further optimized deck may be good too.
The "Jouyou" kanji deck is pretty good.
>>111839144
What's the optimize 2k? I'm already on the 4th 2k deck and want to know if it's worth the hassle of switching.
>>111839249
Probably not. It's the same as the normal 2k but presented in a much superior order that isn't random and awful. It would have been vastly preferable to begin with it but too late now.
>>111839144
I notice almost all the deck is suspended at the start, does the cards activate as you go along or do you have to do it manually?
And if I finish the core 2k/6k and want to move up, is it possible to do the 10k without starting over or having to screw with the deck?
Slowly reading Tae Kim's guide while adding his vocab to Anki. Any good tips on how to remember the different kanji and their kana parts?
>>111839770
Core2k/6k optimized contains the first 6k vocab. Core10k optimized contains 6001-10,000, so do not worry about starting over.
As for the suspended cards, I'm not sure what you're talking about. I downloaded Core2k/6k optimized and there's no such thing.
>>111839933
You know, we haven't really discussed how to learn kanji here at all. There have been no discussions on the subject. There are no resources available to you that could answer that question. It's a good thing you asked it here.
>>111834737
I've never thought about using a triple particle until you mentioned it, can that even work? I've never seen such a thing before. The only way I can imagine using something like that is, for example, ????????????????????????? assuming you're allowed to omit the verb after that ?.
>>111840264
You are far more advanced than me and I was making a half-joke. Shakespeare "did the impossible", changing grammar and inventing words, that's the idea I was going for. Changing the foundations of Japanese by introducing a triple particle or something ridiculous like that is an extremely skilled Japanese writer could do.
>>111840392
I wasn't the guy you were responding to by the way, just some guy you got curious.
>>111840517
I know.
What is the ??? doing here, exactly?
>>111840968
?????
>>111841055
God I'm bad at this.That didn't help much at all.
Watching Samurai movies and Non Non Biyori has made me fall in love with the Japanese countryside, which VN should I play?
>>111841312
Read Tae Kim? ?? is often short for ??. ????. If that doesn't help then you simply must read Tae Kim, or any grammar source.
>>111841355
Higurashi
>>111841361
I've read that part, I just don't see where ?? fits into it.
>>111841456
????????
not acting tough ?
??
good
??
??
What is there not to get?
>>111841548
How "good" fits into that. Wouldn't it read the same way without it?
>>111840968
"If I don't act though, it's fine isn't it."
fine == ??
>>111841675
Holy cow I'm autistic, that didn't even come to mind.
Thanks, anon.
>>111841597
It would make absolutely no sense without it. The the English equivalent would be like something "Not acting tough is, right?".
>>111840968
Not him but I thought ? was the question particle. So why is ? used? I'm still reading Tae Kim so my question maybe stupid and will be answered later on.
>>111841784
I realize that now, I was trying to match it up with the subtitles which was throwing me off.
This is why I need to start reading again.
>>111841890
Have you ever read anything before?
>>111841808
Never mind I'm a moron. Rikaisama answered it.
>>111841962
A little bit, no where near as much as I should.
If I have a jisho open I can usually wade my way through.
>>111839144
is this the Jouyou Kanji deck you were talking about?
https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/2629359396
>>111841808
Tone of voice makes it a question. (Presumably. And ? is a particle that tends to make things lean heavily towards questions anyway.)
>>111840968
>tsuyogaranakute
>Hey guys, romajii would be so easier lololol
i don't understand why ?? is sometimes used at the end of sentence. I know it is normally used for contradictions.
example:
>???????????????????
wouldn't this sentence work without it? What does it imply?
>>111842101
I've never understood the argument either.
![f6e5c14c84[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/mRMKNuG.png "f6e5c14c84[1].png")
>>111839946
>>111842142
It softens the statement, kind of
>>111842142
It is a contradiction. From lack of context, I can only guess it's trying to say "hey, *but* if go back now it'll be a bad idea.", in a "here's the problem with that plan" kind of way.
>>111842090
No, this one.
https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/4233113570
It has the kanji, it's meaning, and some other information. If you're gonna do RTK you should get a RTK deck, though I don't know of any.
>>111842369
thank you anon
>>111842331
>contradiction
Did you mean "contraction"?
>>111842309
>Vocabulary-Kanji/Furigana/Kana
Literally useless. You can just have the mixed one and have Anki display it the way you want...
>>111842142
It can be like adding "though" at the end of a sentence in English. Except the Japanese do it more.
>>111842101
Yeah I got it from Rikaisama. I still have a lot to learn. Like the use of ? to emphasize the sentence. I was stupid and should have used Rikaisama before asking. But thanks for helping me out. Hope I'll understand things like sentence ending soon.
>>111842419
I did not. In fact I was trying to emphasize it was a contradiction.
>>111842489
>In fact I was trying to emphasize it was a contradiction.
That's a bad idea considering it isn't
>http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/jn2/68969/m0u/%E3%81%91%E3%82%8C%E3%81%A9/
>???????????????????????????????????????????????????
>>111841355
Monobeno -happy end-, no joke.
>>111842724
I see it as a soft contradiction. You're hinting that you're disagreeing with the intent of the previous speaker.
How many hours of studying japanese did it take for you guys to be able to play jp vidya or read untranslated manga? I've been on the grind for a while and I need some hope
>>111843319
With a dictionary, several months; without a dictionary, I'll tell you when I get there.
>>111841415
Looks interesting, but how do I even get hold of the Japanese version?
>>111842857
Should I play the original game first? And why would it be a joke?
>>111843319
I'm still in grammar mode and I'll tell you that it's going to take a while. Since you will spend most of your time studying and breaking down vocab. Hell it will take a few minutes just to break down one sentence.
>>111843319
No hope here, only despair
>>111843469
I was gonna snidely say download it off Sukebei but the only torrent there has one seeder, so I dunno, bro.
>>111843469
>Should I play the original game first? And why would it be a joke?
No, afaik happy end is just a superset. And it could be a joke because it's an eroge about lolis.
>???????????????????????
???????????? is "Cum all you like!" but I'm a bit confused about the first part, can someone help me with it? It's something about seeing a being shown one's "cumming form" but that's as far as I get.
>>111843319
Oh... 7ish months? But that's with heavy use of a dictionary.
>?????????????????????????????
What is ?????? ???????
>>111843768
>one seeder
I don't see why that wouldn't work, but the only ones with seeders I can see are of the English version. Can you Link it?
>>111843898
Not him but how long until the grammar starts to stick. I'm only near the start but the grammar feels so weird and most of the time it's not sticking.
>>111843768
have you even played it by the way?
>>111844590
The problem with one seeder is that it indicates either a quality problem or a content problem.
http://sukebei.nyaa.se/?page=view&tid=6728
>>111844684
I read the English visual novel, not the Japanese.
>>111844683
It takes a bit but once you get it, you get it. I'm currently struggling with ? form in sentences like >>111844181 . But I used to struggle with the ? particle and now it's like breathing.
>>111843469
No, -happy end- just contains the original story and changes a few badly written parts and fixes the ends that pissed off a whole lot of people. I said no joke because many people believe Monobeno is a mindless lolige. It does have a lot of h-scenes, but most of them are optional.
The game does an extremely good job pulling off the rural Japanese atmosphere and it's got loads of shrines and youkai stuff which just added to the enjoyment for me. It's a really neat read all the way around, I hope you enjoy it as much as I did if you decide to pick it up.
>>111844695
or a social problem. like people leeching
>>111844917
If there's one thing I love about the Japanese it's that they all band together and seed their erotic porn games through hell and high water. I don't know why Higurashi is different, perhaps because it's a doujin game?
>>111844848
Everywhere I go (vng on /jp/, for instance) doesn't think Monobeno is mindless.
>>111844773
That's what I thought. I'm not at the ?-form yet. But I read the Tae Kim grammar guide and more times than not it goes over my head.
>>111834990
>people bitching at this guy because they read at a fifth grade level
before you fucking gorge yourself with nip shit maybe you should try some of the widely available and obviously superior western media you ineffably idiotic neanderthals.
>>111845027
Let me help you, by repeating what a lot of people here say.
Read raw Japanese text, and look up the grammar used. Preferably something that has a pre-existing translation. It helps a lot more than just reading Tae Kim over and over.
>>111844695
Says "Status Unknown" for me. I'll give it a try.
>>111844848
>>111842857
Lolis are never a joke. I'll make sure to try it. Do you know what -pure smile- is about? All I gather is that it's for Vita.
>>111845081
Ah so just see why it's translated in a certain way? Got a manga that has a really good translation to work on?
>>111845027
Don't just read it, get a premade anki deck with exercises for Tae Kim.
That's what i'm doing and i'm seeing an improvement in my grammar skills.
>>111845110
-More smile- are just bonus h-scenes for each character. I grabbed Natsuha's a month or two ago when I saw it uploaded and it doesn't really add anything to the story at all. Hope you have fun, you should be set on your "Japanese countryside" fetish for a month or two now assuming you read at a similar speed I did.
>>111845182
Yotsubato Reading Pack.
>>111845258
Well I'm building my vocab from Tae Kim. Every new vocab he list I add it. Sadly I'm having trouble remembering the kanji (both kana breakdown and definition) but I feel I'm slowly making it.
Is there a premade one for just grammar?
>>111845314
Thanks I'll look that up.
I'm sure a lot of people already have complained about this but holy fuck I sure wish DOJBG hadn't used romaji. It's really distracting.
>>111845508
Just be glad that the other two don't.
>>111845508
I should go and paint over the romaji with white rectangles. But then I'll just keep reading the furigana, argh.
>>111843855
"Since I'm letting you watch me cum, cum all you like"
>>111845936
I'll be glad when I get there. I need a Tae Kim supplement and Intermediate's too advance for that I imagine.
>>111846304
Don't think so, she's not cumming at all. She's just sucking him off.
>>111846132
I don't think it has furigana.
>>111844181
?? means something like "to the extent" or rather "to the extent possible"
????????? would then mean like "gathering to the extent possible"
Then ? is just the normal particle
What is the ?????? sound effect? I saw it in a hentai in some dialogue while a guy was fucking a girl.
?…????????…??????…??
>>111846650
>??????
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/je2/57829/m0u/
>>111846304
?????? is watching, not showing
>>111846724
So he's saying her vagina is... wriggling and coiling around him?
>>111846814
Japanese are weird, ???? describes shaking tits or something.
>>111846997
Actually, Japanese uses a lot of sound effects to indicate actions and what not, like with ??????? and "throbbing".
>>111846997
Most of these awful words are easier to remember if you try to find their origin. Usually they come from the repetition of another word.
For example, ?? [??] means to shake, which is quite similar to ????.
???? means thinly or slightly, which probably comes from ?? [???]
>>111834922
>>111834509
No offense, but I hope you guys aren't native speakers. I don't even read books and I know them. They're not particularly uncommon at all.
>>111847330
Dont fucking try to derail the thread
>>111847326
Easy to remember, yeah, but it's hell finding the definition in the first place. For "??????", none of the four dictionaries I reference had any entry.
>>111847330
would you fucking retards just stop already
>>111847388
B-B-BUT MUH SHEICKSPEAR
>>111847522
Before you troll, name fifteen of his plays that feature precisely eight female characters, one of which has to commit suicide in a river before the final act.
If you can't, you don't understand Shakespeare.
>>111847602
How about you don't.
Stop dragging the thread off topic, thanks.
>>111847602
>one of which has to commit suicide in a river before the final act
Remove the part about the river and that could be any Shakespeare play. Bitches be dying left right and centre in that shit.
>>111847047
Always was a fan of Akira Toriyama's ????. Where a woman rubs her breast in a guys face.
>>111847388
>>111847521
It's really pathetic to try and learn a new language when you are still struggle to make use of common vocabulary and basic grammar in the language you do speak. That's probably why so many people love TK. He's terrible at English too.
>>111847694
Is this your first DJT, anon?
>>111847497
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bouba/kiki_effect
>>111847784
I appreciate the link but I don't really think it will help me find definitions.
>>111847852
guess.jpg
>>111847852
More often than not, onomatopoeia is guessable. You're kind of amazing if you think ?????? describes falling icicles.
>>111847852
http://thejadednetwork.com/sfx/search/?keyword=%E3%81%AB%E3%82%85%E3%82%8B%E3%81%AB%E3%82%85%E3%82%8B&submitSearch=Search+SFX&x=
Site can bit a bit iffy sometimes however.
>>111847981
Forst most Japanese Sound effects like that I internalize some anime loli chanting them while singing. Nyuuru~ Nyuuru~ for instance. Therefore I can't very well get "slither/wriggle" from that. Actually, is slither/wriggle an accurate definition for ???????
>>111847755
>>111848154
don't respond to him
showing off your vocabulary skills on the internet is like showing off your breathing skills in the outdoors
